Wayfarer for a fat bloke

[ylop]

We generally just want to splash out a couple of grand or so to give it a go.

Whilst some people here believe you can learn to sail from a book, or perhaps real sailors just have an inbuilt natural connection to the wind, most people learn to sail on a course rather just by giving it a go. There’s a lot of funnny bits of string and ways to get yourself in a mess which if you just learn the basic “drill” or “process” are not only less frustrating but safer too. Capsize is the risk everyone talks about - but with no training being hit by the boom in an uncontrolled gybe might be the bigger risk (as a bonus not knowing what to do with the centreboard during the gybe will increase the risk of a swim too!).

I’m not trying put you off, if you enjoy learning you’ll love it. But my guess is that if after a 2 day PB2 course a newbie is ready to put a 16ff rib in the water and take it on a sensible day trip you will need more like 2 weeks training/learning to do the same trip in a dinghy unsupported.

 

[RunAgroundHard]

A couple of grand will get you a good condition Wayfarer. I paid £900 and it came with a nearly new combi trailer, ready to go, covers and spare parts.

 

[Paul HD]

Get yourself a Drascombe long boat cruiser. I know someone who has one for sale

 

[Bigplumbs]

Get yourself a Drascombe long boat cruiser. I know someone who has one for sale

Now that is nice. How many of the Kings gold coins does he want for that

 

[Paul HD]

£4500. comes with trailer, outboard, oars, 2 sets of sails, boarding ladder, cockpit tent

I had a Wayfarer, lovely boat but I am also fat and 6' 4 and found the Drascombe a much more comfortable boat to potter about in. I also found it easier to launch the boat and step the mast.

 

[ProDave]

Of course the decision between big dinghy and small cruiser is all about use. Dinghy = launch and recover for each use no mooring to find or pay for (but perhaps slipway fees depending where you are) . Cruiser = launch and recover infrequently and keep afloat on some kind of mooring.

I am not personally a fan of the Drascombe or similar boats, they always seem to command a higher price than any other similar sized small cruiser, but one big advantage they have is the masts are so easy to raise and lower, much more so than a Bermundan rigged mast on most other cruisers. And they are certainly popular, I think there are 4 in our little harbour.

 

[westernman]

The Wayfarer has a keel stepped mast which makes it easier to raise and lower than a deck stepped mast (such as on an Enterprise).

 

[Bigplumbs]

More and more info coming in all good

 

[benjenbav]

Of course the decision between big dinghy and small cruiser is all about use. Dinghy = launch and recover for each use no mooring to find or pay for (but perhaps slipway fees depending where you are) . Cruiser = launch and recover infrequently and keep afloat on some kind of mooring.

I am not personally a fan of the Drascombe or similar boats, they always seem to command a higher price than any other similar sized small cruiser, but one big advantage they have is the masts are so easy to raise and lower, much more so than a Bermundan rigged mast on most other cruisers. And they are certainly popular, I think there are 4 in our little harbour.

In my dinghy racing days I used not to be able to see the appeal of Drascombes, but as an older person I can appreciate the ease of raising and lowering the mast, the low rig producing much less of a risk of capsize. Plus I’ve got a soft spot for ketch rigs.

Just to get the capsize risk into proportion, I’d guess that there would be no significantly greater risk with a Drascombe Lugger than one of the ribs with which the OP is very familiar already. I might be wrong on that, of course. I often am wrong.

 

[westernman]

In my dinghy racing days I used not to be able to see the appeal of Drascombes, but as an older person I can appreciate the ease of raising and lowering the mast, the low rig producing much less of a risk of capsize. Plus I’ve got a soft spot for ketch rigs.

Just to get the capsize risk into proportion, I’d guess that there would be no significantly greater risk with a Drascombe Lugger than one of the ribs with which the OP is very familiar already. I might be wrong on that, of course. I often am wrong.

The capsize risk is real even if relatively unlikely.

You should have trained at least once righting a capsized boat for real with no outside assistance. Otherwise, if it does happen, you will be in panic mode.
If there is a possibility of the boat turning turtle (this seems to be the case with some Wayfarers depending on the placement of the buoyancy tanks), then know exactly how to deal we this. I.e. turn the boat to point towards the wind if it is strong, just a little off so you will get a bit of a help from the wind to bring the boat upright, but not too much to flip it over on top of you, flip the far jib sheet over the hull and free off the mainsheet, other jib sheet and spinaker sheets. Then you can stand on the deck lip and lean well back hanging onto the jib sheet. If the bow is pointing in the right direction it will come up easily, but the first 100 degrees will be slow. A 12 year old kid can do it. After some training.

