Entirely green, landlocked, idiot; thinking of doing yachtmaster zero to hero

[newtothis]

Thats more true than the cliche about doing the thing you love and never having to work. Chances are most lovable things have people undercutting you for free as a hobby, all the ecology and conservation things thats true as well. Marine biologist, forget it. Sailing yachts, hmm yes that's not a surprise. Better to get a decent paying job that doesn't take up all your time so you can sail at your leisure, or be the one undercutting others with no stress.

Guilty as charged.
I've had a decent paying career that will soon wind down, allowing me to make up some sailing time. When that happens, I'll happily do a bit of free crewing for commercial delivery outfits because it will achieve my goal, which is not to make money, but to gain experience/learn stuff from clever people/have a good sail.
I realise that make me a pita to the hard working souls trying to make a living out of it, because why hire when you can get labour for free?
I don't want to do anyone out of a crust, but I know I will, from the comfort of a well-funded pension.
Still, I wish the OP all the best. It never ceases to amaze me the way people manage to get what they want out of sailing.

 

[davidej]

As a counterpoint; if you want to earn money doing water-related nonsense, apply for a cadetship and you'll be paid(badly) to learn how to drive ships. Once you get your 3rd Mate ticket you can help run the superyachts rather than just polish/varnish/paint/clean them.

I hope you meant run the superyachts rather than run them down.

 

[obmij]

Sounds like a great plan.

When I started out I was in my late teens / early twenties I had no cash but also no real expenses so doing deliveries interspersed with yardwork and seasonal stuff really worked for me

If I was starting out now then I would do a zero to hero without hesitation, and yes I agree winter is the best time to do it. Loads of fun.

Btw - sailing is fun but poorly paid. Superyacht work is well paid but..I dunno..but a bit servile perhaps? It's never really appealed to me.

There is a third way. A YM opens the doors to the world of small commercial vessels. Offshore tugs, multicats, offshore wind and the like. You need extra tickets on top but nothing too onerous. Right now there is a lot of work out there and some interesting projects. Drop me a pm if you want a chat.

 

[Sandy]

from Sheffield, and I've basically never sailed.

If Ellen MacArthur can do it so can you.

Good luck on your journey.

 

[mattonthesea]

In Antigua, late April, after the Race Week, 2011, there was an informal jobs market for boat deliveries. The STCW was a big thing, as was being a boat builder, engineer or chef. Some of the people I met sailing the circuit where specifically going to Antigua to get jobs.

 

[capnsensible]

 

[WannabePirate]

*not filling peoples screen up with that picture again*

That's it mate! I came off my demo sites, went to uni, and got jealous of all the gap year kids! Gotta catch up now!

 

[WannabePirate]

In Antigua, late April, after the Race Week, 2011, there was an informal jobs market for boat deliveries. The STCW was a big thing, as was being a boat builder, engineer or chef. Some of the people I met sailing the circuit where specifically going to Antigua to get jobs.

I presumed something like this may be the case, both ways of the crossing, at busy times of year.

I've not got free lodgings in Antigua, but a good friend lives right near all the marinas in Lisbon. Already told them I'm likely to be coming to live there looking for work

The course is designed for commercial endorsement from zero. So as well as the yachtmaster its also the STCW, and RYA Radar, diesel, PPR, SRR, and powerboat level 2. It's one of the minor reasons I picked UKSA, because wherever I see my sailing taking me I don't see how those courses wouldn't be useful to me.

For example. even if I end up solo-sailing a 26foot coastally, I'd better understand how I appear on other peoples radar; or, in the case of PPR, better understand why professionals view a situation a certain way.

 

[mjcoon]

View attachment 147648

You have reminded me that George Melly (who I once briefly met at a bar) called his autobiography "Rum, Bum and Concertina"...

 

[capnsensible]

I presumed something like this may be the case, both ways of the crossing, at busy times of year.

I've not got free lodgings in Antigua, but a good friend lives right near all the marinas in Lisbon. Already told them I'm likely to be coming to live there looking for work

The course is designed for commercial endorsement from zero. So as well as the yachtmaster its also the STCW, and RYA Radar, diesel, PPR, SRR, and powerboat level 2. It's one of the minor reasons I picked UKSA, because wherever I see my sailing taking me I don't see how those courses wouldn't be useful to me.

