North Wales Berthing & Mooring options/Realistic Passage Planning

[salad]

W /SW air stream meaning close hauled / beat out of the Solway.

That might take me a day or so to understand lol

No I think I get it, you're sailing at a shallow angle to the dead zone for wind, heading north/north west and tacking a lot? Is that correct? I've been trying to learn this stuff

I appreciate the PM offer. I may well take you up on that. Still a lot of research to do in general.

 

[SaltyC]

That might take me a day or so to understand lol

No I think I get it, you're sailing at a shallow angle to the dead zone fo wind, heading north/north west and tacking a lot? Is that correct? I've been trying to learn this stuff

I appreciate the PM offer. I may well take you up on that. Still a lot of research to do in general.

You got the basics, for a MB doesn't matter for a flappy it does.

 

[salad]

DIY can be a bit of an issue TBH!

With North Wales we use a trusted professional in the area who normally (and kindly!) arranges work for us, if he can't do it. That said, we often go to Conwy for the day.

With Kip we have more of a project boat... we bought her there and were actually going to bring her back to Brough until we saw the Clyde! We'll often (less often that we'd like) spend a few days on the boat and do a little DIY while we're there. But I also use the local yard, and there are more facilities available at Fairlie and Largs etc.

I'd say there's everything you could need local to both locations.

Brough/Humber Yawl Club is a sailing club, so we all dig in together to maintain our own boats and the premises.

You must be a very busy person! Appreciate your thoughts and we may still choose kip. It seems that choosing a home for a boat is harder than choosing the actual boat lol.

 

[jakew009]

Here’s what reality is like.
First of all I’m 29. And no kids. And very flexible working hours. My girlfriend is very practical but more of a ‘boat is mobile sunbathing platform’ type person.

I live on the North Devon coast about 20 minutes from Ilfracombe. I think our coastline is less hospitable than Wales, and certainly has less facilities. Somewhere like the Solent would be easier, but the gist of this still runs true.

I have a 7.5m rib with a big ass engine on the back.
After I bought it I had to do a massive amount of work on it, because I realised a mechanical or electrical breakdown on our coastline could be a near death experience.

If you don’t have 100% confidence in the boat you will never take it anywhere. Of the 500 or so boat in the Bideford estuary, I’d estimate 90% of them never leave the estuary because they are too scared too. I expect this pattern is repeated across the country.

Second, you don’t just need to learn to sail, you need to be really practical. If you are a good mechanic / electrician / problem solver it’s relatively easy to learn to sail.
If you aren’t really practical, you are going to fall into the group that never leave the estuary (because you are going to be in a perpetual state of boat is broken).

Thirdly, don’t under estimate just how much boats like to break and how much upkeep is required. It’s constant, and you’ve either got to do it yourself or pay someone else to do it (when they can fit you in).

You could quite easily loose half the season or more from a simple mechanical issue. Your comment about a ‘bit of silicone’ made me laugh - try a leaking fuel tank or an intermittent electrical issue.

Next, the type of boat. If you go into Ilfracombe harbour, you will see there are four types of boat there

a) a bunch of fishing power catamarans, run commercially, expensive and not in your budget

b) a bunch of big orange Humber ribs - go out in all weathers, blast up and down the coast all day every day with paying passengers

c) some bilge keel sailing boats, most of them never seem to go anywhere

d) a bunch of smallhard boats, fast fisher types. Also never go anywhere.

On to your predicted trip from Wales to Ilfracombe…

If you take the last 10 days as an example, the weather has probably been the best it’ll ever be.

90% of the boats didn’t leave the harbour… as usual.

We got out quite a lot, most evenings and both weekends.

Yesterday we were anchored off the beach all afternoon in 30 degrees. Then suddenly as the tide turned the wind started blowing off the beach and it was frankly horrible. We quickly pulled up the anchor and blasted home.

We passed a couple of other small cabin power boats who looked like they were having a miserable time pounding through the waves trying to get back. I reminded myself why we have a rib as we whizzed along.

That’s not an uncommon experience. Don’t underestimate how fast the sea state can change! On Tuesday evening we were going to have a picnic but the wind had got up and it was way too choppy.

Oh, and I’m terms of use, most power boats seem to do about 30 engine hours a year if you look at sales listings. That’s about 10 x 3 hour round trips a year with a few hours at anchor in the middle. Many boats will do even less.

In fact I’m trying to sell an 18 year old boat at the moment with 600 odd hours on it and people are put off by the ‘high engine hours’. Go figure.

Boating is awesome but it takes years to get your confidence up. Remember most boats never go anywhere…

 

[salad]

Here’s what reality is like.
First of all I’m 29. And no kids. And very flexible working hours. My girlfriend is very practical but more of a ‘boat is mobile sunbathing platform’ type person.

