Moving from Brighton to the Med - we're off!

[gjgm]

How is the anchor supposed to be rigged through the rear roller then? A previous owner of my boat had tried running the chain over the roller, and when you launched the anchor, the impact of the chain on the edge of the anchor locker was a lot more than 3-5mm, it had worn away about 15mm (I guess because of the way the Delta launches). I re-rigged it the same as all the other T40's I'd seen - ie under the rear roller, and got the grp repaired.

If you try and route the chain this way with a bigger anchor it simply won't launch. If you're supposed to rig it over the rear roller - then what's the purpose of that roller?

Cheers
Jimmy

Tricky..
Well, looks like a new boat then, Jimmy !

 

[jimmy_the_builder]

Ah sorry I didn't spot that roller. You're right, the chain goes under it. That puts kibosh on 16kg, dang. Only way to do 16kg is extend the cheeks of the anchor tray aftwards by 90mm, so moving the roller back that far, which looks do-able but is a much bigger job obviously.

What about my heath-robinson, er, custom-built 13kg cut-down shaft delta? (I'm thinking of it as the sawn-off shotgun of anchors). Worth a go? Completely stupid idea?

Cheers
Jimmy

 

[Pinnacle]

Are you talking about a Spanish Cala in Mallorca?
If so, Jimmy do you think you will make it to the Balearics sometime?
If so, we could try and get another Wokingham meet over there.

QUOTE]

Yes, Yes and sounds like a plan!

Give me 12 months notice to get there!

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

How is the anchor supposed to be rigged through the rear roller then? A previous owner of my boat had tried running the chain over the roller, and when you launched the anchor, the impact of the chain on the edge of the anchor locker was a lot more than 3-5mm, it had worn away about 15mm (I guess because of the way the Delta launches). I re-rigged it the same as all the other T40's I'd seen - ie under the rear roller, and got the grp repaired.

If you try and route the chain this way with a bigger anchor it simply won't launch. If you're supposed to rig it over the rear roller - then what's the purpose of that roller?

Cheers
Jimmy

Fair point, I didn't notice that the chain went under the rear roller. AFAIK the purpose of the roller is to stop the chain flapping from side to side and lead the chain onto the gypsy at the correct height. Yup looks like fitting a bigger anchor will mean going over the top of the roller so that brings 2 probs, fouling the grp as you say and making sure the chain still feeds on to the gypsy properly. Is that a lifting hatch or a moulding that the chain is fouling? My previous boat (Ferretti 46) had a cut out in the anchor locker hatch like this

The pic shows the new 25kg Delta I fitted in place of the woefully inadequate 15kg Bruce which was fitted originally

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

But just on that jimmy, all these "I've snorkelled" people are not snorkelling in storms. At the point your anchor is about to let go in 35kts of wind the chain (whether 8mm or upgraded to 10mm) will be virtually straight with only a tiny catenary effect and the chain will have long since given up contributing to the hold and it will be only the anchor that holds you, or not.

I know we don't want fred drift but actually you wouldn't be right on that, jfm. Yes sure, if you've only got a short length of chain out, its going to be fairly straight but then you wouldn't have a short length of chain out in 35kts of wind. You'd have at least 3 x, maybe 5x depth and the chain will still be horizontal for a proportion of its length. In fact, it has to be horizontal for the anchor to have a chance of holding because any vertical component in the pulling force will just break the anchor out of the sea bed. Anchors are designed to break out if they're pulled with any upward force.
And yes, I have snorkelled out to look at the anchor in strong winds. The worst conditions we were anchored in were in Ibiza a few years ago when we couldn't get in to a marina and had to anchor for 2 nights in a bay just north of Botafoch (Vincente?). It was blowing a good F6 at times and I was amazed that the anchor was holding because, as you say, the chain looked absolutely ramrod taut from the boat. My SWMBO thought I was mad but I did swim out to look at the anchor; it had buried itself completely in the sand but the most surprising thing was that about half the chain was lying on the sea bed and hardly moving

 

[jfm]

.. it had buried itself completely in the sand but the most surprising thing was that about half the chain was lying on the sea bed and hardly moving

Mike I dont want to write much on this becuase it is drifting the thread but your physics is erm baffling. Stuff doesn't have to visibly move to be doing something. Your snorkelled observation quoted above doesn't mean the anchor isn't doing 99% of the holding. The anchor is indeed doing 99% of the job, and the chain is a mere sideshow, whether still or not. That's why the anchor is buried. And that's why you swapped your Bruce for a Delta But as I said before this belongs on a different thread

 

[jfm]

What about my heath-robinson, er, custom-built 13kg cut-down shaft delta? (I'm thinking of it as the sawn-off shotgun of anchors). Worth a go? Completely stupid idea?