For example. even if I end up solo-sailing a 26foot coastally, I'd better understand how I appear on other peoples radar; or, in the case of PPR, better understand why professionals view a situation a certain way.

Many tides ago I worked a bit for UKSA prepping candidates for their Offshore exams. More recently, a good friend worked for them full time. I was always very impressed with the entire set up. Ten outa ten.

Hope you enjoy the training, they work you hard!

 

[srm]

When helping run Stromness Marina I came across a few of the "sail round Britain and became a Yachtmaster" courses. As an ex-YM Instructor and having run a charter business before the days of commercial endorsements and was at the time employed training MN deck officers I was not all that impressed by what I saw. Near enough half way around and one crew was learning how to throw a heaving line, while another yacht approached the brakewater showing lights for a fishing vessel not engaged in trawling only to turn into a trawler as it rounded the end of the breakwater, (obviously no one thought to look at what lights were actually being shown after throwing the switches), etc. etc.

However, times have changed and you have clearly thought through what you want to do and how to do it. As a package that covers the pre-sea safety courses and all the extras you need to obtain a YM commercial endorsement I would suggest you go for it, and I hope it works out well for you.

On the positive side a few years ago I met a lady who, when probably in her 30's and following the breakup of her marriage, went and did what you plan. While the younger males on the course tried to make fun of her she thought that being older gave her a better chance of being trusted to skipper a very expensive yacht. Which was how it turned out, she spent a number of years as skipper of a top of the range Oyster before buying a boat of her own to run commercially.

 

[jamie N]

For example. even if I end up solo-sailing a 26foot coastally,

Oi!!! That's me and what I do!!!!! ?

 

[WannabePirate]

Many tides ago I worked a bit for UKSA prepping candidates for their Offshore exams. More recently, a good friend worked for them full time. I was always very impressed with the entire set up. Ten outa ten.

Hope you enjoy the training, they work you hard!

Thanks for the vote! I have noticed several old forum posts from yourself stating as such reading around the forums under related searchwords. Most posts related to endless milebashing in terrible conditions.

When helping run Stromness Marina I came across a few of the "sail round Britain and became a Yachtmaster" courses. As an ex-YM Instructor and having run a charter business before the days of commercial endorsements and was at the time employed training MN deck officers I was not all that impressed by what I saw. Near enough half way around and one crew was learning how to throw a heaving line, while another yacht approached the brakewater showing lights for a fishing vessel not engaged in trawling only to turn into a trawler as it rounded the end of the breakwater, (obviously no one thought to look at what lights were actually being shown after throwing the switches), etc. etc.

However, times have changed...

To be honest, I expected to hear a few more of these stories. Zero-to-hero courses don't have a good reputation in many sports. Since I've been researching this (about a year now) its appeared to me the attitude in sailing seemed to warm to them around the mid 2000's. (Cue cptnsensible saying thats when he worked there )

As an aside, about the lighting. Did they have a tricolour on top with another motoring light or something below it? Maybe the cabin light? I've been reading my colregs and I'm trying to figure out what lights a sailing boat would have on to display those lights. Then I'm guessing the turn from viewing port to starboard made the change.

Oi!!! That's me and what I do!!!!! ?

And you're a better sailor than me for it

I just meant the qualifications would have little use. Nobody to skipper, unlikely professional work, and unlikely to be a radar!

 

[srm]

As an aside, about the lighting. Did they have a tricolour on top with another motoring light or something below it? Maybe the cabin light? I've been reading my colregs and I'm trying to figure out what lights a sailing boat would have on to display those lights. Then I'm guessing the turn from viewing port to starboard made the change.

Yes, right first time.

Sailing tricolour left on, then presumably when the engine was started the motoring lights: deck level port, stbd, and stern, plus mast mounted "steaming light" showing white over the same sector as the port and stbd lights. I just saw the red over white, then green over white, until they rounded the breakwater. From astern they would show two white, one at the top of the mast and one at deck level - not a recognised pattern.

From what I have seen its a common mistake, or it may be deliberate on the grounds that its best to show as many lights as possible. The other common error is motoring with only the tricolour on.

If I remember correctly RYA shorebased courses accept 70% as a pass for rule of the road. By comparison one rule of the road mistake in the MN or Fishing oral exam is an instant fail. A case of book the exam again when you are ready.

