Wayfarer for a fat bloke

[ylop]

I think we should be clear we have absolutly no intention of racing. The intention is to poodle about when there is little wind.

plenty of people sailing small boats without racing so that will be easy to find something suitable. One thing to be aware of - the sweet spot of “when there is little wind”, rather than too much or none at all can be very frustrating - the width of that windows depends on the boat design, your skill/experience and where in the world you are.

If the wind got up the sails would come down on the engine would come on.

If you actually learn to sail, you’ll discover that’s not really the solution. An engine can be useful for when the wind disappears. It is an approach people seem to use on larger yachts - only bothering with sails when everything is perfect, by the time you are good enough at sailing to bring the sails down in conditions where you might be regretting going out, without getting in a total mess, you are probably good enough at getting back with the sails (albeit reefed) without needing to hang off the back getting an outboard into position or the prop coming out the water on every wave. Again a drascombe type boat where the outboard is in a well may be better for this.

The whole tipping over thing to be honest is totally putting us of or has already done so .

I think people just want you to understand the difference between typical small dinghies designed for performance and manoeuvrability on shore versus other boats which are more stable.

We just want a small sailing boat to give it a go. No cabin, No racing, small sail, Such a creature must exist somewhere

Theres loads of them. But small sail isn’t going to work in “ little wind” so you need to go and try some to work out what you actually want otherwise you’ll be buying the thing someone else wants rid of. But if you just want to give it a go - don’t rush out to buy one - many clubs running come and try sessions, and lots of training centres will have some sort of 1 day introduction stuff. But I think you both need to go and experience heeling on a small sailing vessel to decide if you like it. That aspect of “tipping over” is innevitable - it’s just the laws of physics, some people hate it even although there is no chance of that boat capsizing. What I’m pretty certain of, is regardless of which boat you buy, if you get no training and learn by YouTube/trial and error/books. You will spend a lot more time tipping over (even if not all the way) until you learn how to control the power in the sails etc.

 

[Bigplumbs]

Heck we are very rapidly going off this idea.

 

[st599]

I think we should be clear we have absolutly no intention of racing. The intention is to poodle about when there is little wind. If the wind got up the sails would come down on the engine would come on. The whole tipping over thing to be honest is totally putting us of or has already done so .

If the wind gets up, Wayfarers have the ability to reduce the size of the sail.

Any dinghy can capsize, that's why capsize recovery is part of the RYA courses. If you want a boat that's less likely to do it, you need a keelboat with a weighted keel.

 

[Binnacle]

There is little point in thinking that you are not, at some stage, going to capsize. It's part of sailing dinghies. Recovery from a capsize, whether just a 90 degree tip-over-and-fill-with-water, or the slightly more difficult full-180-degree-inversion, will be influenced by your fitness and agility, and that of your crew, plus the natural tendency to worrying about looking after a dog if you take one with you.

There really is no simple solution. Sailing well and sailing safely requires a skill set that has to be learned. It requires boat and weather awareness and knowledge that I suggest exceed the ability to launch a RIB and use the engine. You can learn it by going on courses, or joining a club as a beginner and then pottering on your own.

You might like to refer to the ROSPA pages on water safety.

Water safety - RoSPA

More than 400 drownings each year, though I think that includes swimming, diving and even car driving.

But, if you get it all together, there are few experiences which can exceed sailing.

 

[westernman]

A Wayfarer is big and stable as dinghies go.
For a big person who is not particularly agile, they are almost perfect.

They are not twitchy, so you have time to react. They go at a reasonable speed. They are well behaved and predictable (not the case for example for an Enterprise going dead down wind in moderate wind).

They are more spacious and much quicker than a GP 14 and only a little bit heavier.

When I was a kid we always loved sailing the Wayfarers. The GP14 much less so.

And they can be had in reasonable nick for a price which does not need taking out a second mortgage.
I guarantee after a season, you will not be taking the sails down when the wind pipes up! You will be out there thoroughly enjoying the sailing.

 

[westernman]

If the wind gets up, Wayfarers have the ability to reduce the size of the sail.

Any dinghy can capsize, that's why capsize recovery is part of the RYA courses. If you want a boat that's less likely to do it, you need a keelboat with a weighted keel.

Indeed. If you are that terrified of a capsize, a keel boat (with a proper sized keel) is the answer.

More expensive, much heavier, and a real hassle to launch and recover. You will be more limited in the places where you can launch and recover (for instance you won't be able to do that down a shingle beach as you could with a Wayfarer and some decent rubber tubes). You need to be well equipped with winches etc to be able to do that.

 

[Greg2]

My tuppence worth as a long-term motor boater who learned to sail dinghies as a kid and who also sails yachts and had a day-sailer (Norfolk Gypsy) for a year or two.

Listening to what the OP is saying and noting that he and his good lady have never sailed and are at a certain stage in life (the same stage as me) a dinghy (Wayfarer, GP14 etc) would not be a good idea and would likely put them off sailing for life. The risk of capsize is clearly a factor and no-one has mentioned the low boom on dinghies and the almost inevitable contact it will have with the heads of newbie sailors. To be honest I have no interest in sailing a dinghy now because I don’t want to be leaping around or capsizing and it seems to me that the OP is in the same place.

Something a bit heavier and more stable would be better and knowing his boating area, what he wants to do and noting that he has a swing mooring my suggestion would be to keep something on that and reduce the launching hassle to the beginning and end of the season. That makes a heavier boat an easier option. It doesn’t necessarily need to be a weighted keel boat - our Gypsy had a lift keel and there was very little if any risk of that capsizing and the same can be said of Shrimpers.

