clyst
Well-Known Member
Oh dear got wrong again! Cheers .
Macwester 26 project boat
- Thread starter ropeworkuk
- Start date
Oh dear got wrong again! Cheers .
C
catalac08
Guest
We had a 26 ft macwester for 10 years and did about 10000 nm in that time, Mostly Irish Sea/Eire/wales. I have to admit my bias as we loved the boat and despite some trying times the boat always looked after us and as a budget boat there are not many competitors in the 4-7K price range. Yes there are better boats but they are mostly more expensive or like the Centaurs can have serious structural problems with the hull in the area of the keels. Encapsulated lead keels are a big bonus in an old boat to avoid all the keel bolt issues. The club I was in during the early 90's had 5 different westerleys which required urgent hulls repair so yes centaurs sail a little better than the mac 26 and are prettier (whiter) inside but given the choice in an old boat I would go for the robust if a little crude structure of the macwester.
There are lots of mods to get them sailing better including a bowsprit to achieve a cutter rig (solves weather helm and gives more canvas for light winds in one stroke) a redesign of rudder with some balance section. Jobs like replacing the rubbing strake are messy to do but not enormously expensive (as boating stuff goes).
I see our old boat (now called Ahab) is for sale and looking a little sad and neglected now but at only circa7K (asking) might be worth a look, at Holyhead Marina!
As has been mentioned these boats are not close winded so a good engine is important and although many of these boats will have been re-engined from the original, these will be getting on now and may be due for a third engine now.
There are lots of mods to get them sailing better including a bowsprit to achieve a cutter rig (solves weather helm and gives more canvas for light winds in one stroke) a redesign of rudder with some balance section. Jobs like replacing the rubbing strake are messy to do but not enormously expensive (as boating stuff goes).
I see our old boat (now called Ahab) is for sale and looking a little sad and neglected now but at only circa7K (asking) might be worth a look, at Holyhead Marina!
As has been mentioned these boats are not close winded so a good engine is important and although many of these boats will have been re-engined from the original, these will be getting on now and may be due for a third engine now.
Seajet
...
Wheras an Anderson is
Plan A, Sail - fast-with engine stowed & flush bottom
Plan B, motor- 5hp outboard in a well, easy to take home to work on or even swap !
There is a current scare that 'people' are going around stealing the propellors from boats ashore; this left us A22 owners feeling rather smug, as all our propellors - with engines - are at home.
Inboard engines can be extraordinarily expensive on the tiniest spare part, and it's a serious pain working on them in winter at exposed boatyards etc.
There are 6 Andersons at my club alone now ( Chichester Harbour ).
When I had the Carter 30 fin keeler, it was fast and moderately good for a pose, but I suddenly asked myself " why am I paying all this money to cart around furniture, with something much more restrictive & not so much fun to sail ?" !
If you're young and relatively potless, this is THE boat for you; I'm saying that because I've been there, done it, and never come across a better design.
I don't stand to make anything out of it personally, boats on the website are just members at £7.00 P.A, adverts are free to them.
As you're in Wales, you may be able to moor a fin keeler relatively cheaply, which might open your options to small fin keelers, which due to mooring costs one can barely give away around the Solent, but I see you have homed in on boats which can take the ground which are certainly a better investment.
Plan A, Sail - fast-with engine stowed & flush bottom
Plan B, motor- 5hp outboard in a well, easy to take home to work on or even swap !
There is a current scare that 'people' are going around stealing the propellors from boats ashore; this left us A22 owners feeling rather smug, as all our propellors - with engines - are at home.
Inboard engines can be extraordinarily expensive on the tiniest spare part, and it's a serious pain working on them in winter at exposed boatyards etc.
There are 6 Andersons at my club alone now ( Chichester Harbour ).
When I had the Carter 30 fin keeler, it was fast and moderately good for a pose, but I suddenly asked myself " why am I paying all this money to cart around furniture, with something much more restrictive & not so much fun to sail ?" !
If you're young and relatively potless, this is THE boat for you; I'm saying that because I've been there, done it, and never come across a better design.
I don't stand to make anything out of it personally, boats on the website are just members at £7.00 P.A, adverts are free to them.
As you're in Wales, you may be able to moor a fin keeler relatively cheaply, which might open your options to small fin keelers, which due to mooring costs one can barely give away around the Solent, but I see you have homed in on boats which can take the ground which are certainly a better investment.
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skodster
Well-Known Member
Knowing the Bristol channel fairly well, I would say that the best option is certainly a bilge keeler as there are many brilliant places to dry out on both sides. I have a fin keeler and it's a pain in the a*se in a drying estuary to be honest! Your Anderson is certainly an interesting design but no replacement for a boat capable of sailing up a creek, drying out anywhere and off to the pub with no worries about depth of water!
I reckon it's the next best thing to a hovercraft!
Seajet
...
Your Anderson is certainly an interesting design but no replacement for a boat capable of sailing up a creek, drying out anywhere and off to the pub with no worries about depth
How do you make that out then ?!
I think 'creek crawling with shallow draught' is a bit of a myth anyway, happens quite rarely but when I'm getting back to my mooring with little tide and the keel up, she draws 2' or less if heeled, so if really gagging at near closing time I suspect might beat you to the bar.
She'll settle upright in mud, and apart from exceptional circumstances I would't dry out any boat on hard sand - next question ?!
The real point of lift ( performance but needs inspection / maintenance, see website ) or twin ( need careful looking at and maybe reinforcing for stress, imagine the forces on splayed keels in mud going up & down twice a day ) is -
Cheaper, closer, sheltered moorings !