 

[Stemar]

To be honest, I expected to hear a few more of these stories. Zero-to-hero courses don't have a good reputation in many sports. Since I've been researching this (about a year now) its appeared to me the attitude in sailing seemed to warm to them around the mid 2000's.

I'm sure there are more horror stories around. And plenty more folk who've done them and understood that the course doesn't make them a hero, so they quietly get on with building on the knowledge and skills the course gave them to become the skilled sailor the marketing folk would have you believe you are as you disembark with that bit of paper in your hand.

 

[Never Grumble]

If I remember correctly RYA shorebased courses accept 70% as a pass for rule of the road. By comparison one rule of the road mistake in the MN or Fishing oral exam is an instant fail. A case of book the exam again when you are ready.

I remember the fear and dread of taking rule of the road tests in the RN. 70% would have been failure in fact I dont ever recall anyone getting that low.

 

[benjenbav]

As an aside, about the lighting. Did they have a tricolour on top with another motoring light or something below it? Maybe the cabin light? I've been reading my colregs and I'm trying to figure out what lights a sailing boat would have on to display those lights.

I think the configuration of the typical AWB switches (masthead tricolour ; other) encourages novices to put all possible lights on at once on the basis that more is better.
Those that later open a book discover the error of their ways and keep quiet about their previous faux pas. At least that’s what I did …albeit quite a long time ago. ?‍

 

[srm]

I'm sure there are more horror stories around.

Originally I think they were marketed as "Fast Track Yachtmaster" with big capable yachts (around 50ft) taking candidates and a skipper around Britain to get sea time and accumulate enough 60 mile plus passages where they acted as the skipper.

Stromness marina was a stop on the route. However one of the early boats stopped there for about three weeks!! When they arrived the trainees were quite eager, the plan was to sail to Lerwick. A straight forward passage, provided you avoid the tide races around the north of Orkney and southern headlands of Shetland, of about 100 miles. Easily covered in 24 hours in their boat provided the wind was on or abaft the beam giving a brief taste of open Atlantic sailing.

It was early in the season and the weather was typical for 59N and 60N at that time of year with low pressure systems passing through, but a fresh SWly would have given that boat and crew an exhilarating sail up to Lerwick. However the skipper was never happy with the weather and failed to take advantage of the weather windows. The skipper was not interested in talking to locals, but I suggested to the crew that they could shorten the passage by sailing up to Pierowall Harbour on Westray, then pick a weather window for Lerwick or Scalloway.

After a while the crew disappeared, I found out later that they had flown to Shetland for a few days. When they returned the plan was to sail to their next planned stop, near Edinburgh. Again the weather was never right, and again the crew were advised to use one of the three village bay anchorages at the south east end of Scapa Flow so they could easily time their crossing of the Pentland Firth when wind and tides were suitable, but the boat never moved out of its berth. In fact the land locked fleet anchorage of Scapa Flow would have been a great place for YM candidates to practice strong wind boat handling under sail.

Eventually the skipper left; a new skipper took over and the boat sailed early the next morning.

I was very surprised when the same boat and skipper arrived on another "round Britain fast track" the following spring. I would not have employed him a second time. However, they only stayed for a couple of days so hopefully those trainees got a better experience.

Edit:
Oh dear I sound like one of the forum's "armchair experts". In my defence at that time these had been my home waters for over 20 years. I had been based in Shetland for the first 14 and ran "Shetland Isles Charters" with a skippered 42ft boat used for charter and as an RYA sailing school. At work in Stromness I was getting weather faxes each day to use teaching MN deck officer candidates.

 

[PhillM]

Get yourself a job in academia. 24 week of the year its manic work. The rest of the time nobody knows or cares where you are and what you are doing, providing you hit the deadlines. Pay is good, pension good to and of course, lots of time to go sailing.

I should say, that with your practice experience in demolition, plus a HE qualification, there would be numerous institutions who would be interested in having you on-board. The push to degree-apprenticships is creating demand for a different type of academic. Industry experience is valued.

 

[srm]

The rest of the time nobody knows or cares where you are and what you are doing, providing you hit the deadlines.

Not my experience, even though I was on the old form of contract that you are probably thinking of I still had courses scheduled in my last few years during what had once been my free sailing time. More recent contracts were even more restrictive. I also read that pension terms are being eroded and that a new permanent full time contract is a rarity.