Do insurance companies accept Dyneema standing rigging?

[dunedin]

You can save 40 quid an hour of labour. Dynema is very easy to splice.

Not sure that it is much quicker for a professional with the tools to splice dyneema than to do ends on conventional s/s wire. Indeed the latter could be quicker if doing a batch of them.

But if doing a DIY job, there is a very important change to the original question, which needs to become - do insurance companies accept DIY dyneema rigging, or is there a big price premium?
There are quite a few changes which insurers might be happy with done professionally, but are less amenable if done DIY. With the rig, I can see why an insurer might require a professional rigger to do the job. When it may become more expensive than wire.

PS. In the ChatGPT answer on benefits, yes decent weight reduction on an 80 footers rig - but suspect the OP is not in that category. And the “performance improvement” on a typical 10-12m cruiser is probably so minimal as to be un-noticeable. Certainly less than the performance lost by a fixed propellor, furling mainsail - or even perhaps furling jib.

 

[lustyd]

And if it's not a bottlescrew... Then it's more complicated

Not sure I'd call a laching more complicated than a bottlescrew. If anything the lashing is the most basic version of this, and again allows for different length stays just like bottlescrews do.

 

[flaming]

Not sure I'd call a laching more complicated than a bottlescrew. If anything the lashing is the most basic version of this, and again allows for different length stays just like bottlescrews do.

takes a little longer to adjust than just turning a bottlescrew though...

 

[Neeves]

Not sure that it is much quicker for a professional with the tools to splice dyneema than to do ends on conventional s/s wire. Indeed the latter could be quicker if doing a batch of them.

But if doing a DIY job, there is a very important change to the original question, which needs to become - do insurance companies accept DIY dyneema rigging, or is there a big price premium?
There are quite a few changes which insurers might be happy with done professionally, but are less amenable if done DIY. With the rig, I can see why an insurer might require a professional rigger to do the job. When it may become more expensive than wire.

PS. In the ChatGPT answer on benefits, yes decent weight reduction on an 80 footers rig - but suspect the OP is not in that category. And the “performance improvement” on a typical 10-12m cruiser is probably so minimal as to be un-noticeable. Certainly less than the performance lost by a fixed propellor, furling mainsail - or even perhaps furling jib.

But if you are focussed then the weight reduction (of the standing rigging) and then weight reduction of other items (like toothbrush handles ) (and nor forgetting aluminium anchors and high tensile (smaller) chain), changing and downsizing to dyneema halyards and sheets, plus the performance gained by a more sensible choice of prop, a decent headsail and the non furling main, drink whisky not wine - offer cumulative savings adding up to a greater whole (saving).

Most owners who focus on weight saving would not stop at dyneema rigging. It becomes a fetish.

Jonathan

 

[WindyWindyWindy]

But if doing a DIY job, there is a very important change to the original question, which needs to become - do insurance companies accept DIY dyneema rigging, or is there a big price premium?

If they're going there then they should also specify what qualifications are acceptable from a "professional" rigger. A lot of them seem to be informally trained, or trained to only one specific manufacturer.

 

[Sandy]

If they're going there then they should also specify what qualifications are acceptable from a "professional" rigger. A lot of them seem to be informally trained, or trained to only one specific manufacturer.

Can you point us all to the formal training programme and qualifications for riggers?

From what I've seen it is more an art form rather than an exact science. The Rigging Doctor's YouTube video on dyneema rigging is a prime example of that.

 

[Marsali_1]

Can you point us all to the formal training programme and qualifications for riggers?

From what I've seen it is more an art form rather than an exact science. The Rigging Doctor's YouTube video on dyneema rigging is a prime example of that.

Apparently The Rigging "Doctor's" a dentist by trade and, judging by some of his videos, he certainly isn't a shipwright. I wouldn't trust anything he spliced and I'm not sure I would want him near my teeth either.

 

[Trident]

Just a few points from above - dyneema rigging is mostly stuff like Rig12 or Dynice Dux these days and is coated and thus no real UV issue outside the tropics. It is sized for stretch (even with the pre-stretched heat treated stuff like Dux) and so will be bigger than wire - so 10mm 1x19 becomes 13mm dyneema. 13mm dyneema is about 6 times stronger than the wire and the UV only hits the outer layer...

Bottle screws are very much used on larger sizes - IIRC Colligo say only use lashings up to 8mm dyneema and then change to bottle screws / turnbuckles

With the latest versions of rigging dyneema they have very little creep or construction stretch as they are machine stretched and heated in the factory so mostly you are only dealing with the stretch from splicing which should make dialling in the rig over a week or so quite easy

The splices needed are all very simple

Plenty of options are available for covers in high wear areas to prevent chafe or if you have the budget you can cover the entire rig.

On my 50ft cat (7 wires) it adds up to around 40kg saved aloft.

 

[fredrussell]

Just out of interest, how does one measure the tension of a dyneema stay? With SS stays it’s fairly straightforward with a Loos gauge or similar, is there a dyneema version of these gauges?

 

[AntarcticPilot]

Just out of interest, how does one measure the tension of a dyneema stay? With SS stays it’s fairly straightforward with a Loos gauge or similar, is there a dyneema version of these gauges?

If it understand these gauges, the material of the stay makes no difference.