IN in EU or OUT from EU

[fergie_mac66]

The news today suggests that our economy would shrink by 6%. That would make the tax contribution required to cover NHS, education etc increase as a % per family
If the economy shrank one might ask what the economic migrants might do. Might they move on to somewhere more beneficial. ( I remember when a proportion of my labour force went to Germany when i had to lay them off due to lack of work & current migrants are more mobile.) If they did, would not our schools & NHS have a better chance of managing the reduced population. Hence the claimed increased contribution might not actually be needed.
Or is that wrong

Another point that has been made is that the EU does not want us to leave. If that is the case why did Dave have such a problem getting such a miserable outcome from his negotiations. So miserable in fact that the press has stopped telling us what they were - Perhaps everyone has forgotten. I am sure the EU will renege on them once we vote to stay - which we no doubt will. Then closer union will be forced on us. That will accelerate once Jeremy gets in.

Whilst i would like to see the back of the EU I would not like our departure to be seen as the cause of its collapse. Everyone in Europe would hate us-- Business as usual then !!!

The EU is going to collapse it is inevitable, It is why they are desperate to increase the number of members us staying in will lengthen the timescale of the collapse. It will collapse.The format has not worked properly ever, it has only survived on continuouse expansion both in terms of membership and/or terms of financial growth. The CAP has caused.problems from inception every thing from wine lakes, butter mountains,payments to not farm grow, not produce are plainly not sustainable when parts of the world are starving..

The longer the timescale of the collapse the bigger it will be. If we leave it may trigger a slow collapse, which will be better than the future collapse if it goes to its natural conclusion. If we leave, we will have a few, maybe a good few, years dropping back but longterm we will recover much earlier than if we are inside when the collapse occurs. Maybe we will in at the inception of the EU phoenix when the huge intermember tensions cause the inevitable.

 

[CAPTAIN FANTASTIC]

Fair enough, Turn the percentage, cash into practical items say cheese and milk between France and UK. The percentages between the two countries as opposed to the gdp between between UK and EU are meaningless. We buy a huge amount of their total export if trade were to stop French farmers would have the France to a stop in weeks they would be blockading ports. There would be pyres of dead cows in the doorway s of Brussels and strasburg, France would be burning nearly..what would happen here The framers would be praising to God and building up the national cow heard..Percentages and even cash means nothing. Uk house wife's would grumble at the increase in milk and cheese prices but they already know they are paying under the odds and in the shops if you listen to them them, they wouldn't mind paying more for milk and cheese, if it was helping the farmers as opposed to tesco and the EU. the fact that the farmers would be taking on labour would be a bonus.

Perhaps our farming industry should become more efficient and therefore more competitive instead; same for our steel and yachting manufacturing industries.

 

[chanelyacht]

The news today suggests that our economy would shrink by 6%.

No, the news reports a Treasury "study" on the subject. Well, that will be impartial

The same Treasury by the way that thought the ERM was a good idea, that we needed to join the Euro, and failed to see any of the economic crashes of recent years, and hasn't produced an accurate growth forecast for decades.

In short, it has no credibility.

 

[chanelyacht]

Perhaps our farming industry should become more efficient and therefore more competitive instead;

Lose the EU red tape and restrictions, and let farmers do the job. Then they wouldn't need subsidies.

 

[Bobc]

No, the news reports a Treasury "study" on the subject. Well, that will be impartial

The same Treasury by the way that thought the ERM was a good idea, that we needed to join the Euro, and failed to see any of the economic crashes of recent years, and hasn't produced an accurate growth forecast for decades.

In short, it has no credibility.

My thoughts exactly, and while we're on it, I wonder who's paid for this 200 page piece of propoganda (I mean research), ummm....oh yes, the taxpayer AGAIN.

 

[nickf]

Please, please, move this to the lounge .

 

[fergie_mac66]

Perhaps our farming industry should become more efficient and therefore more competitive instead; same for our steel and yachting manufacturing industries.

If I remember. It was a long time ago when the milk issue started.before the EU maybe even the EEC . It was the French inefficient farming methods that initiated the huge subsidies to the French farmers. Uk doesn't get the subsidies. So they cannot. Compete with subsidised milk. Our farmers were so efficient the CAP started paying the British farmers set aside (not to farm que huge UK farming job losses ) because the French riots about the butter mountains !.

The commission will not allow changes to the CAP because it will trigger the French farmers to start building guillotines! It's crippled the UK farming industry for 40 years and it will never change while we are in the EU.

