Salt'n'shaken
Member
Fair enough. A chap in my owners association moors in Glasson, near Lancaster. I think I'd prefer that to Hartlepool (yes, I have been to Hartlepool
North Wales Berthing & Mooring options/Realistic Passage Planning
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Fr J Hackett
Well-known member
I would guess he's talking about the mean wind speed, 15Knt is the sweet spot for most sailing boats.
AngusMcDoon
Well-known member
It doesn't matter. I chose 15 knots because that was in your post that I was replying to, so whatever your 15 knots means.
The point I was making was that apart from big storms and gales wind forecasting is still approximate. It often will be more wind, less wind, start earlier, stop later or from a different direction than what you expected. I have the impression that you are expecting too much accuracy from forecasts. If you try to plan a multi-day passage based on forecast winds for the week ahead being below, for example, 15 knots it will probably be ok on day one, perhaps right on day two, but after that the forecast is just a guess and is as likely to be completely wrong as correct. It only takes the course of a low pressure system to be a few degrees off from the prediction for it to bring completely different weather than that forecast.
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AngusMcDoon
Well-known member
In general, an 8m powerboat and a 36' sailing boat are completely different beasts. The former have limited range and marginal stability and are designed for blatting around the bay on a nice day. The latter are often used to sail across oceans.
The above are generalisations. There will be 8m motor boats than can cope with a Fastnet storm and 36' sailing boats that break their furniture in a Solent chop.
salad
Active member
Thanks Angus. The motor boats I've been looking at are Cat B, boats like the Arvor 250 and so on seem to be regarded (from reading around) as quite capable in less than ideal conditions. 8m seems a popular size for French hobby fishermen too, theres tons for sale. They must be able to cope with the majority of conditions in the channel I'd think but for a storm far out in the Irish Sea, I think I'd want something bigger.
I take your point and I understand that yachts vary tremendously in capabilities and suit different situations. I'm almost certainly looking for a racer cruiser from 32-37ft, early-mid 2000's I'd imagine. I've gone for 32ft as a minimum, but it depends on accommodation as we intend to use any boat as a motorhome of sorts. We need to start with baby steps, but also have useable accommodation also. I intend to cast a wide net and see a variety of boats. Ultimately, I want to take the practical exams on our own boat.
dunedin
Well-known member
Don't rule out Windermere, for a first year or so. It would be great for introducing the family gently and gaining experience. Don't need to blat about at 25 knots to enjoy a boat, sail or motor. The short distances mean speed just means run out of space sooner.
Fr J Hackett
Well-known member
Boats like the Arvour250 are day boats and there is minimal accommodation, they are ideal inshore fishing boats. So you could go from A to B but when you get to B you are going to find life very uncomfortable especially if you have a couple of fractious children in tow. You will be looking for a hotel and somewhere to eat very quickly.
salad
Active member
The Arvors are more on the fishing side. I was just using it as an example of a cat b. I think the MF 805 and Antares 8 are all cat b too and have much better accommodation. Whether or not its usable in a choppy sea though, is another matter.
AngusMcDoon
Well-known member
That's a boat that will be good at the purpose for which it was designed - sports day fishing with an occasional overnight for 2 people. It will make a poor family cruiser. It's mostly cockpit with little accommodation.
I expect the boat will cope, but rough conditions will be unpleasant, and you won't want to repeat the experience or endure it for long. You'd have to take the speed right down, and the motion will be horrible. You may need to invest in a good stock of barfing buckets.
Laysula
Well-known member
You don't have to sail hundreds of miles to enjoy your boat. The sea and the coastline look the same pretty much wherever you are. Young family members won't want to sit for hours bouncing about looking out rhe window or across the coaming at the "lovely" coastline. and your other half certainly won't want to put up with them whingeing whilst you manfully plough on. Buy a boat that can take the ground and explore the little places close by. On a nice day anchor off (or dry out on) a nice beach and build sandcastles etc.
The first piece of advice I got when I bought my first boat was " DON'T frighten your family" and the second one should have been, DON'T do too much.
