Lifting a MOB

[howardclark]

Thanks for all the comments. There’s a lot to consider but it’s also important to look at the set up for each boat.
As I said at the start our boat is ‘cut’ away at the quarters and the guardrails come off here. We have done a practice lifting a casualty off a pontoon, albeit with a sling, and his wife could comfortably lift him using our main sheet attached to the boom with the boom trained over the side using our traveller. So this will be our technique ( when we have more than 2 crew on board ) though we will need to make a short lanyard with a snap shackle to join the casualty to the main sheet.

 

[thinwater]

Thanks for all the comments. There’s a lot to consider but it’s also important to look at the set up for each boat.
As I said at the start our boat is ‘cut’ away at the quarters and the guardrails come off here. We have done a practice lifting a casualty off a pontoon, albeit with a sling, and his wife could comfortably lift him using our main sheet attached to the boom with the boom trained over the side using our traveller. So this will be our technique ( when we have more than 2 crew on board ) though we will need to make a short lanyard with a snap shackle to join the casualty to the main sheet.

I would suggest a carabiner (wire gate climbing-type) rather than a snap shackle:

• Snap shackles can open under load. They should NEVER be used for climbing or for hoisting people. Never.
• It can take two hands to close a snap shackle. Climbing carabiners are optimized for one-hand operation.

Something like this: wire gate carabiner

• Wire gate, because they are less prone to corrosion.
• Not locking.
  • There is very little chance of unlocking in this application. No slack.
  • Locking carabiners corrode and jam. That's worse.
  • Locking takes two hand in most cases.
• If you really want locking, try this and keep it greased. Very good. One-hand operation and reliable if greased annually. These are used on most sailing safety tethers, particularly after the Spinlock Race was shown to be unreliable. Kong Tango This is an excellent choice, just a little more $$. But I didn't want to appear demanding by offering only one choice.

But not a snap shackle. Imagine your casualty clawing at the lifting tackle and accidentally pulling the lanyard. Bad. And you really, really need a one-hand operation.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

All these technical/theoretical solutions need to be tried for real to discover how difficult/impossible they are.
I have been a volunteer MOB - a sobering experience.

Our club got a training day for it. The first hard task for an unleeashed MOB is actual getting a rope to them. Took us 10 minutes and in a bad sea they would possibly be dead by then.

I agree rolling them into a sail is kindest but it takes at least two crew to manage plus practice and if too slow the casualty will get severe hypothermia, and if they are unconscious one cant readily get them in it

If there is lasoo round them or lj harness with loop then that is fastest, but navigator was not strong enough to lift 18 stone wetsuited volunteer using either spinaker winch or boom, and boom lift failed to get casualty over the guard wire - not to mention rather overstressing the topping lift which was never installed as part of a crane system.

So we tried a six to one handy billy rigged part way up spinaker halliard and it worked fine if a bit bumpy over the rails. So much so we went and bought one which is now permanently rigged from a line to mast top.

Trying it is indeed frightening. I work on the principle that if I fall in I am dead, and we listened into a Mayday were only the helicopter arriving to assist prevented that result

 

[Graham_Wright]

Thanks for all the comments. There’s a lot to consider but it’s also important to look at the set up for each boat.
As I said at the start our boat is ‘cut’ away at the quarters and the guardrails come off here. We have done a practice lifting a casualty off a pontoon, albeit with a sling, and his wife could comfortably lift him using our main sheet attached to the boom with the boom trained over the side using our traveller. So this will be our technique ( when we have more than 2 crew on board ) though we will need to make a short lanyard with a snap shackle to join the casualty to the main sheet.

Don't forget to drop or furl the main!

 

[Graham_Wright]

All this is different if there is only one person left on board.
I cannot lift my other half into a dinghy on her back.
She can lift me using a two speed winch on the mast. Full y clothed and wet may be different.
I asked a lifeboat crew why they lifted on backs. Their response was that there is a better grip under the armpits as the lifted arms are trapped by the lifting arms and cannot slide upwards. That makes sense.

