Reefing the main down wind

[Fr J Hackett]

All depend

So you averaged 156 miles a day. Interesting
So what is the average for a 40ft yacht running down wind in the ARC all the time in the ARC? 150 per day?

All depended on the wind strength and direction and how much sail you wanted to keep up. In light winds close hauled and that wouldn't be better than 55° it would struggle to make 5knts but given 15 knts plus on the beam or more then 6 plus knts was normal and life aboard was easy. Horses for courses.
A route you are possibly familiar with Orwell to Ostend, in my short time on the East Coast the one time I did it and only one other boat left the Orwell on that day from dropping the lines at Shotley lock to entering the marina at Ostend was 8hrs 12 minutes.

 

[Roberto]

My boat has perpendicular spreaders (i.e. not swept back), masthead rigging, fully battened mainsail with cars, IOR-style sail plan (relatively smaller mainsail and larger foresail).
My method: keep going downwind, ok say 150-160°TWA I would not sail dead downwind anyway --> fully sheet in the genoa as if beating (works with whatever the exposed surface )--> slacken the mainsail sheet until the sail will be totally back winded, like floating in the air --> sail it's free to go up or down --> once done revert to correct trim for both sails.
I'd say since having developed this procedure maybe 15 years ago I *never* luffed again to take or shake a reef while sailing downwind (and during one transatlantic I made one single jibe and possibly taken/shaken 30/40 reefs, surely more than one two a day). Makes things so easy when sailing long runs downwind, this type of rig has become a must have for me should I ever consider another boat, ready to forego any advantages of swept back spreaders, fractional rigs or huge mainsail/tiny jib sail plans.
Maybe give it a try if one has the same rig setup

 

[Daydream believer]

All depend

All depended on the wind strength and direction and how much sail you wanted to keep up. In light winds close hauled and that wouldn't be better than 55° it would struggle to make 5knts but given 15 knts plus on the beam or more then 6 plus knts was normal and life aboard was easy. Horses for courses.
A route you are possibly familiar with Orwell to Ostend, in my short time on the East Coast the one time I did it and only one other boat left the Orwell on that day from dropping the lines at Shotley lock to entering the marina at Ostend was 8hrs 12 minutes.

Impressive
I have never done the 60 miles from Long sand head to Ostend alone in anything like that; & my trip 2 weeks ago was my 80th visit to Ostend
You would be averaging 10 Kts in a boat whose polar is probably around 7kts & you would have to exceed 10 SOG a lot of times. Even if you did use the couple of kts of tide to your advantage.

 

[Chiara’s slave]

The issue for us is that we’d never get the main halyard tension we need if theres wind in the sail and tension in the sheet. We need a lot, even head to wind its a 2 hand low gear grind on the winch

 

[Fr J Hackett]

Impressive
I have never done the 60 miles from Long sand head to Ostend alone in anything like that; & my trip 2 weeks ago was my 80th visit to Ostend
You would be averaging 10 Kts in a boat whose polar is probably around 7kts & you would have to exceed 10 SOG a lot of times. Even if you did use the couple of kts of tide to your advantage.

It's just over 80 miles if I remember correctly

 

[jdc]

I rarely change direction to reef, and have frequently reefed in F8 or 9 on a run / very broad reach.

But our boat lends itself to this kind of thing, fully battened main, spreaders not swept back and, possibly most important a _very_ big rudder! No problem at all steering downwind with the main sheeted in (as if on a close reach) to reduce friction on the spreaders. Slack the vang and tighten the topping lift, then ease the main 6", winch the reef in 6", repeat.

The autopilot does the steering, and I, or my other, half does the reefing. We don't always have to wake the other. Halyard tension no problem, besides, if we're running it isn't so critical, and if upwind this discussion is not so relevant. The topping lift is your friend in these circs (as are big winches on the coach roof).

PS: in contrast to Roberto, we have a big main and fairly small yankee, so the reefs in the main are important (41m² and 44m²).

 

[geem]

I rarely change direction to reef, and have frequently reefed in F8 or 9 on a run / very broad reach.

But our boat lends itself to this kind of thing, fully battened main, spreaders not swept back and, possibly most important a _very_ big rudder! No problem at all steering downwind with the main sheeted in (as if on a close reach) to reduce friction on the spreaders. Slack the vang and tighten the topping lift, then ease the main 6", winch the reef in 6", repeat.

The autopilot does the steering, and I, or my other, half does the reefing. We don't always have to wake the other. Halyard tension no problem, besides, if we're running it isn't so critical, and if upwind this discussion is not so relevant. The topping lift is your friend in these circs (as are big winches on the coach roof).

PS: in contrast to Roberto, we have a big main and fairly small yankee, so the reefs in the main are important (41m² and 44m²).

We have similar experience. A directionally stable boat, 2 metre long rudder, straight spreaders, powerful autopilot, powerful winches at the mast. We don't wake the off watch crew to reef either. It works well

 

[Fr J Hackett]

It's just over 80 miles if I remember correctly

And just to be truthful I was taking the proverbial, the one time I went to Ostend took a little less than 111/2 hours still a respectable time, if I remember correctly early May 2010 it was an occasion of I've started so I will finish the weather was poor but the wind was right and the crew wanted to go. I think Ostend was shut. The other boat I spoke of was an Oyster 46 I think, picked it up on AIS a couple of hours after we left it passed us less than half an hour before we got to the breakwater, its AIS was configured as 50 something feet which is why I remember it. We were the only two visiting boats on the fore and aft moorings with a few other boats moored alongside on the pontoons. I never understood what the fascination of the East coasters was with Ostend, dreary place.