I live on the North Devon coast about 20 minutes from Ilfracombe. I think our coastline is less hospitable than Wales, and certainly has less facilities. Somewhere like the Solent would be easier, but the gist of this still runs true.

I have a 7.5m rib with a big ass engine on the back.
After I bought it I had to do a massive amount of work on it, because I realised a mechanical or electrical breakdown on our coastline could be a near death experience.

If you don’t have 100% confidence in the boat you will never take it anywhere. Of the 500 or so boat in the Bideford estuary, I’d estimate 90% of them never leave the estuary because they are too scared too. I expect this pattern is repeated across the country.

Second, you don’t just need to learn to sail, you need to be really practical. If you are a good mechanic / electrician / problem solver it’s relatively easy to learn to sail.
If you aren’t really practical, you are going to fall into the group that never leave the estuary (because you are going to be in a perpetual state of boat is broken).

Thirdly, don’t under estimate just how much boats like to break and how much upkeep is required. It’s constant, and you’ve either got to do it yourself or pay someone else to do it (when they can fit you in).

You could quite easily loose half the season or more from a simple mechanical issue. Your comment about a ‘bit of silicone’ made me laugh - try a leaking fuel tank or an intermittent electrical issue.

Next, the type of boat. If you go into Ilfracombe harbour, you will see there are four types of boat there

a) a bunch of fishing power catamarans, run commercially, expensive and not in your budget

b) a bunch of big orange Humber ribs - go out in all weathers, blast up and down the coast all day every day with paying passengers

c) some bilge keel sailing boats, most of them never seem to go anywhere

d) a bunch of smallhard boats, fast fisher types. Also never go anywhere.

On to your predicted trip from Wales to Ilfracombe…

If you take the last 10 days as an example, the weather has probably been the best it’ll ever be.

90% of the boats didn’t leave the harbour… as usual.

We got out quite a lot, most evenings and both weekends.

Yesterday we were anchored off the beach all afternoon in 30 degrees. Then suddenly as the tide turned the wind started blowing off the beach and it was frankly horrible. We quickly pulled up the anchor and blasted home.

We passed a couple of other small cabin power boats who looked like they were having a miserable time pounding through the waves trying to get back. I reminded myself why we have a rib as we whizzed along.

That’s not an uncommon experience. Don’t underestimate how fast the sea state can change! On Tuesday evening we were going to have a picnic but the wind had got up and it was way too choppy.

Oh, and I’m terms of use, most power boats seem to do about 30 engine hours a year if you look at sales listings. That’s about 10 x 3 hour round trips a year with a few hours at anchor in the middle. Many boats will do even less.

In fact I’m trying to sell an 18 year old boat at the moment with 600 odd hours on it and people are put off by the ‘high engine hours’. Go figure.

Boating is awesome but it takes years to get your confidence up. Remember most boats never go anywhere…

It's funny but I've often wondered about how often people use their boats. Even in somewhere like Whitby, which I visit fairly often, a lot don't appear to have moved very much in a long time. There are telltale signs of that of course, observable to the passing yacht gazer.

None of that is really of concern to me. I appreciate why you highlighted it and I do mean appreciate. Cautionary tales are as important as anything else in this process.

I reckon there are many people who think they want to own a boat, but really its more of a glimpse of a lifestyle that they've seen somewhere which has resulted in the old rose tinted specs. I'm not really one of those people. I've had boats, ribs, but it became a hassle, mainly due to towing or before that, cleaning and storage at home, then distance to water making them impractical for me.

The absolute easiest option right now is to get myself a motorboat that can take ground (cathedral hull GRP) and has a 50hp on the back, a typical Holderness coast boat. I could then tractor launch it for very little from Hornsea, where the chaps who run the boatyard near the lifeboat station are some of the friendliest on the entire planet. It's an option I've poured over again and again. I might still do it on top of a yacht just because of the friendliness of the guys (owners) in the yard. It would support their efforts just to park a boat there and pay the fee. Nothing was too much trouble, tractor launches by volunteers almost constant, commercial crew helpful. It was such a great experience, but had I done so, it would have only been for me, to the exclusion of family as my kids aren't old enough for offshore fishing in that way and my wife isn't really interested in the process of fishing, just the catch.

I'm mechanically minded and perhaps even more importantly, my Mrs is no stranger to a socket set either. Many moons ago I seriously considered a career in yachting and had I done so, it would probably have been as an ETO, as I was qualified, minus the sea miles. I never really fancied being a deck officer and having a close friend who is the captain of an expedition yacht which cruises worldwide and therefore knowing what he goes through, I don't regret that decision. It's a lot of stress, a lot. One false move and career can be gone.