 

[ylop]

The capsize risk is real even if relatively unlikely.

You should have trained at least once righting a capsized boat for real with no outside assistance. Otherwise, if it does happen, you will be in panic mode.
If there is a possibility of the boat turning turtle (this seems to be the case with some Wayfarers depending on the placement of the buoyancy tanks), then know exactly how to deal we this. I.e. turn the boat to point towards the wind if it is strong, just a little off so you will get a bit of a help from the wind to bring the boat upright, but not too much to flip it over on top of you, flip the far jib sheet over the hull and free off the mainsheet, other jib sheet and spinaker sheets. Then you can stand on the deck lip and lean well back hanging onto the jib sheet. If the bow is pointing in the right direction it will come up easily, but the first 100 degrees will be slow. A 12 year old kid can do it. After some training.

The risk of capsizing a wayfarer is real, the risk of capsizing a drascombe is much less likely but still possible. I think BenJenBavs attempt to quantify that risk as being similar to BPs small ribs (4.5m / 50HP ish) is probably about right. If you try you’ll manage it, otherwise it probably means something has gone very badly wrong with your weather forecasting or you’ve made a significant user error. That said, I think even a drascombe owner should learn how to correct the situation - but then so should small rib users.

 

[Bigplumbs]

Very interesting. I have been out in my 4.5 m rib with 60 hp outboard in some very big seas and have on many occasions gone totally airborne. I have never ever felt that the rib would capsize.

 

[j3tpropelled]

We have a Mk2 Wayfarer, kept on the beach on a launching trolley. Launching is easy (it's downhill), getting it back into place uphill in soft sand is more challenging but we can manage it with 2 adults and medium sized child.

I returned to sailing last year when my son did his RYA 1 & 2 with his school and the Wayfarer was high on the list of possible candidates for a family day boat, one came up locally with an existing parking spot on a much sought after council owned small dingy beach park on the Exe Estuary.

My background was dinghy sailing / racing (mainly as crew) in younger years but have spent many years in/on the water with various sports / hobbies (kite surfing etc.) and am very familiar with our local waters.

Whilst slightly younger in my late 40's, I'm certainly carrying a bit more weight than I should but I don't find getting in/out of the Wayfarer or moving around once in a problem, same goes for SWMBO.

We've only had a few outings whilst I get wife and son more experience and get them used to various manoeuvres and we're only going out within the Exe Estuary in benign conditions at present. The Wayfarer is plenty stable in that situation. At around 14 stone I can literally stand on the side deck without capsize. We will however be doing some capsize and recovery practice soon. One of the main issues with the Wayfarer is that if they fully flood, the water level inside can be higher than the top of the centreboard case which means you can't realistically bail them out at that point. We have a sail head pocket and inflatable float to help prevent turning turtle although I've not tested that yet!

I have a 3.3hp 2 stroke OB which is currently mounted directly on the transom, one of the next upgrades will be to fit an OB bracket to move it further aft. This does nothing for boat trim etc, but, it moves it further away from getting tangled in the mainsheet. I use an aft main with a ratchet block but no jammer/cleat. It also means I'm less likely to hit the prop with the rudder. I'm not concerned with the extra weight / boat trim as we're only pottering and cruising around, the main reason for having the OB is that the Exe Estuary has a very significant tidal flow against which I couldn't hope to paddle in certain places.

We have a cruising main with 2 reefing points, and a furling genoa on an Aeroluff spar that properly allowing reefing of the genoa, not just furling in or out.

The plan is to start venturing further afield this year in the Wayfarer, just bay hopping east or west once experience and confidence of skipper and crew increase.

I'm then hoping to move onto something larger next year, to be kept on a swinging mooring on the lower Exe Estuary. Hawk 20 (cabin version) tops the list although they go for strong money. Other possible candidates the likes of Leisure 23 etc.

Overall, I've been very pleased with the Wayfarer for our intended use. I undoubtedly overpaid for it (could have gotten better examples for the same or less money) but the fact it was a sitting tenant on a council run beach dinghy park which virtually never come available clinched it.

