YM too easy?

[rhinorhino]

Is the RYA YM now too easy?
First, it doesn't require any real sailing ability. Ah MOB you say? Can be done under power. Sail trim - what's that?
Second, electronics, seems the RYA is a bit unsure here. I have seen examiners who would pass someone who didn't know what a GPS was and others who allow a candidate to use only electronics.
Third, can be done in your home waters.
How about making the exam take the form of a two/three day criuse in unfamilar waters, wind force at least 6 and exercises eg, engine failure, mob, electronics failure, rig failure etc to be simulated. Alright maybe not the wind.

 

[webcraft]

Interested to hear how you would simulate rig failure . . .

<font color=blue>Nick</font color=blue>
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.bluemoment.com>

</A>

 

[snowleopard]

every well-equipped boat carries bolt cutters ;-)

nm

 

[rhinorhino]

OK, not total rig failure but "jib furler jammed" or main halyard snapped" are not to difficult to simulate.

 

[Gunfleet]

I'd like to know how many exams would be cancelled through lack of a Force 6!

 

[hlb]

Never thought it should be about easy or hard. Your not passing A levels. Just a driving test.

Haydn

 

[rhinorhino]

A test that is too easy becomes valueless.
The failure rate on the driving test is a lot higher than the YM.
But I really like the snowman!

 

[hlb]

But dont forget. It's voluntary. If it was to difficult. Who the hell is going to bother.

Haydn

 

[Magic_Sailor]

I didn't find it easy - and needed to demonstrate the skills you mention - and more of course using traditional and modern techniques. It was very stressful but ultimately very satisfying and confidence boosting.

I did think however that people who did not demonstrate these skills should not have been passed. This devalues the efforts of others.

Magic

 

[claymore]

Is it not about

encouraging people to get up to a standard? If you make any volunatary test too difficult then people simply wont participate.

It isn't too difficult to pass the yachtmaster award it you have the experience required of the syllabus - which suggests that the RYA know the kind of levels of ability and or experience they are looking for in a yachtmaster. If people undertake it when they haven't logged the prerequisite hours they will almost certainly be found lacking and will not pass. That applies to all the coaching and personal proficiency awards that the RYA deliver.
Secondly - what value does it place on existing awards - does it negate them meaning that we all have to re- take your suggested 'harder' test and will that in time become viewed as too easy and so a harder test again is devised?
Perhaps you are talking of a different award altogether - a superyachtmaster for example? But who would need it?


regards
Claymore

 

[Chris_Robb]

Not to easy?

I agree with Claymore - if its too hard no-one will bother with it. I disagree that it is too easy. I don't believe that most examiniers are looking at your text book knowledge, more that they are looking at your general capability and aptitude. Lack of aptitude becomes apparent very quickly. The examiner is looking for the ability to make firm decisions - not vacilation and the ability to comunicate with his crew.

As for coastal and day skipper - normally everyone passes. I believe that is right - the important thing is that they have bothered to try to educate themselves. I wish more people would - perhaps the basic test SHOULD be compulsory.

 

[graham]

The examiners are all highly experienced people .They spend all day and half the night assesing peoples competence.

If the truth be known I would wager that they have a pretty good idea who will pass within an hour or two.

As for the GPS a few oral questions about cross track error ,mob,etc. and spend a minute putting in a waypoint would suffice.Lets be fair its all in the instructions.I think that quite rightly the majority of the test is on non electronic nav including simulated dense fog.

I was pleased to hear that questions on basic engine maintenance are coming up on exams.

I appreciate that a Yachtmaster should be able to sail out of trouble but If you cant change a filter ,bleed the system check oil etc you are statistically more likely to become a lifeboat rescue than if you cant do a running fix for example.

 

[Opinionated]

Dare I ask a question here? (Putting head above parapet on this BB seems pretty dangerous...)

Why do people aspire to the YM certificate?

I can understand why they might study the theoretical aspects, from coastal nav (included in YM) to celestial nav (not included), but to bother with the a ticket, which CONFIRMS your mastery of both the theory and practice, should only be for the following reasons:

1) You are going to hire out your services and require the YM/DOT certification to confirm your suitability to do so, examples are charter skippering, delivery and training others.

2) Some other regulatory reason, such as a requirement for a particular race (eg. ARC), which is a sort of extension of 1) - i.e. where you HAVE to have it.

I suspect, however, that there is a further reason, which is self-satisfaction and one-upmanship. The holder of a YM ticket always seems to consider that he knows better than any non-holder. I know of a number of occasions when I have felt like turming invisible when a friend of mine, YM for a year or two, starts 'instructing' other non-mutual friends, who have been sailing for all their life, with n000000 miles under their oilies, just because he knows they are not YM. (Other than this odious habit, he is a very nice guy).

Before you ask - I am one of the non-YM's and will remain so until my insurance company recognises it for a discount.

(I don't have to agree with YOUR opinions, but I'll defend your right to express them).

 

[MADFISH]

I took the YM shorebased course with my wife eight years ago. The impression I got then is that the instructor would not let you fail it unless you were completely clueless. If anyone failed a bit of the course they could simply do the same paper again after some more instruction. There were people who passed that course that I would not allow to navigate my boat to Cowes on a bright sunny day let alone offshore.

My intention was to gain the full YM but since then I lost faith in the RYA courses and attended the school of experiance....

 

[jimi]

All training is good!

I have'nt yet done my YM practical exam although I have the theory certificate. I have also done the RYA practical courses starting with competent crew then day skipper, followed by coastal skipper complete with coastal skipper exam. Why? Because its the only form of training I could get and sailing with a family I fully intend to be as safe as possible. I intend to do the YM exam after a further practical training course so that I will be forced to exercise skills that become atrophied through lack of use (dependence on electronic navaids) when sailing with the family.I'm sure you are right that a lot of people do YM for the kudos and once they've got it they think they know it all. I've met a few like that! Interestingly a charter co in the med have more accidents with YM charterers than non YM charterers.

 

[ccscott49]

Yes! Yachting Monthly is too easy! Anybody can buy it from almost any newsagent, should be kept under the counter like all the best magazines, reserved for us connosiers!!

 

[Chris_Robb]

cruelty

Wot ya gone an stuck a wheel on that poor ol' raindeer for
Opinionated sure named himself well!

 

[ccscott49]

Re: All training is good!

Oh! You! Back down yer hole! Thats enough of that, this is a family forum!!

 

[jimi]

Re: All training is good!

You talking tae me! I'm trying tae stuff yer new duvet doon yer lum!

 

[ccscott49]

Re: All training is good!

Ah bluidy need yun oot here aswell!!