Entirely green, landlocked, idiot; thinking of doing yachtmaster zero to hero

[WannabePirate]

Hi all,

Life's lead me to a bit of a weird place. I'm 30ish years old, from Sheffield, and I've basically never sailed. I worked from 15 in a specialist area of demolition, left at 25 with some savings, took myself to university to study philosophy, and for a year or so since graduating have struggled to find a job in a new industry, and I've run across a bit of bad luck in my old one. So after a year of being in and out of work and often living on savings; its time to do something. I'm getting really bored.

My sum total of sailing experience is:
- I've sailed across to Alderney a few times, but never as anything more than a slightly active passenger on a very leisurely cruiser (been on some rough crossings though).
- I did a fair bit of inland dinghy sailing as a kid. Never had any qualifications or anything. Just used to rent a stratos or wayfarer regularly on a local lake and play on it all day.

But I do love boats, and the sea in general, despite not spending as much time around it as I'd have liked. I've read books, watched tv/internet videos, read forums/articles, bought magazines , etc, about them all my life. Whenever I'm anywhere with a marina its a fair bet you'll see me just wandering around the hard and the slips just looking at everything. I've always been the adventurous type with over 20 years mountaineering and scuba diving experience. Last 10 years I've been on quite a lot of exploratory caving and cave diving expeditions. Got into mountain biking in my boredom too. I'm thinking with how the last year and immediate future looks for me; it might be the right time for me to explore sailing/the sea more...and seriously. At the moment I'm thinking of doing the UKSA Yachtmaster Offshore course with the STCW and commercial endorsement.

Afterwards, I'd love to look for a job on the water. As I understand this would allow me to apply for jobs like crewing on delivery's, flotilla positions, deckhand on superyachts/workboats, etc? And the most likely work I'd be to get would be unpaid crewing on delivery for a...amount of time? I'm kind of expecting a few years after the course of real hardship, still living off my savings, renting my Sheffield house out, and maybe buying a small boat/renting somewhere on the coast/moving in with my dad on Alderney, and living on the move. Really am getting ready to do quite a lot.

I'm not planning to rush though. The current plan is to do my ENG1 and head over to Alderney in January to hang around the boatyard/yacht club trying to learn stuff, and aim to book the UKSA course around this time to start spring/early summer. I'd love to hear any advice, tips, recommendations, slagging off, arguing, etc this post may have provoked in you! And show my face and say hello!

I'm hoping I'll be around a while.

 

[Sandydog2]

If you are looking to get some sea miles in this group is great as you can book a single berth on a shared boat Trent Offshore Group

 

[newtothis]

There are few here who will admit doing zero-to-hero, but I did a version of it (albeit already having day skipper).
Personally, I found it useful for what I wanted to do, which was to boost my skills more than the odd annual charter would do. I was a lot better sailor after the course than I was before.
What you suggest is the bare minimum to get into 'working' in the industry. You're probably looking at a year of complimentary delivery crew experience after that before you'll get a paid gig.
There is the superyacht deckhand route, if you're pretty and servile and can put up with all it entails, which seems to be largely polishing things.
But if you're good with your hands and have a mechanical bent, I'd go hard on that. Even if it doesn't work out professionally, you'll be well placed to look after your own boat when you get one.
FYI, like you I have a useless liberal arts degree and didn't get my career underway until about your age. But it does happen and I can afford to pay for my own sailing now. When I retire I might look at doing deliveries, but that will be to learn more/do more miles than for the money.
You'll probably get some knockers here, but ignore them. Meanwhile, do as much sailing as you can.

 

[guernseyman]

deleted

 

[WannabePirate]

Thanks!

I got a similar response from someone else who did a zero-hero I found in the wild. It also didn't work out for them as a career, but they didn't regret it.

I've gone ahead and booked it. As I said I'm living on savings anyway so complimentary delivery crewing, all gone well, might be a nicer way to do it

 

[newtothis]

You may also want to post this in the more widely read Scuttlebut forum. There are some delivery crew/delivery company owners that pop up there from time to time.

 

[ridgy]

Would definitely ask the mods to move this thread for you to SB, you'll get far more response.
You should crack on with your plan however, you won't be the least experienced person on the course.

 

[john_morris_uk]

I will move it. Good luck to the OP. I’ve examined a few zero to hero. Some are excellent. Some are not so good. Twas ever thus.

 

[jamie N]

With a philosophy degree, you'll be better placed than most on here in trying to understand why on earth we'd do this 'for fun'!
Well, based on today -3°C, upside down tightening an engine mount to the detriment of a knuckle, I simply can't understand the fun bit.
Your plan sounds eminently workable, and you've prepared yourself for having to be patient.
Oh, just a heads up, if you've a pulse for the ENG1, you're 1/2 way there!
Good luck.