Cheers
Jimmy

I dunno and can only guess. I would wonder whether shortening the shank changes the geometry, but you wouldn't think so, much. The geometry is important though to turn it the correct way up. And then you have the issue that if it slipped insurers (as I know well, you undersntad) will find any excuse not to pay. So I've always been reluctant to play with an anchor's geometry, but I'm happy to be told I'm a wus on that. And you're only talking about cutting 80mm off, which isn't much

It would be worth getting a s/s anchor else you'd have no galvanising on the cut bits

OTOH I guess you'll be fine with the existing anchor Jimmy, and maybe just get more chain ie 70m or so.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Mike I dont want to write much on this becuase it is drifting the thread but your physics is erm baffling. Stuff doesn't have to visibly move to be doing something. Your snorkelled observation quoted above doesn't mean the anchor isn't doing 99% of the holding. The anchor is indeed doing 99% of the job, and the chain is a mere sideshow, whether still or not. That's why the anchor is buried. And that's why you swapped your Bruce for a Delta But as I said before this belongs on a different thread

OK last post from me on this subject on this thread. I didn't explain myself very well. Of course, as the wind gets stronger and the load on the anchor gets larger, the anchor does more of the work but without the catenary effect of the chain, it cannot operate to its max effect. The chain is definitely not a sideshow; it allows the anchor to operate correctly, it absorbs shock loading and provides some holding power on its own through friction with the sea bed.
If you believe the anchor does 99% of the work, I take it that you have chucked the anchor chain supplied by Fairline on Match into the sea and replaced it with an all rope rode? After all, no point in carrying a ton of useless metal up front is there?

 

[jimmy_the_builder]

Right-o. I think in the face of this well-argued debate ... I'm going to do exactly what I mentioned in post #1, which is increase the length of my anchor chain - because there's no doubt that I need to do that. If I find (in some non-terminal way) that the anchor isn't quite up to it, then I'll solve that problem (with a new bow roller) then. (If I find this out in a _terminal_ way, then no doubt I will be following gjgm's sage guidance...).

In the meantime, I'm looking forward to meeting the aircon installers on Wednesday, and getting the boat out of the water on Thursday so I can start drilling some holes in it. Below the waterline.

Cheers
Jimmy

 

[mjf]

JTB- someone on here added wt to an existing Delta - cant remember who/when but I recall it was successful

 

[Richard Shead]

It may have been said before but have you considered a Rocna....

 

[jimmy_the_builder]

It may have been said before but have you considered a Rocna....

Is it an ST34?

Cheers
Jimmy

 

[Richard Shead]

Is it an ST34?

Cheers
Jimmy

I need something to fill my days....

 

[Greg2]

Don't want to prolong the Fred drift on whether it is the anchor or the chain that holds the boat but for what it is worth my naval training on the subject was quite clear...it is the chain that does the work.

I'll get my coat........

 

[jimmy_the_builder]

Don't want to prolong the Fred drift on whether it is the anchor or the chain that holds the boat but for what it is worth my naval training on the subject was quite clear...it is the chain that does the work.

I'll get my coat........

The discussion's been moved over to this new thread, helpfully started by Bajansailor. Might be worth a repost over there?

Cheers
Jimmy

 

[mjf]

and the wt at the end of it that saves you?

 

[jimmy_the_builder]

So the prep work for the med began today. The chaps from Seacraft Marine turned up super-promptly this morning as planned. Conveniently, everyone employed at Seacraft Marine is called Mark, which makes life a bit easier when you've never met them before. Anyway, the Marks are installing the Dometic aircon system. It seems that the first job is to tear the boat to pieces, so once they'd got started I made my excuses and left! A very promising start though, they are good guys and were very receptive to my questions about all the detail of the installation. Here's a Mark that I found down the back of the sofa:

The second visit of the day was from Paul Wilkins at C&J Marine. Paul's refoaming the base of the saloon sofa, and covering a new armrest which I'm adding to one end of the sofa. He took the sofa base cushions away this morning, and with a bit of luck the three refoamed cushions will be back on the boat next week, and the armrest modification will be underway after that.

All things being equal the boat will be lifted tomorrow and while the aircon install continues, RK Marine will get cracking on the leg service. This is all dependent on me turning up early enough to get the boat under the bridge before the tide is too high...

Cheers
Jimmy

 

[jimmy_the_builder]

PS just a quick update on the anchor - it turns out that my prev info was duff, and in fact there is already a 16kg Delta on the boat. Good enough for me.

Cheers
Jimmy

 

[volvopaul]

So the prep work for the med began today. The chaps from Seacraft Marine turned up super-promptly this morning as planned. Conveniently, everyone employed at Seacraft Marine is called Mark, which makes life a bit easier when you've never met them before. Anyway, the Marks are installing the Dometic aircon system. It seems that the first job is to tear the boat to pieces, so once they'd got started I made my excuses and left! A very promising start though, they are good guys and were very receptive to my questions about all the detail of the installation. Here's a Mark that I found down the back of the sofa:

The second visit of the day was from Paul Wilkins at C&J Marine. Paul's refoaming the base of the saloon sofa, and covering a new armrest which I'm adding to one end of the sofa. He took the sofa base cushions away this morning, and with a bit of luck the three refoamed cushions will be back on the boat next week, and the armrest modification will be underway after that.

All things being equal the boat will be lifted tomorrow and while the aircon install continues, RK Marine will get cracking on the leg service. This is all dependent on me turning up early enough to get the boat under the bridge before the tide is too high...

Cheers
Jimmy

Im on my boat now Jimmy, if id have known we could have gone for a beer, will give you a wave tom am if I see you.

Good luck with the move over to the sun, bet you will be wishing the days away from now on till shes tucked up in the sun.

 

[JKay]

PS just a quick update on the anchor - it turns out that my prev info was duff, and in fact there is already a 16kg Delta on the boat. Good enough for me.

Cheers
Jimmy

Enjoy the sun and keep us all in touch with the journey,put the beemer on the bathing platform and then you can ride back