GT 35

[Habebty]

The GT35 looks like the boat Rampart would have built as the Sadler 340. I would have bought one. The GT35 is a bit out of my price range now but I am not surprised it sails well, as I have a 290 (with a chart table you can sit at-just by removing a small cushion, but I never use it )
The 290 when I bought it 10 years ago, was the the same price as a Bavaria 36, but the 290's sailing performance far outweighed the the need for that extra length.
I think some people will make the same value judgement for the GT35, but I am not sure how many will which is a shame. But then, it's not a mass market boat is it.
I hope in future, Stephen Jones performance orientated designs are made available to a larger (cheaper?) market, because they really do sail well.

 

[Twister_Ken]

Exactly!

…if Southerly couldn't keep a brand alive with forty odd years of heritage behind it, it does indicate what the market conditions are like out there.

Southerly is/was building for a relatively small niche in the global market - those prepared to pay a substantial premium for the variable draft function. GT is competing in a much more mainstream area. At its price point has to be good enough to win conquest sales off of - mainly - the Swedes.

 

[flawed_logic]

Got to be honest it's not the best looking boat I've seen, it does look a bit dated. I believe it's at the boatshow so worth a good look there.

 

[snooks]

Exactly!

FWIW i don't think its ill-informed comment more a realistic appraisal of the product, if Southerly couldn't keep a brand alive with forty odd years of heritage behind it, it does indicate what the market conditions are like out there.

GT could take a leaf out of Varianta' book and build a stripped-down version but based on the cost of the current spec i dont think there'd be much of a saving to be had, but you know i hope to be proved wrong.

Have you been on a Varianta? Was that with the bean bag seats or without?

Why build a stripped down version? You either want one and can afford one, or you can't.

The GT and the Rustler are a crafted boats, not something cut out by cmc machines with the minimal finish and knocked together in a few weeks. Do Aston Martin build stripped down cheaper models, do Rolex make a budget watch? No....Do you own an Aston Martin or Rolex, or any other expensive car and a watch costing a few grand? If not you're probably not going to buying a GT35 anytime soon.

The Rustler 37 take around 7,500 man hours to build, the GT35 probably takes a little less, so why undermine the value of their brands by not selling the best boats they can make?

 

[rogerball0]

Have you been on a Varianta? Was that with the bean bag seats or without?

Why build a stripped down version? You either want one and can afford one, or you can't.

The GT and the Rustler are a crafted boats, not something cut out by cmc machines with the minimal finish and knocked together in a few weeks. Do Aston Martin build stripped down cheaper models, do Rolex make a budget watch? No....Do you own an Aston Martin or Rolex, or any other expensive car and a watch costing a few grand? If not you're probably not going to buying a GT35 anytime soon.

The Rustler 37 take around 7,500 man hours to build, the GT35 probably takes a little less, so why undermine the value of their brands by not selling the best boats they can make?

Just thinking of other markets once the orders for this spec have dried up.............................................

 

[pvb]

The GT and the Rustler are a crafted boats, not something cut out by cmc machines with the minimal finish and knocked together in a few weeks.

Interesting point. But surely the reason they're hand crafted is that the builders can't afford the computerised milling machines which produce amazing accuracy with minimal human input? Most of the modern AWBs have woodwork which is given multiple coats of varnish, UV cured, in dust-free environments, giving rather more than the "minimal finish" you suggest.

 

[Habebty]

Interesting point. But surely the reason they're hand crafted is that the builders can't afford the computerised milling machines which produce amazing accuracy with minimal human input? Most of the modern AWBs have woodwork which is given multiple coats of varnish, UV cured, in dust-free environments, giving rather more than the "minimal finish" you suggest.

You are right to an extent, CNC machines are very accurate, but lack the ability to impart a certain warm organic quality I can't really describe. Some of the joinery on my boat is, how can I put it, not perfect and obviously handmade, bit at least I know it's not mdf or whatever. The varnishing is very good.
But more important to me, is the knowledge that the boat (although not a stripped out racing machine), will perform far better than any production boat and is an optimal blend of comfort and speed.

 

[pvb]

You are right to an extent, CNC machines are very accurate, but lack the ability to impart a certain warm organic quality I can't really describe. Some of the joinery on my boat is, how can I put it, not perfect and obviously handmade, bit at least I know it's not mdf or whatever. The varnishing is very good.
But more important to me, is the knowledge that the boat (although not a stripped out racing machine), will perform far better than any production boat and is an optimal blend of comfort and speed.

Which boat builders use MDF?

As for performance, some of the latest AWBs sail remarkably well.

 

[snooks]

Interesting point. But surely the reason they're hand crafted is that the builders can't afford the computerised milling machines which produce amazing accuracy with minimal human input? Most of the modern AWBs have woodwork which is given multiple coats of varnish, UV cured, in dust-free environments, giving rather more than the "minimal finish" you suggest.

May be I was a bit ambiguous - Many companies use CNC to cut out furniture, some use it a lot, others use it less, that wasn't the my point, it was the minimal finish applied, thin veneer edging strips, unfinished edges etc etc,

Some manufactures make it so the cabinetry is slotted together like big jigsaw pieces, others glue and screw it together on framework. One takes minutes, the other takes days. One squeaks, the other doesn't. You get what you pay for.