 

[Skylark]

That V34 did a 197 miles run in 24 hours in those conditions and we had steak and chips in the evening as well.

May I respectfully suggest that you re-calibrate the log as it appears to be reading about 25% high

 

[Daydream believer]

May I respectfully suggest that you re-calibrate the log as it appears to be reading about 25% high

What you mean -------he did not have any chips-?
Well that would be an awful exaggeration for him to make.

 

[Daydream believer]

. I never understood what the fascination of the East coasters was with Ostend, dreary place.

In the 70s it was the night clubs such as the King 1, King 2 & King 3. All different themes & different style of girls.- including pole dancers if that was your style
The streets were bustling with street life
A great fascination to 3 early 20 something gung ho types racing there with the Stellas, before going off to explore places like Veere & Goes for a few days.
EAORA used to fill the harbour when they arrived
It has changed a lot & I can now take my family & there is so much to do & see
The paulusfeesten ( I have been going for 20 years)
Other events like the Belgian national BbQ championships along the sea front- Attended by some professional teams
The Atlantic wall is an interesting morning's exploration followed by a snack in the cafe nearby
A peaceful bike ride one of the 2 parks
Take the bike along the sea front & play dodgems with the crowds ( I have 2 Brompton e-bikes for the boat) Or hire a bike from Candy's - Not expensive for a day & he will sort you a decent one to fit your frame
A bike ride to Blankenburg for the day. - Could go by tram if you are lazy but the countryside is interesting
A good staging post for the train for a day in Brugge
The very welcoming RNSYC who great me with "Well its Sam back, Welcome, how are you"
Shrimp salad booked -if a little expensive -but this year I dined in the club 90% of the time so they looked after me.
The beer festival
Some street performers
Bands in the square
Loads of restaurants of all styles & prices
Chocolate shops- wife, daughter in law & daughter all insist on a kilo each, bought back when I go
Walk or ride the Crystal maze for art lovers
the fair in the square
Wander through the bustling market each week
I have just spent 22 nights there & have often spent much longer.
One year my wife acted as assistant race officer for the Belgian national Dragon championships
Sometimes my family come over & rent a flat for a week
It is a great place to spend a holiday

 

[Daydream believer]

And just to be truthful I was taking the proverbial, the one time I went to Ostend took a little less than 111/2 hours still a respectable time, if I remember correctly early May 2010 it was an occasion of I've started so I will finish the weather was poor but the wind was right and the crew wanted to go. I think Ostend was shut. The other boat I spoke of was an Oyster 46 I think, picked it up on AIS a couple of hours after we left it passed us less than half an hour before we got to the breakwater, its AIS was configured as 50 something feet which is why I remember it. We were the only two visiting boats on the fore and aft moorings with a few other boats moored alongside on the pontoons. I never understood what the fascination of the East coasters was with Ostend, dreary place.

I have tried many times to beat my record from my mooring in St Lawrence bay to Ostend Which is about 93 miles via the LSH. Surprisingly it was in my Stella & took 13.5 hours SH. Spinnaker up as I left Ostend & I dropped it at The Baffle at Bradwell. The tides worked just right all the way.
2 weeks ago I finally managed 13.5 hours but it was only to the marinal which is 3 miles shorter so not quite as good. Average time is 14.5-16 hours. Longest was 30 hours ( to Burnham on Crouch) but much of that was hove too in F9 in my Stella. Only one of the 2 times I have been in a true F9. As opposed to gusting F9

 

[Fr J Hackett]

May I respectfully suggest that you re-calibrate the log as it appears to be reading about 25% high

Nope I can even show you the plot as I kept the chart and it was a verified 24 hour run.

 

[Skylark]

Nope I can even show you the plot as I kept the chart and it was a verified 24 hour run.

 

[Mudisox]

Heave to seems to work for me on all sorts of boats, 10-15mins max.

 

[Daydream believer]

Nope I can even show you the plot as I kept the chart and it was a verified 24 hour run.

Yes but what about the steak & chips. you have not confirmed that & I am not sure of the validity of your claims.
We need truth not supposition.
you have been reading too much Viago for my liking.
Where is the mustard, salt & vinegar?

 

[Fr J Hackett]

Yes but what about the steak & chips. you have not confirmed that & I am not sure of the validity of your claims.
We need truth not supposition.
you have been reading too much Viago for my liking.
Where is the mustard, salt & vinegar?

Steak vacuum packed, bought in Eccleshall staffs in the fridge chips potatoes bought in Falmouth, cut and rolled in olive oil placed on a baking tray in the oven ( (Eno). Stake done in a frying pan, peas were tinned there was mustard. Colemans from a jar. There was a glass of red from a wine box again bought in Falmouth, contentious on so many levels I know. I took my dinner at the chart table as is my want on passage, my crew took his at the saloon table. Watch was by radar and AIS on the Chart plotter at the chart table. Desert was tinned rice pudding with jam.
I don't take salt use it fairly sparingly in cooking and don't like vinegar on anything let alone chips. The cooking was done by the crew, I did the washing up.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

Yes but what about the steak & chips. you have not confirmed that & I am not sure of the validity of your claims.
We need truth not supposition.
you have been reading too much Viago for my liking.
Where is the mustard, salt & vinegar?

I didn't think anyone took a photo of the steal but here is a Toad in the Hole I made earlier in the voyage, the onion gravy is out of shot but you can see the carrots and the second photo is my birthday cake cooked by the crew my very good friend Nick sadly no longer here.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

And here's the old girl charging along on another day, I appreciate the right hand instrument reading might unnerve you, you being an East coast sailor.

 

[Daydream believer]

Chips without salt & vinegar?
Sacrilege