 

[Adios]

I've not done a day skipper or YM practical but did the YM shorebased for fun (after a fair bit of experience but no lower courses) and it occurred to me you really need all the same knowledge to go sailing for 10 miles or 10 days so you might as well just do the highest one you can find. The required number of hours as skipper before sitting the YM practical is very low just 5 days so its clearly meant as a starting point as in to say you can pretty competently be the master (maritime term for person in charge) of a yacht not so much as in "this signifies someone who has mastered yachting to black belt" which will only come with years of experience. If you're willing to dive in and absorb loads then you might as well just go for the highest one your miles will allow. And then build up experience which comes best when in charge of your own boat IMO, perhaps ideally solo to focus your mind

 

[john_morris_uk]

I've not done a day skipper or YM practical but did the YM shorebased for fun (after a fair bit of experience but no lower courses) and it occurred to me you really need all the same knowledge to go sailing for 10 miles or 10 days so you might as well just do the highest one you can find. The required number of hours as skipper before sitting the YM practical is very low just 5 days so its clearly meant as a starting point as in to say you can pretty competently be the master (maritime term for person in charge) of a yacht not so much as in "this signifies someone who has mastered yachting to black belt" which will only come with years of experience. If you're willing to dive in and absorb loads then you might as well just go for the highest one your miles will allow. And then build up experience which comes best when in charge of your own boat IMO, perhaps ideally solo to focus your mind

It’s a bit more than just five days as skipper:

RYA Yachtmaster Offshore exam pre-requisites

Minimum seatime

Documented minimum sea time completed on a seagoing sailing or motor yacht (as appropriate) in the last 10 years: 50 days at sea on yachts up to 500gt2 which may be reduced to 25 days if the candidate already holds an RYA Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate of Competence3; 5 days as skipper on vessels less than 24m LOA, which may be reduced to 3 days if the candidate already holds an RYA Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate of Competence3; 2500 miles on yachts up to 500gt2, which may be reduced to 1250 miles if the candidate already holds an RYA Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate of Competence3; 5 passages over 60 miles long, which must include 2 overnight passages and 2 as skipper, which may be reduced to 3 passages including 1 overnight and 1 as skipper if the candidate already holds an RYA Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate of Competence3. See: Information on qualifying passages 1 At least half the qualifying sea time should be gained in tidal waters and on vessels less than 24m LOA, and all seatime must be on vessels of the same discipline as the exam to be taken, i.e. sail or power.

 

[benjenbav]

Working on the basis that, “there is nothing – absolutely nothing – half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats” I’d say that getting the most relevant qualification that you can and practising and practising seems a decent plan. ?

 

[Adios]

It’s a bit more than just five days as skipper:

Yes I know I said "The required number of hours as skipper before sitting the YM practical is very low just 5 days so its clearly meant as a starting point" no that its the only thing required. Lots of passengering of who knows what intensity as well.

My point was that you're not expected to be an experienced skipper BEFORE getting your YM because it doesn't mean you are a "master yachter sea dog level 2000" just competent to begin being in charge of yachts. As in - so don't be put off going for that one before having years of yacht skippering under your belt, its supposed to be done before that as the OP intends doing it.

Isn't it?

 

[laika]

There are few here who will admit doing zero-to-hero, but I did a version of it (albeit already having day skipper).

I'll happily admit to doing the actual thing from no qualifications and no dinghy sailing experience in my 30s. The concept was fine, the execution was marred by having a single rubbish instructor for most of it. I'm presuming doing it at uksa would be fine though. Be hardcore: do it in the winter. Zig-zag the channel over a British winter and then smugly say "yeah right" to those who'll bang on about your experience being nothing compared with their childhood dinghy sailing and years of supervising their club's annual hog roast. The course I did started in January so there may still be spaces on something starting soon.

If you're prepared to work for free at the end of it the world's your oyster (/gunfleet/lagoon/whatever). A yachtmaster puts you at the front of the list for "volunteer crew". Don't do your ENG1 yet. You don't need a medical certificate until the end of the course, and unless you're doing ocean and using it >150nm offshore you only need the (easier/cheaper) ML5.

Ultimately I decided not to drop the day job and go into the low-end professional sailing area I found opening up to me after a few deliveries as mate. The pay is rubbish thanks to so many people with other sources of income (rich parents, fat pensions). Instead I bought my own boat which I sailed between contracts doing my old day job.

 

[Adios]

Ultimately I decided not to drop the day job and go into the low-end professional sailing area I found opening up to me after a few deliveries as mate. The pay is rubbish thanks to so many people with other sources of income (rich parents, fat pensions). Instead I bought my own boat which I sailed between contracts doing my old day job.