 

[snooks]

Just thinking of other markets once the orders for this spec have dried up.............................................

Why would they dry up?...Rustler are still selling the 36 which they started selling in 1985!

 

[Jamesuk]

"engineered and well designed modern yacht to take them to sea safely and comfortably".

I would not say sailing an Oyster 655 or HR 62 was comfortable in a force 6 to wind.

On a. 250ft motorboat motoring at 18knots to the Caribbean was a rolly affair which people got sea sick on.

I believe comfortable perhaps should only be used, when at anchor the saloon chairs found in HR's are comfortable the normal seats even found on Oyster's are not the sit back relax seats they are like the other 99% flat and uncomfortable that I have been on. I noted they have arm chairs in a layout B on the gt35 this is good

Anyway just picking at a minor point.

I hope the GT35 does well, sailing in a force 6 behind a row of islands in Croatia in flat waters would be a delight just like it is on an oyster. Out in open sea every boat is just as bad as the other because you push the boat at the speeds it can handle and those are the uncomfortable speeds.

 

[Tranona]

Why would they dry up?...Rustler are still selling the 36 which they started selling in 1985!

That is meaningless - around 2 a year for the last 10 years, and as I understand it, none this year. Just as Bristol listed their cars for sale right to the very end, but did not sell any.

You can't run a business on past glory, hence no doubt the reason for Rustlers trying to find a replacement for the 36 to get sales in the future. Only time will tell whether they have hit the sweet spot again.

 

[snooks]

That is meaningless - around 2 a year for the last 10 years, and as I understand it, none this year. Just as Bristol listed their cars for sale right to the very end, but did not sell any.

You can't run a business on past glory, hence no doubt the reason for Rustlers trying to find a replacement for the 36 to get sales in the future. Only time will tell whether they have hit the sweet spot again.

So may be in 30 years time orders for the GT will have dried up.

Rustler don't sell a lot of ANY boats, that's the point. They take a long time time to create, so knocking them out like Bavaria is never going to happen.

As I understand it Rustler are in a pretty sweet spot at the moment: hull no.2 of the 37 came out of the mould yesterday and they are laying the keel of hull no.3. I've seen plans for some of their future designs and they look good.

 

[JumbleDuck]

So may be in 30 years time orders for the GT will have dried up.

Have they actually sold any yet, other than one belonging to the owner of the company that builds them?

 

[JumbleDuck]

Interesting point. But surely the reason they're hand crafted is that the builders can't afford the computerised milling machines which produce amazing accuracy with minimal human input?

Spot on. There is a certain amount of fetishing of man-hours going on here. Skilled work is great when it's doing the finishing, but not when it's doing the basic construction because of tiny production numbers. A one-off 35' Bavaria might not cost quite as much as a GT35 (fewer light switches) but it would be heading in that direction.

 

[pvb]

Some manufactures make it so the cabinetry is slotted together like big jigsaw pieces, others glue and screw it together on framework. One takes minutes, the other takes days. One squeaks, the other doesn't. You get what you pay for.

One squeaks? I've recently sold my HR and bought a new Bavaria. The woodwork in the Bavaria is incredibly well put together, and there isn't a squeak to be heard. In contrast, the HR - although carefully hand-finished - used to creak and groan at sea.

 

[flawed_logic]

One squeaks? I've recently sold my HR and bought a new Bavaria. The woodwork in the Bavaria is incredibly well put together, and there isn't a squeak to be heard. In contrast, the HR - although carefully hand-finished - used to creak and groan at sea.

I don't buy the hand built thing either, precision machinery wins every time. Where I do take issue with certain production builders is the poor sailing ability due to things like incorrect weight distribution (water tanks aft or fore for example) poor deck equipment, poor sails, missing equipment like winches.
The new Bavaria 37 was pretty slated for it's sailing ability in YW, but otherwise a great interior and good value.

 

[pvb]

The new Bavaria 37 was pretty slated for it's sailing ability in YW, but otherwise a great interior and good value.

Was it? Hmmm. Seems fairly quick, stiff, stable and close-winded to me. It's the same Farr-designed hull as the previous Cruiser 36, which was generally praised for its sailing ability.

 

[FullCircle]

Interesting point. But surely the reason they're hand crafted is that the builders can't afford the computerised milling machines which produce amazing accuracy with minimal human input? Most of the modern AWBs have woodwork which is given multiple coats of varnish, UV cured, in dust-free environments, giving rather more than the "minimal finish" you suggest.

I made the assessment that my furniture was well made but cheaply finished in my Jeanneau. So I commisisioned cabinet makers to solid teak cap all cupboard and doors and any cappings in the cabin replaced. We had a new saloon table made with 1/16 teak veneer rather than the Jeanneau standard 1/32 and again solid cappings, good quality brass furniture.
We spent around £3k and it looks really good quality.
So, given that the sailing equipment was roughly on a par, I think we did what we wanted for very little money.

Having said that, we have replaced the cooker and had the galley remodelled too....

 

[Vara]

A reworked Sadler 290 sounds really interesting, having been aboard Habety...an immaculately presented and to my eyes well laid out boat. Don't know about it's sailing abilities but having sailed other Sadlers I suspect it won't be too shabby.

The price point would be critical.

I like chart tables, it's my space and serves as office as well as having some navigation function.