 

[westernman]

Very interesting. I have been out in my 4.5 m rib with 60 hp outboard in some very big seas and have on many occasions gone totally airborne. I have never ever felt that the rib would capsize.

You might feel different in something like this:-

 

[st599]

I've sailed on since I was in the Scouts - even when there's no wind you can roll to cause forwards power really easily. If you're worried about turtling, get a sail with sewn in bouyancy at the top.

A level 2 course would be a good idea - you do need to know how to right a capsize, but it should hardly ever happen in a Wayfarer. Just reef early.

 

[Hurricane]

I consider myself as a relative expert in this field.
I was sailing dinghies from the age of 3.
And progressed through the various classes to the Hurricane which is thoroughbred catamaran at the performance end.
I was even Commodore of a large UK sailing club.
The Wayfarer is a bit on the large size for what the OP is intending.
A good solid boat but he may get a better "bang for buck" with a smaller boat.
The GP14 has been mentioned but how about going even smaller and learning to sail in a Mirror dinghy.

Capsizing is also mentioned above.
Nothing special about capsizing a dinghy.
Many dinghy sailors capsize several times during a race - even in a catamaran.
Its is part of the fun of sailing.
Obviously, a capsize affects your performance when racing but if you don't push the boat to the extreme, you won't get the best from it.
That said, for cruising, capsizing should be avoided.
And a Wayfarer is probably not the best boat to sail after a capsize.
We used to use the old club Wayfarers as training boats wen instructing our rescue coxswains.
They are particularly unstable after a capsize.

You can have a lot of fun learning to sail and it makes you a better boat handler.
So many motorboaters don't have the experience that is gained from "messing about in dinghies".
All those years growing up with dinghies has given me an awareness to handle the bigger motor boats that I do these days.
My sailing racing experience (especially in organising racing events) has also given me that "spatial awareness" that I often see lacking in the motor boat world.

Just my three pennyworth.

BTW
This is my Hurricane - a very different boat to anything discussed above.
Huge fun to sail though.

 

[ylop]

Very interesting. I have been out in my 4.5 m rib with 60 hp outboard in some very big seas and have on many occasions gone totally airborne. I have never ever felt that the rib would capsize.

Well you won’t get a drascombe airborne but I think that supports what I was saying. I should perhaps say you (or others) may feel she’s about to capsize - I’ve been on 42ft yachts where someone was screening about the heel but it won’t actually unless you either want it to or get something very wrong.

One of the main issues with the Wayfarer is that if they fully flood, the water level inside can be higher than the top of the centreboard case which means you can't realistically bail them out at that point.

You can if you have a big enough bucket - ask me how I know! IIRC with the centreboard up the rate of ingress was slowest and a builders bucket and a worried crew could recover it.

The GP14 has been mentioned but how about going even smaller and learning to sail in a Mirror dinghy.

He’s worried about his agility for a wayfarer…. A mirror is a cruel thing to suggest to the man ;-)

Nothing special about capsizing a dinghy.
Many dinghy sailors capsize several times during a race - even in a catamaran.
Its is part of the fun of sailing.
Obviously, a capsize affects your performance when racing but if you don't push the boat to the extreme, you won't get the best from it.

But most dinghy races have safety cover around, and at the very least them by definition other dinghies around. A capsize when you are on your own is a very different prospect - especially for the inexperienced.

 

[Bigplumbs]

You might feel different in something like this:-

View attachment 179077

That a very small sib not the rib I was talking about

 

[Bigplumbs]

I think we should be clear we have absolutly no intention of racing. The intention is to poodle about when there is little wind. If the wind got up the sails would come down on the engine would come on. The whole tipping over thing to be honest is totally putting us of or has already done so .

We just want a small sailing boat to give it a go. No cabin, No racing, small sail, Such a creature must exist somewhere

 

[DownWest]

While the Wayfarer is a racing dinghy with cruising potential (Read Frank Dye) The Drascombes are def cruising boats and quite stable compared with dinghys. One plus, no boom to duck under (though it tends to reduce the efficiancy of the sail) Read Duxbury's 'Lugworm Chronicles' They sailed one round the Greek Islands, then back to UK, in vary varied conditions without capsizing. Couple of guys sailed UK to Australia in a Drascombe Lugger and Childes nearly managed a RTW in one. They are 18ft6in long and open, The Coaster pictured, is 21 and a bit.