What's your initial MOB procedure?

[Adios]

Try out your solution with a 100kg life-size dummy.

After doing that it makes fender recovery seem a pointless farce. Its no more testing than motoring up to a mooring buoy, in fact that's usually more challenging in a river current. Probably one of those things (like the jack stay up the side deck) that gives a false sense of security, making people think they have ticked the box, then when it comes to it its really not up to the job.

I guess 2 person sailing, unconscious MOB, its really only likely if you can launch a tender to get level with the casualty to attach them. Less agile person anyway. A fit person could dive in with 2 ropes and get back up the ladder.

 

[capnsensible]

Good point! Time to go shopping, Or rather, to make a copy as I have the facilitiess to do so. I reckon making the middle negatively bouyant might give you the best chance of getting it around someone:

Survivor - Man Overboard ( MOB ) Harness & Training Strop

That's very similar to a helicopter rescue strop. Great idea.

 

[Adios]

That's very similar to a helicopter rescue strop. Great idea.

To wear it all the time just in case? In hot climates these strops could catch on

 

[rogerthebodger]

Clearly there are several phases in the recovery of a MOB.including the following

1) Locate the MOB
The MOB could still be attached to the boat or they could have drifted away. Action needs to depend on where the MOB i
2) If the MOB has drifted away they ned to be located. This could be by some one watching or by the use of MOBi, AIS or other dvice
3) get back to the MOB or close local. A crash stop or circle the MOB are possibilities and call foe help DSC or EPIRB
4) get MOB in a position close to the boat and assess the condition of MOB. are they able to assist in the recovery
5) Attach the MOB ro recovery strop. I have a mooring hook perminatly attached to the boat that could be used to connect to his LJ or harness or lifting strop
6) lift the MOB back on board with equipment that is readly available. halyard or per rigged handy billy engine lift of even davits
7) once on board first aid need to be applied

 

[srm]

Having sailed, and run skippered charters and an RYA sailing school in waters of around 10C my safety briefing was short and to the point. "The sea is 10C do not fall in." No one ever did but prevention was the primary focus with harnesses issued to every member of the crew with tethers and jack stays. Inflatable bladders came quite a few years later, but from personal observation when testing them they were not reliable so prevention is still our primary concern.

Of course we practiced MOB drills, but the time to get a fender, never mind a body, out of the water underlined that falling in was likely to be terminal.

 

[jac]

Recovery of me is my main concern - I weigh 15 stone 5 naked. Wearing full wet weather weather gear, sodden with water - that must be pushing 20 stone. My wife says with with her foot on my head, even more.

If i go in, even with winches, a full harness / LJ with crotch straps and appropriate line / halyard then is she strong enough to winch me out??

 

[penberth3]

That's very similar to a helicopter rescue strop. Great idea.

It isn't a great idea at all. If you do manage to get that thing round an unconscious MOB (you won't) they will slip out of it as soon as you try to lift them.

 

[Adios]

Recovery of me is my main concern - I weigh 15 stone 5 naked. Wearing full wet weather weather gear, sodden with water - that must be pushing 20 stone. My wife says with with her foot on my head, even more.

If i go in, even with winches, a full harness / LJ with crotch straps and appropriate line / halyard then is she strong enough to winch me out??

Damn it man can't you use your arms and legs? I just converted from kilos and I'm 15.7. (Join me on my low carb diet, just started and seem to have lost 2kg in a few days.) But I don't feel weak, I'm still active at this weight and upper middle age. Mountain biking, dinghy sailing, spear fishing. SUPing. I can pull myself up a boarding ladder. There's a lot of fatalist talk on this thread, are you all disabled or just lost the will to live??

 

[penberth3]

Damn it man can't you use your arms and legs? I just converted from kilos and I'm 15.7. (Join me on my low carb diet, just started and seem to have lost 2kg in a few days.) But I don't feel weak, I'm still active at this weight and upper middle age. Mountain biking, dinghy sailing, spear fishing. SUPing. I can pull myself up a boarding ladder. There's a lot of fatalist talk on this thread, are you all disabled or just lost the will to live??

Hang on. The scenario is you've fallen in cold water, you're shocked, your clothing is water logged. Do you really think you can do anything to help yourself?

 

[Adios]

Hang on. The scenario is you've fallen in cold water, you're shocked, your clothing is water logged. Do you really think you can do anything to help yourself?

yes to a fair degree. OK I was exclaiming for effect but really most people who replied seem ready to curl up and die. I'll have to try some of this in the wild. Especially getting out of clothing after getting out of the lifejacket and using the LJ as a float to aid swimming. Or swimming in clothing using LJ as float. Being careful not to end up needing rescue while practicing. I know it would be a challenge. But pretty certain I can climb up a boarding ladder in wet clothes after a dunking.

 

[capnsensible]

It isn't a great idea at all. If you do manage to get that thing round an unconscious MOB (you won't) they will slip out of it as soon as you try to lift them.

I don't believe that. Have you tried it?

 

[srm]

yes to a fair degree. OK I was exclaiming for effect but really most people who replied seem ready to curl up and die. I'll have to try some of this in the wild. Especially getting out of clothing after getting out of the lifejacket and using the LJ as a float to aid swimming. Or swimming in clothing using LJ as float. Being careful not to end up needing rescue while practicing. I know it would be a challenge. But pretty certain I can climb up a boarding ladder in wet clothes after a dunking.