Edit I forget what the wine lakes were about anybody remember

 

[Birdseye]

So it all comes down to money does it? If that is the case what value do you put on the right to self determination, to not be governed by the unelected faceless ones who you cannot get rid of?



That would include me then! I will vote out for the sake of my children and grand children.

Those advocating staying in stress the possible problems of an exit vote but one thing that never seems to be mentioned is what the future inside the EU will be like. There will be a EU army (navy & air force?), Britain will have to give up its seat at NATO to the EU (How will this give us more influence in the world?) The TTIP will allow foreign companies to sue governments if legislation reduces their profits. (How many billions would this have cost had it had applied when tobacco advertising were banned and all the anti smoking legislation introduced?) How many million immigrants will Britain be forced to take as their quota? Britain will have to share its nuclear weapons with the EU army.

The leave side need to start “project fear”. Staying in is far more frightening than leaving.

John

Posts like this really do make you wonder about the wisdom of universal suffrage

 

[fergie_mac66]

No, the news reports a Treasury "study" on the subject. Well, that will be impartial

The same Treasury by the way that thought the ERM was a good idea, that we needed to join the Euro, and failed to see any of the economic crashes of recent years, and hasn't produced an accurate growth forecast for decades.

In short, it has no credibility.

Too right they forecasted the deficit down by the end of the Last parliament and how much is the increase?the forecasts are garbage

 

[Birdseye]

No, the news reports a Treasury "study" on the subject. Well, that will be impartial

Would you / could you ever accept as impartial anything that recommended staying in the EU?

 

[fergie_mac66]

My thoughts exactly, and while we're on it, I wonder who's paid for this 200 page piece of propoganda (I mean research), ummm....oh yes, the taxpayer AGAIN.

Wait till the EU bubble bursts.,the world will be see a bigger crash than 2008

 

[CAPTAIN FANTASTIC]

Lose the EU red tape and restrictions, and let farmers do the job. Then they wouldn't need subsidies.

The National Farmer's Union just voted that it will be better for the Farming Industry and farmers as a whole to stay in the EU; do you know anything that they dont? Same thing applies for the Yachting Industry; just stick it out and get more efficient.

 

[Koeketiene]

Please, please, move this to the lounge .

+1 :encouragement:

 

[steve yates]

+1 :encouragement:

+10

 

[Seven Spades]

The National Farmer's Union just voted that it will be better for the Farming Industry and farmers as a whole to stay in the EU; do you know anything that they dont? Same thing applies for the Yachting Industry; just stick it out and get more efficient.

What first attracted you to the millionaire?

 

[Seven Spades]

There is no doubt more people equals a bigger economy which is why George plans to let in 3m more immigrants. The problem is GDP per head is going down which is why most people feel worse off. The other problem is with 3m more people arriving cultural differences will continue to grow, the immigrant population will hold the balance of power and worse of all they will need to concert over the greenbelt to accommodate that number of houses.

I vote out, we need to reduce the population so that we can start to move around the country more easily. Fewer people means cheaper houses, more gdp per head free parking and a higher quality of life. We are currently building the worse housing stock in the western world with the smallest dwelling space per person. We need to set minimum levels of square footage to improve the housing stock.. All properties should be a minimum of 70sqm.

 

[Daydream believer]

Please, please, move this to the lounge .

Why?
Just because you may like or dislike a subject does not mean others do not wish to discuss it
& here is where it has been placed - presumably to come to the notice of a wider audience
Some of us (86 posts & rising) are enjoying the banter & hearing others views
So i give your proposal a "minus 1"

 

[steve yates]

U

Why?
Just because you may like or dislike a subject does not mean others do not wish to discuss it
& here is where it has been placed - presumably to come to the notice of a wider audience
Some of us (86 posts & rising) are enjoying the banter & hearing others views
So i give your proposal a "minus 1"

Because it has nothing to do with boats or sailing? Tho the op did try and keep it there originally. ( and I'm as guilty too, sorry)
Maybe we should start threads on dog training? Or washing machines?
Even though I have taken part, I think it's in the wrong place.
I would go to the lounge for banter and arguments.

 

[Bobc]

Wait till the EU bubble bursts.,the world will be see a bigger crash than 2008

Which is exactly why we need to be out sooner rather than later.

 

[Niander]

They think they can forecast the economy up to 2030 and we'll believe it!....They take us for fools!