AEC would have been a natural progression from ETO, or sideways move. I love anything mechanical or practical and make furniture as a hobby, I suppose I can turn my hand to most things which is the sort of attitude I think you need as a boat owner, unless your pockets are deep enough to use the yard for everything. Although, I wont say that there may not be a cry for help on the forum occasionally once we get off the ground lol.

I hope you enjoy your rib and you do right to use it as much as possible, crack on I say. They are fantastic and for a long time I considered upgrading. You know the sort, twin 150hp etc. Even a diminutive 5m with 50hp will cope with most anything in my experience and the only real problem we had was a transient seal that thought we were a chew toy. That and as fishing vessels, the tubes can be annoying depending on what you're doing. Other than that, for flying about day sailing, theres really nothing better imo.

 

[salad]

Here’s what reality is like.
First of all I’m 29. And no kids. And very flexible working hours. My girlfriend is very practical but more of a ‘boat is mobile sunbathing platform’ type person.

I live on the North Devon coast about 20 minutes from Ilfracombe. I think our coastline is less hospitable than Wales, and certainly has less facilities. Somewhere like the Solent would be easier, but the gist of this still runs true.

I have a 7.5m rib with a big ass engine on the back.
After I bought it I had to do a massive amount of work on it, because I realised a mechanical or electrical breakdown on our coastline could be a near death experience.

If you don’t have 100% confidence in the boat you will never take it anywhere. Of the 500 or so boat in the Bideford estuary, I’d estimate 90% of them never leave the estuary because they are too scared too. I expect this pattern is repeated across the country.

Second, you don’t just need to learn to sail, you need to be really practical. If you are a good mechanic / electrician / problem solver it’s relatively easy to learn to sail.
If you aren’t really practical, you are going to fall into the group that never leave the estuary (because you are going to be in a perpetual state of boat is broken).

Thirdly, don’t under estimate just how much boats like to break and how much upkeep is required. It’s constant, and you’ve either got to do it yourself or pay someone else to do it (when they can fit you in).

You could quite easily loose half the season or more from a simple mechanical issue. Your comment about a ‘bit of silicone’ made me laugh - try a leaking fuel tank or an intermittent electrical issue.

Next, the type of boat. If you go into Ilfracombe harbour, you will see there are four types of boat there

a) a bunch of fishing power catamarans, run commercially, expensive and not in your budget

b) a bunch of big orange Humber ribs - go out in all weathers, blast up and down the coast all day every day with paying passengers

c) some bilge keel sailing boats, most of them never seem to go anywhere

d) a bunch of smallhard boats, fast fisher types. Also never go anywhere.

On to your predicted trip from Wales to Ilfracombe…

If you take the last 10 days as an example, the weather has probably been the best it’ll ever be.

90% of the boats didn’t leave the harbour… as usual.

We got out quite a lot, most evenings and both weekends.

Yesterday we were anchored off the beach all afternoon in 30 degrees. Then suddenly as the tide turned the wind started blowing off the beach and it was frankly horrible. We quickly pulled up the anchor and blasted home.

We passed a couple of other small cabin power boats who looked like they were having a miserable time pounding through the waves trying to get back. I reminded myself why we have a rib as we whizzed along.

That’s not an uncommon experience. Don’t underestimate how fast the sea state can change! On Tuesday evening we were going to have a picnic but the wind had got up and it was way too choppy.

Oh, and I’m terms of use, most power boats seem to do about 30 engine hours a year if you look at sales listings. That’s about 10 x 3 hour round trips a year with a few hours at anchor in the middle. Many boats will do even less.

In fact I’m trying to sell an 18 year old boat at the moment with 600 odd hours on it and people are put off by the ‘high engine hours’. Go figure.

Boating is awesome but it takes years to get your confidence up. Remember most boats never go anywhere…

Just as a complete aside, if a boat was 18 years old and the engine age the same, at 600 hours, I'd be concerned that the engine had too few hours on it, not too many? The same way I wouldn't buy a 20 year old car that had 5,000 miles, unless it was from a Ferrari from Jay Leno, Rowan Atkinson or some other car officianado who had the means to maintain it in heated storage on a money no object basis. Engines need to work and be maintained or they get upset.

 

[jakew009]

Just as a complete aside, if a boat was 18 years old and the engine age the same, at 600 hours, I'd be concerned that the engine had too few hours on it, not too many? The same way I wouldn't buy a 20 year old car that had 5,000 miles, unless it was from a Ferrari from Jay Leno, Rowan Atkinson or some other car officianado who had the means to maintain it in heated storage on a money no object basis. Engines need to work and be maintained or they get upset.

I agree, but the market disagrees with us both when it comes to motor boats.