New Benjenbav - spot the difference

[geem]

I do like this view...

That does look remarkably like the VOR70 next to us but on a somewhat smaller scale. It does explain their speed potential but I guess they will be very sensitive to weight being smaller than a VOR70 and having a level of fitout a VOR 70 doesn't have. I like it?

 

[geem]

But it is fair, because in the 70s/80s the average sailing family was on boats from 20 to 35 feet, we used to sail with loads of other families when I was a kid, and anything over 30ft was a palace - now families are in 35 to 45 foot boats - family cruisers start at around 33 feet - and there is no modern eqivalent to the 20 to 25ft pocket cruisers from the 70s/80s - try finding a real equivalent to the Kingfisher 20+ today, four-berth 20 footer with a sea toilet, wet locker, and miniature galley and chart table.

A 40 footer from the 70s/80s was eye wateringly expensive new .... the equivalent now is a 53-55 footer, with air-con, dinghy garage, generator, electric winches, bunny pad, water maker, electric mood lighting, electric sunbathing platform, at least four cabins with en-suite etc. etc. .... sure you can retro-fit some of it into an 80s boat but it will never be a modern boat, and modern manufacturers will never build a 70s/80s design again because there is no market for them.

The big plus is that if boats are looked after, they last a long time, so you can always find something that fits your aspirations, budget, DIY ability and personal taste. Every boat is a compromise, and every sailor buys the compromise they are happy with.

You are right that there is no market for boats like mine. They would simply be way to expensive to build. Airex cored hull and deck, encapsulated lead keel, substantial skeg hung rudder, large deck fittings, bolted through windows, teak interior that is probably responsible for the loss of whole rainforests, built in fuel and water tanks under the floor, she is highly specified in everyway. If you are fortunate enough to find one in good condition then they make great liveaboard cruisers. There are many older European and American boats that are doing just that out here in the Caribbean. The reality is that there is every kind of boat out here that people are sailing on. They all make their choices. What is right for one person is wrong for the next person. A friend of mine wants a steel boat. Don't get me started?

 

[KompetentKrew]

I do like this view...

Reminds me of an X-Yachts I sailed on - an XP44, I think. Was quite a sled - the transom was open at the back and felt quite wide when climbing up it at night to take the wheel.

 

[Daydream believer]

Comparing the height of the operatives against the vertical hull dimension might lead one to wonder that the designer was vertically challenged ( Is one allowed to use the term dwarf on the forum any more?) & that the most likely injuries reported by the crew on long distance trips ( unless also mates of Snow White) would be back ache

 

[Frogmogman]

( Is one allowed to use the term dwarf on the forum any more?)

I think the general rule of thumb is that it is better to avoid labelling people.

 

[Povremeni pomorac]

After having had a wave, apparently out of nowhere in the Straight of Gibraltar, slam into the stern of my 50' centre cockpit with such incredible force that it felt and sounded like a blow with a giant sledge hammer, I cannot imagine having an open stern. There must be cheaper options available to getting a salt water enema.

thanks. Post like this save me an awful lot of money. Just as I am thinking about maybe buying a boat.......

 

[Povremeni pomorac]

I see. Why the stupid name? It's a sun-bed. Nothing long-eared in sight.

That one could be said to resemble a pussy-pad, I s'pose.
.

i think someone meant "Pussy Magnet".

 

[Povremeni pomorac]

Gosh! I thought I was a grumpy old git. Compared to some of you I am just a beginner.

 

[flaming]

Comparing the height of the operatives against the vertical hull dimension might lead one to wonder that the designer was vertically challenged ( Is one allowed to use the term dwarf on the forum any more?) & that the most likely injuries reported by the crew on long distance trips ( unless also mates of Snow White) would be back ache

1. If you have to ask if a particular label is acceptable that's normally a pretty big clue that it isn't. Another really good clue is if you'd use that term to someone it refers to in person,
2. Sam Maunard, the designer, is over 6 foot tall.
3. The boat is reported to have over 6 foot of standing headroom in most of the cabin.

 

[capnsensible]

New Bendytoy 36 - I thought bows went the other way these days?
View attachment 121317

Looks fab. I would have no problem at all having some fun sailing with that in the Solent, the Straits of Gibraltar , the North Sea or anywhere else in coastal waters.

 

[flaming]

Given the source (i.e the builder) you can take it with a fair degree of scepticism, but they report speeds around 17 knots in 18-20 knots with the A5 up. Comment was "Stable and uneventful".
That'll be a top speed, I'd expect the sustained speed to be a little lower, but with only a small kite that's still pretty respectable.