Secondly Is your partner doing their shorebased dayskipper? If not, why not? Are you both going to do Dayskipper/powerboat level two? Or is it you who want's a boat and she feels duty bound to go along with it? In all your posts it seems to have been about what you want to do with no real mention about the rest of your family.
Once you have both done your dayskipper go on one of the Greek flotillas and see how the kids get on.
The first piece of advice I got when I bought my first boat was " DON'T frighten your family" and the second one should have been, DON'T do too much.
Secondly Is your partner doing their shorebased dayskipper? If not, why not? Are you both going to do Dayskipper/powerboat level two? Or is it you who want's a boat and she feels duty bound to go along with it? In all your posts it seems to have been about what you want to do with no real mention about the rest of your family.
Once you have both done your dayskipper go on one of the Greek flotillas and see how the kids get on.
Graham376
Well-known member
There's a hell of a difference between going for a fun blast in a rib for short trips and being out of sheltered waters in a small power boat. Even larger mobos can be very uncomfortable in less than ideal conditions. I well remember a trip back to Conwy from Malahide many years ago, we had a 35 ft sailing boat then and were having a cracking sail with a non-sailing visitor sun bathing on deck. Three power boats came out shortly after we left, also heading back to Conwy, they varied between around 38ft to 45ft and turned back because it was too uncomfortable for them and a crew member on one had fallen and hurt herself. Friends will small mobos wouldn't go out on other days when we had pleasant sails, even on our early 26 & 31 ft boats.
salad
Active member
I wont rule it out, its just whether or not the logistics are workable.
I left out some details because otherwise the posts would be even longer than they are already and I don't want to bore peoples socks off. Other half is fully on board, pardon the pun, and will have equivalent qualifications to me, aside from STCW95, although its a good course and well worth doing imo (in case anyone is considering it - do it, its fun). We feel its important to have a 2nd qualified crew member if there are young children on board. Son will learn how to use the radio in an emergency and the function and use of safety equipment insofar as he's able.
We all kind of like the same things so it's not really a problem. Finding anchorage and going on the beach, fishing, cooking and eating what we catch, coastal foraging and potting, maybe some watersports, play time in a tender etc. Kids dont get sea sick at all and have been out to sea. My other half does, but she has plenty of magic pills.
This is one of the difficulties as we'd really like the accommodation and experience of sailing a yacht, but could do with a motor boat for other stuff! I suppose theres always a bilge keeler with a larger tender?
salad
Active member
Makes sense, short and fat vs slender and long.
I hope nobody minds me treating this thread more like a chat in the pub. It's proving very useful and I'm grateful to all of you.
salad
Active member
For example, this looks in good nick. Does it belong to anyone here?
Westerly Fulmar for sale UK, Westerly boats for sale, Westerly used boat sales, Westerly Sailing Yachts For Sale 1997 Westerly Fulmar 33 - Bilge keel - Apollo Duck
Westerly Fulmar for sale UK, Westerly boats for sale, Westerly used boat sales, Westerly Sailing Yachts For Sale 1997 Westerly Fulmar 33 - Bilge keel - Apollo Duck
Laysula
Well-known member
That's how we started 25 years ago. 21 foot Snapdragon and a rigid tender towed behind.
DFL1010
Active member
Fortunately, times have moved on.
Graham376
Well-known member
An ideal first family boat, with bilge keel can visit drying harbours as well. Much more fun and less restrictive than a small mobo.
ridgy
Well-known member
Very good boats, though that's a little expensive for an old design with not so much room inside.
Have a read of Concertos round britain thread to understand some of the issues faced with making longer passages around or coast.
salad
Active member
Bilge keelers seem thin on the ground in our price range. Have they dropped out of favour? Usually see a bunch of old ones in harbours, 70's/80's.
Are other types of keel suitable for soft grounding? Can't imagine a fin keel being up to it, but this is where I have almost zero knowledge.
salad
Active member
I thought that it was expensive initially but it's had a full refit including a new engine 2 years ago and the condition appears tip top. Theres a Moody 31 that looks very sad and damp for half the price, but I bet it would cost £30k to get it up to the same standard.