The issue is then finding the right boat and cost so the advice on doing some test sails is sound because it is only then that they will know if it is for them. As an illustration friends are long-term and capable motor boaters (crossed the N. sea several times etc) who sailed with us on holiday us and absolutely hated it.
.

 

[ylop]

There is little point in thinking that you are not, at some stage, going to capsize. It's part of sailing dinghies.

I think if BP doesn’t want that to be a potential outcome then you are correct a typical dinghy is not for him, even in moderate winds an inexperienced helm caught off guard or with a tangle rope could find themselves having an early bath. A small keel boat solves the issue - but he’s think day sailing so the style / design of many of the cheaper options might not appeal. But there are options like Drascombes where it becomes very unlikely rather than just a matter of time. I’ve capsized a drascombe once, totally intentionally as a test, and it was really really difficult to get it to capsize. He should be aware that Drascombe is a brand and there are multiple models - confusingly the company has gone bust and spin offs been created so most of the models have a “Devon …” equivalent - for the OP’s purposes they are interchangeable. I’ve always seen the appeal of plodding in a drascombe. In his shoes that’s probably the route I would go down - but they are not cheap. Attractions: Stable; ketch rigged so easy flexibility on “sail plan”; designed with an outboard well - so much better with a motor; furling jib (available on many wayfarers but not standard issue); simple to put masts up; more sensible for leaving on a mooring. Downsides: performance; upwind ability with no boom; heavy to move around on land / tow car requirements; Cost

None of the downsides sounds like they would put the OP off, except maybe Cost.

 

[ProDave]

if @Bigplumbs has been put off by the thought of capsizing a Wayfarer, then perhaps he should look again at a small cruiser or keel boat. Especially as there is mention he has a mooring available.

There is still plenty to learn, but the need to wear a wetsuit and expect to get the occasional swim is not something that generally goes with a small cruiser. And a nice dry cabin, even a small one on a small cruiser is very nice indeed.

 

[The Q]

May I recommend a Kinsman.
This is the lift keel version of the Yeoman.
20ft loa, heavy keel which you winch up and lock down
Highly unlikely to capsize, though if you try hard, you can get a knockdown, done that 3 times in racing over 25 years in a yeoman. Though that was racing with white tops on the water. It will self right with 6 inches of water in the bottom.
Easy to launch, two people can raise and lower the mast, I've done that many times on a Yeoman.
Sails like a big dinghy, just remember to sail the keel round not crash tack.
Cost £2000 old and tatty, £7500, full race condition with trailer.

 

[DownWest]

if @Bigplumbs has been put off by the thought of capsizing a Wayfarer, then perhaps he should look again at a small cruiser or keel boat. Especially as there is mention he has a mooring available.

There is still plenty to learn, but the need to wear a wetsuit and expect to get the occasional swim is not something that generally goes with a small cruiser. And a nice dry cabin, even a small one on a small cruiser is very nice indeed.

Quite, I am not too round, but getting a little creaky, so the lovely Oughtred open double ender (slightly tippy) is being replaced. The new one is a cat yawl, unstayed masts, so quick to get going off the slip. Designed at 15ft 4" My version is about 17ft. Decent cockpit, with a cabin for two, bit camping style, but space for the potty and cooking kit. Nearly half the weight is in the shallow keel, so no worries about capsizing. Still only about 500kg
On that, I have sailed since I could walk. First in 12ft very sharp dinghy, then a Cadet. I could launch that after primary school and sail the evenings on the Lee, but needed help to get her back on the slip.
I did capsize the 12 ft out of Falmouth, At 18 I completely misjudged the wind and set off with too much sail in a two hander,solo. Three times in a few minutes. Mostly because I was trying to get through moored boats which limited my options. The only capsize in 70 yrs of sailing...
Point being, If BP chooses a gentle boat, it doesn't take too much caution to keep upright and dry

 

[Mr Googler]

Come on…..the man says he has big plumbs

Get out on that trapeze!

 

[Hurricane]

These are far less likely to capsize.
In fact, I keep one on the Princess in the crews cabin - deflated until needed.



Take the ladies out and there is plenty of room for a fat git - I know.
I usually sit like that with both feet over the edge and a can of beer in my hand.

It will also take an outboard motor so you can use it as a tender as well.

 

[DownWest]

These are far less likely to capsize.
In fact, I keep one on the Princess in the crews cabin - deflated until needed.

View attachment 179123

Take the ladies out and there is plenty of room for a fat git - I know.
I usually sit like that with both feet over the edge and a can of beer in my hand.

It will also take an outboard motor so you can use it as a tender as well.

Oih! Thats not sailing, it's drifting with a hankerchief!

 

[Mr Googler]

What’s sailing, it's drifting with a hankerchief!

corrected that for ya…..no need for thanks

 

[DownWest]

corrected that for ya…..no need for thanks

Non coming...
And your avatar is like the new neighbours dog, that bit me the other day....

 

[Bigplumbs]

Come on…..the man says he has big plumbs

Get out on that trapeze!View attachment 179121

You need to understand the b

 

[Binnacle]

Go on, explain your little playground joke that you obviously want to keep to yourself.

 

[Mr Googler]

Non coming...
And your avatar is like the new neighbours dog, that bit me the other day....

My Husky would never bite someone…..if your anything else like a little bunny….youre toast.

my pug on the other hand will take on the world

 

[DownWest]

My Husky would never bite someone…..if your anything else like a little bunny….youre toast.

my pug on the other hand will take on the world

Small dogs do have delusions.