 

[flaming]

First 36 - Sailing yachts For Sale | BENETEAU

The website with lots of pretty pictures etc is now live by the looks of it.

Have to say, I'm liking the look of this boat more and more as it is revealed. Cockpit looks good from a crewed racing point of view, and also as a pretty comfortable cruising boat with the removable bits put back. Interior seems pretty well fitted out and equipped considering the boat's weight. Not convinced about the folding sink in the heads though, surely there was enough space for a permanent sink...?

 

[LONG_KEELER]

First 36 - Sailing yachts For Sale | BENETEAU

The website with lots of pretty pictures etc is now live by the looks of it.

Have to say, I'm liking the look of this boat more and more as it is revealed. Cockpit looks good from a crewed racing point of view, and also as a pretty comfortable cruising boat with the removable bits put back. Interior seems pretty well fitted out and equipped considering the boat's weight. Not convinced about the folding sink in the heads though, surely there was enough space for a permanent sink...?

Lovely looking and appointed boat.

Just a personal thing the plumb stern. To me it still looks like half the boat has been cut off. Still like the boat though.

 

[Frogmogman]

First 36 - Sailing yachts For Sale | BENETEAU

The website with lots of pretty pictures etc is now live by the looks of it.

Have to say, I'm liking the look of this boat more and more as it is revealed. Cockpit looks good from a crewed racing point of view, and also as a pretty comfortable cruising boat with the removable bits put back. Interior seems pretty well fitted out and equipped considering the boat's weight. Not convinced about the folding sink in the heads though, surely there was enough space for a permanent sink...?

Looks really exciting, but I agree with you about the heads. On a boat of this length, personally I’d prefer a two cabin layout, losing one of the two aft cabins and replacing it with a decent sized heads compartment, with room for ample wet hanging space and a decent sized sail locker behind it.

 

[westernman]

First 36 - Sailing yachts For Sale | BENETEAU

The website with lots of pretty pictures etc is now live by the looks of it.

Have to say, I'm liking the look of this boat more and more as it is revealed. Cockpit looks good from a crewed racing point of view, and also as a pretty comfortable cruising boat with the removable bits put back. Interior seems pretty well fitted out and equipped considering the boat's weight. Not convinced about the folding sink in the heads though, surely there was enough space for a permanent sink...?

How about one of these instead?

Pogo 36 - POGO STRUCTURES

Same size, much lighter and therefore faster with a deeper lifting keel. And a proper sink in the heads. Also seems more roomy inside.
One nice thing in the pogo is that you can much better views out from the saloon. Especially forwards.

 

[Frogmogman]

How about one of these instead?

Pogo 36 - POGO STRUCTURES

Same size, much lighter and therefore faster with a deeper lifting keel. And a proper sink in the heads. Also seems more roomy inside.
One nice thing in the pogo is that you can much better views out from the saloon. Especially forwards.

Depends on what you plan to do with it.

If the program is just high speed cruising, then the Pogo is the business. If you want to race to handicap, perhaps not so much.

 

[westernman]

Depends on what you plan to do with it.

If the program is just high speed cruising, then the Pogo is the business. If you want to race to handicap, perhaps not so much.

Why do you think the Beneteau First 36 is better for racing on handicap?

 

[Ingwe]

It certainly looks the business - apart from the heads which just seem too small on the photos for a multipurpose boat. Just need to see some polars and get an idea of a rating to know whether it will be a success or not, but if it can sail to it's rating it looks like the first proper all round mass production cruiser racer in a while.

 

[Frogmogman]

Why do you think the Beneteau First 36 is better for racing on handicap?

The Pogo was very deliberately designed with no reference to any rating system. The First 36’s stated objective is to be as competitive racer cruiser, and has been designed as such.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the Pogo.

 

[flaming]

Why do you think the Beneteau First 36 is better for racing on handicap?

Mostly because there isn't much worse than a POGO for IRC racing. The most recent IRC rating I can find is 1.145. Which means IRC thinks it's significantly faster than a J111, and only a little slower than an IC37....

No doubt it could be an absolute weapon on a reaching course in 20+ knot course, but for anything involving any upwind, it's not going to be competitive at that number....

I would expect the first to be faster around a ww/lw course whilst rating more like 1.100, in the same ballpark as the 111 maybe a little lower.

In addition the cockpit of the First is much better laid out for fully crewed racing. However, if I was looking for a fast cruiser to be sailed by a couple or a family, then the POGO would be ahead of the first, at least without considering price and lead time....