I suggest everyone who sails should take a sea survival course. This will soon validate or otherwise your assertions. Even in a heated pool wearing swim suit, boilersuit, and lifejacket getting the short distance in to a life raft is very difficult without assistance.
Perhaps if you have a scuba diver's boarding ladder you may make it to the deck, a typical yacht boarding ladder will probably be much more of a challenge in the conditions you suggest. Much depends on the sea temperature, sea conditions, and the type of protective clothing you are wearing, with a dry suit being the best bet for survival. There is a world of difference between climbing out after a cool dip on a fine day and being bashed around by waves and wind.

 

[Adios]

I suggest everyone who sails should take a sea survival course. This will soon validate or otherwise your assertions. Even in a heated pool wearing swim suit, boilersuit, and lifejacket getting the short distance in to a life raft is very difficult without assistance.
Perhaps if you have a scuba diver's boarding ladder you may make it to the deck, a typical yacht boarding ladder will probably be much more of a challenge in the conditions you suggest. Much depends on the sea temperature, sea conditions, and the type of protective clothing you are wearing, with a dry suit being the best bet for survival. There is a world of difference between climbing out after a cool dip on a fine day and being bashed around by waves and wind.

good idea but one thing occurs to me - when your life depends on it you have significantly more ability than when you're doing a course. I was in a situation when I was a youth and because I had to i scaled a wall like I was spiderman, pretty much instantly. No one believed I did, it was that ridiculous and there's no way I could have at a normal time. And we don't notice pain with the adrenaline, no muscle burn felt. The post about aussie MOB shouting shark wasn't far off a good idea.

 

[Baggywrinkle]

Copious amounts of swearing as I hit the MOB button and stop the boat ....

 

[jac]

good idea but one thing occurs to me - when your life depends on it you have significantly more ability than when you're doing a course. I was in a situation when I was a youth and because I had to i scaled a wall like I was spiderman, pretty much instantly. No one believed I did, it was that ridiculous and there's no way I could have at a normal time. And we don't notice pain with the adrenaline, no muscle burn felt. The post about aussie MOB shouting shark wasn't far off a good idea.

I did the Sea Survival course in a warm pool and i didn't bother with a base layer but did wear a mid layer. I am ( and was then) reasonably fit - late 40's then, early 50's now. Run, go to the gym. I struggled to climb the steps out of the pool, as did everyone else but could do it.

If you go overboard in summer, in light clothes and are not rendered unconscious and are picked up quickly in calm seas then climbing a stern ladder is pretty straightforward. Anything else and you are going to need help and relying on that boost from adrenaline i think is wishful thinking, especially if you were knocked out or it took a long time to get back to you and you are getting cold.

If the stern ladder is viable that rules out the spinnaker halyard as the lead would build up so much friction round the shrouds that i'm not sure a weaker person could do it. Our topping lift would work as it leads to a coachroof winch and is long enough - or two big strong blokes ( not that i sail with them often). Otherwise it's spinnaker halyard and recover midships.

SO personally i would rather plan for the likely / worst case scenario, that i can't get out by myself and then have a pleasant surprise than the other way round

 

[rogerthebodger]

Did a STCW cause with sea survival, Fire fighting and first Aid including flare usage. Found this very useful

Endure your life raft has an easy entry system

Also used to SCUBA dive so have to be able to get into a life raft or rubber duck dive boat. Diving in Oz we used to dive ladder to recover from the water so I designed my boat ladder with the same design and used it several times after diving under the boat for a scrub

 

[ds797]

To everyone saying "crash tack" or "immediately heave to".... this is a good plan, but what about if you're downwind sailing? What if the spinnaker or cruising chute is up?

Interested in different ideads/techniques..

 

[capnsensible]

To everyone saying "crash tack" or "immediately heave to".... this is a good plan, but what about if you're downwind sailing? What if the spinnaker or cruising chute is up?

Interested in different ideads/techniques..

You stop very quickly. Just get that boom in quicker.

Do you value your downwind sail more than the mob? Had this chat with a friend many tides ago. Passing Cowes with the spinnaker up on his Westerly Fulmar. We stopped dead. He was...Happy and sad. But I didn't rip the sail.

Have demonstrated loads of times with white sails downwind. Just get mainsheet hard in, don't worry about headsail. If you want to try it, start in lighter winds and build up.

Enjoy.

 

[jlavery]

You stop very quickly. Just get that boom in quicker.

Do you value your downwind sail more than the mob? Had this chat with a friend many tides ago. Passing Cowes with the spinnaker up on his Westerly Fulmar. We stopped dead. He was...Happy and sad. But I didn't rip the sail.

Have demonstrated loads of times with white sails downwind. Just get mainsheet hard in, don't worry about headsail. If you want to try it, start in lighter winds and build up.

Enjoy.

You have more to sort out, but are not going away from the MOB.

Caveat being on a big boat, when there's a danger of more injuries if you round up without sorting headsail/kite out. I was involved in a MOB racing at 0400 on an 84' maxi in 30+ kts. No way could we just crash stop, had to sort sails out 1st.

But if cruising on a "normal" sized boay, sailplan should be such that turning up into the wind is not dangerous.

When cruising with a poled out headsail, I conversationally discuss with crew that our MOB plan is still to head up and engine on, headsail furled etc.

By the way, this is a good argument for having the pole braced with downhaul, uphaul and afterguy separate from the sheet. This way, you can furl the headsail and the pole remains located and doesn't start swinging around.

 

[capnsensible]

Yeah, that's the way for sure to pole out a headsail. Takes some thought but far safer.

Understand that totally different techniques required for big racing boats. Must be easy to break things if careless making it worse.

For the average cruising yacht its good to practice these more difficult situations, working up to them. The confidence it gives to skippers in their own abilities is great to see grow.

Edit to add: giving a downwind mob with poled out headsail to YM candidates is a great confidence boost too. A couple of goes and everyone.....so far! .....has got it.