Thats more true than the cliche about doing the thing you love and never having to work. Chances are most lovable things have people undercutting you for free as a hobby, all the ecology and conservation things thats true as well. Marine biologist, forget it. Sailing yachts, hmm yes that's not a surprise. Better to get a decent paying job that doesn't take up all your time so you can sail at your leisure, or be the one undercutting others with no stress.

That said initially if bored, it sounds like an adventure to jump headfirst into this as the OP suggests

 

[WannabePirate]

I'll happily admit to doing the actual thing from no qualifications and no dinghy sailing experience in my 30s. The concept was fine, the execution was marred by having a single rubbish instructor for most of it. I'm presuming doing it at uksa would be fine though. Be hardcore: do it in the winter. Zig-zag the channel over a British winter and then smugly say "yeah right" to those who'll bang on about your experience being nothing compared with their childhood dinghy sailing and years of supervising their club's annual hog roast. The course I did started in January so there may still be spaces on something starting soon.

Nice to hear! Yes, I actually ended up booking to start in February. The idea of doing more of it in winter appealed to me very much. A kind of "train hard/fight easy" mentality.

Your post also makes you the third person who's told me they've done a zero-to-hero, not ended up working in yachting, and still don't regret it! Very reassuring to hear you had a similar level of experience to me! I swear everybody I see taking these courses has already been sailing since they were 6. I'm kind of worried I'm gonna be living with a bunch of 18 year old pretty boys born on a sailboat making me look bad!

Ultimately I decided not to drop the day job and go into the low-end professional sailing area I found opening up to me after a few deliveries as mate. The pay is rubbish thanks to so many people with other sources of income (rich parents, fat pensions). Instead I bought my own boat which I sailed between contracts doing my old day job.

Thats more true than the cliche about doing the thing you love and never having to work. Chances are most lovable things have people undercutting you for free as a hobby, all the ecology and conservation things thats true as well. Marine biologist, forget it. Sailing yachts, hmm yes that's not a surprise. Better to get a decent paying job that doesn't take up all your time so you can sail at your leisure, or be the one undercutting others with no stress.

I must admit, I'm a little bit in this boat. I'm good for a while on savings, though I will need to work in the future. Any income at all stretches this out but not working is very boring....

That said initially if bored, it sounds like an adventure to jump headfirst into this as the OP suggests

So this seems to mostly summarise my attitude. I'm not doing anything anyway and I'm pretty sure doing this will make something interesting happen

 

[ridgy]

I met a chap on a Carribbean yacht race a few years ago who had been struggling a bit. Late 30s, left the UK after splitting from his child's mother and was in Antigua doing manual labour on a dive boat. No sailing experience at all. He was on this boat because it was a big boat and a bit short staffed and Antigua being a fairly small place for Brits he knew the British owner and was asked to help pull some ropes.

Despite knowing nothing and having barely a pot to piss in he immediately saw his new future and was on the uksa course later that year and loving it. I haven't heard from him since but I've no doubt he's made it work and having some fun somewhere.

If you are of a mechanical mind and like people/having a good time then flotilla engineer is a good place to start.

 

[penfold]

As a counterpoint; if you want to earn money doing water-related nonsense, apply for a cadetship and you'll be paid(badly) to learn how to drive ships. Once you get your 3rd Mate ticket you can help run the superyachts rather than just polish/varnish/paint/clean them.

 

[Skylark]

Good luck with your course, @WannabePirate . Be sure to pack two essential items, an open mind and a sense of humour.

Those who make derogatory comments about zero to hero are either disingenuous or wrong.

Gaining YM Offshore by the end of the course is not a given, you’ll have to earn it. As our resident Examiner has pointed out, there’s a fair few candidates fail to get a first time pass.

I don’t see a 30-something YM as being married with mortgage and 2.4 kids. It’s not a “normal” occupation.

UKSA has careers advice so plenty of time to consider options.

I morphed into sailing later in life (compared to many posters) via recreational diving and followed the RYA Cruising Syllabus. I had no need for them but put myself forward for the MCA/RYA Cert of Comp’s. Coastal Skipper (as it was at that time), YM Offshore, YM Ocean.

When I retired, I morphed into commercial Yachting, part time and freelance. I’ve done Deliveries as crew and as Skipper, Corporate hospitality, Instruction, as a CI and now YMI and Own Boat Tuition.

There’s plenty of work available, pretty much all year round, for those who want it.

Best advice I can offer, don’t forget to contribute towards your pension.

Good luck ?

 

[Barnacle Bill]

I'd just say, best of luck, you seem ambitious and I'm sure you'll make the most of it. Go for it!

Any experience is good experience. Don't go out in conditions (or with forecasts) that are beyond your capabilities on the basis that "I'm a Yachtmaster so I ought to be able to handle it". Instead build up your experience in harsher conditions (always have a 'plan B') and use your own judgement - which will improve with time and experience.