 

[thinwater]

All this is different if there is only one person left on board.
I cannot lift my other half into a dinghy on her back.
She can lift me using a two speed winch on the mast. Full y clothed and wet may be different.
I asked a lifeboat crew why they lifted on backs. Their response was that there is a better grip under the armpits as the lifted arms are trapped by the lifting arms and cannot slide upwards. That makes sense.

The same is true of harness and life jackets. pulled from the back they are much less likely to slide off over the head.

 

[Refueler]

Its easy to test ...

If its a nice day and you go for swim ...

You have the dinghy handy ... now swim up to the dinghy and hook your arms over with chest against gunwhale .... what happens to your legs ? They naturally fold and end up under the boat ... literally you are folded round the hull.
Now turn around to put your back to the dinghy. Now your legs tend to fold and away in front of you .. in fact you even start to float more level as they try to come toward surface ... assisting with any lift.

 

[boomerangben]

It strikes me that all life jackets need to have a means of providing an attachment point for some sort of carabiner/hook and thence handy billy/halyard. Our life jackets at work have a webbing loop that can be clipped into a hook for recovery of the casualty. It is built into the lifejacket and are presented between the inflated stoles. It should be fairly straight forward for a hook to be attached by someone lying on the deck (if freeboard allows). Just make sure the halyard goes outboard of the guard wires.

Hypothermic lifts with two strops, one under the arms and one under the knees is hard work for a Winchman in the water with the casualty. I would venture it would be extremely difficult if not impossible for someone to do it from the deck.

 

[Graham_Wright]

Its easy to test ...

If its a nice day and you go for swim ...

You have the dinghy handy ... now swim up to the dinghy and hook your arms over with chest against gunwhale .... what happens to your legs ? They naturally fold and end up under the boat ... literally you are folded round the hull.
Now turn around to put your back to the dinghy. Now your legs tend to fold and away in front of you .. in fact you even start to float more level as they try to come toward surface ... assisting with any lift.

I have experienced that but found, through practice, that one arm over the sponson will allow the leg to float up alongside.
When I was younger, I could paddle vigorously upwards but no longer!

 

[Refueler]

I have experienced that but found, through practice, that one arm over the sponson will allow the leg to float up alongside.
When I was younger, I could paddle vigorously upwards but no longer!

But that's the crux isn't it ... practice and knowing it happens and how to avoid.

 

[thinwater]

Boarding an inflatable (not injured).

When you were a kid/young adult you probably learned that you can get out of a swimming pool by letting yourself all the way down, head well underwater, and with the combined force of pulling down and a dolphin kick, land on your feet on the coping. Not your knee, straight to your feet. Quite easy, swimmers do it all the time. No ladder; that's for old ladies that don't know how to swim.

Into a dinghy, same thing. Grab the rope on the top of the tube. Extend all the way down into the water, head submerged, and then pull sharply upwards at the same time you give one good dolphin kick. Rotated on one palm at the same time and you easily land with your bum on the tube. Neat and dignified, little effort. I've done it many times in a row, when filming for a drysuit 8-hour in 32F water test. Yes, I had been in the water about 4 hours by then.

It is NOT hard. I can do it with full foulies on, no struggle. I'm 63. You just need to be comfortable in the water and move efficiently. In-water skills. Basic seamanship IMO.

 

[howardclark]

I would suggest a carabiner (wire gate climbing-type) rather than a snap shackle:

• Snap shackles can open under load. They should NEVER be used for climbing or for hoisting people. Never.
• It can take two hands to close a snap shackle. Climbing carabiners are optimized for one-hand operation.

Something like this: wire gate carabiner

• Wire gate, because they are less prone to corrosion.
• Not locking.
  • There is very little chance of unlocking in this application. No slack.
  • Locking carabiners corrode and jam. That's worse.
  • Locking takes two hand in most cases.
• If you really want locking, try this and keep it greased. Very good. One-hand operation and reliable if greased annually. These are used on most sailing safety tethers, particularly after the Spinlock Race was shown to be unreliable. Kong Tango This is an excellent choice, just a little more $$. But I didn't want to appear demanding by offering only one choice.

But not a snap shackle. Imagine your casualty clawing at the lifting tackle and accidentally pulling the lanyard. Bad. And you really, really need a one-hand operation.

Thanks - have ordered some