Pub crawling is an option as long as it begins with seamanship...
How do you make that out then ?!
I think 'creek crawling with shallow draught' is a bit of a myth anyway, happens quite rarely but when I'm getting back to my mooring with little tide and the keel up, she draws 2' or less if heeled, so if really gagging at near closing time I suspect might beat you to the bar.
She'll settle upright in mud, and apart from exceptional circumstances I would't dry out any boat on hard sand - next question ?!
The real point of lift ( performance but needs inspection / maintenance, see website ) or twin ( need careful looking at and maybe reinforcing for stress, imagine the forces on splayed keels in mud going up & down twice a day ) is -
Cheaper, closer, sheltered moorings !
Pub crawling is an option as long as it begins with seamanship...
TamarMike
Well-Known Member
The 27's twin keels are a lot deeper than the 26's and the bow is slightly finer. The Atlanta versions had the option of a deep fin keel, the fin keel boats tend to be cheaper (which is why I got one) but mine is still very poor to windward, I think largely due to the beamy hull which gives totally the wrong underwater profile at more than 15 degrees heel while the blunt bow slows the boat down in a chop (I am however told that I am perhaps expecting too much from a 34 year old mainsail!).
I didn't buy a Sabre I looked at because of the apalling condition of the deck gelcoat compared with Macwesters 10 years older so I presume it is hard to generalise. Also I didn't find the Sabre's accomodation and cockpit as family friendly (and most important of all I don't like the look of them
)
skodster
Well-Known Member
I didn't realise that the Anderson was a lift keel.
I didn't think that lift keels and mud mixed very well? I have seen many lift keel boats with keel boxes jammed with mud.
Seajet
...
Re. mud and lift keels, the impression you have is not completely wrong - for instance Seal 22's & 28's have a vertically lifting keel going through a ballast stub on the bottom of the hull; they do suffer from mud or stones jamming the system if one is unlucky - and the long ballast stub does nothing for handling.
Things like the E-boat have a completely flush hull bottom with the keel raised, ( which leads to pretty awful interiors ) but this leaves the boat horribly vulnerable to any nasty big stone etc on the seabed, I know a boat with this configuration which sank after settling on her own mooring sinker.
E-Boats are faster than Andersons in light winds, but much more of a racing machine, I sailed one with an expert skipper and was impressed by the dinghy class performance but the interior is diabolical and there is the little snag they've been known to capsize and sink, as the ballast ratio is not too spiffing.
The Anderson 22 has a vertically lifting galvanised mild steel keel plate, with a 900lb cast iron ballast bulb on the end, draught from 4'6" to 2'.
The ballast bulb is veed on top so as to fair in with the hull when raised, on my soft mud mooring she settles more upright than the twin keelers, with the bulb sunk in and a small area of the hull in contact with the mud.
Never had any problem with stones etc, and she's been there since 1978.
These boats are very stiff & seaworthy, 3 have crossed the Atlantic and one was prepared for the last Jester race but couldn't make it due to work; they have a good interior for 22' and good backup, spares are available.
As a newbie to this forum I don't know how to include photo's yet, so if vaguely interested please see
www.anderson22class.co.uk - the 'Buyers' Guide'section probably being best for a quick overview.
PBO and Sailing Today have both conducted 'Buying Secondhand' reviews using my boat - I run the Owners Association, which is pretty active - both magazines seemed very keen.
I don't make anything out of this myself, just think the OP sounds like an obvious candidate for a fast, seaworthy & fun boat !
Things like the E-boat have a completely flush hull bottom with the keel raised, ( which leads to pretty awful interiors ) but this leaves the boat horribly vulnerable to any nasty big stone etc on the seabed, I know a boat with this configuration which sank after settling on her own mooring sinker.
E-Boats are faster than Andersons in light winds, but much more of a racing machine, I sailed one with an expert skipper and was impressed by the dinghy class performance but the interior is diabolical and there is the little snag they've been known to capsize and sink, as the ballast ratio is not too spiffing.
The Anderson 22 has a vertically lifting galvanised mild steel keel plate, with a 900lb cast iron ballast bulb on the end, draught from 4'6" to 2'.
The ballast bulb is veed on top so as to fair in with the hull when raised, on my soft mud mooring she settles more upright than the twin keelers, with the bulb sunk in and a small area of the hull in contact with the mud.
Never had any problem with stones etc, and she's been there since 1978.
These boats are very stiff & seaworthy, 3 have crossed the Atlantic and one was prepared for the last Jester race but couldn't make it due to work; they have a good interior for 22' and good backup, spares are available.
As a newbie to this forum I don't know how to include photo's yet, so if vaguely interested please see
www.anderson22class.co.uk - the 'Buyers' Guide'section probably being best for a quick overview.
PBO and Sailing Today have both conducted 'Buying Secondhand' reviews using my boat - I run the Owners Association, which is pretty active - both magazines seemed very keen.
I don't make anything out of this myself, just think the OP sounds like an obvious candidate for a fast, seaworthy & fun boat !
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chrishelen
N/A
I think i read an article in a mag last year about a long waiting list to buy a good used Anderson 22.
that if true speaks volumes.
that if true speaks volumes.
Seajet
...
Chrishelen,
Well I always have a list of prospective buyers, most of whom if keen join the association so as to get more information & join the private forum, even before they get a boat.
The last really good ( modified, ) standard one was sold before she was even advertised, but the sale fell through as the buyer lost his job so as far as I know 'Windsong' is for sale, see website.
As I'm at pains to point out, I don't get a commission or anything, it's free for members to advertise.
Andersons vary greatly in standard of fit out, but the great thing is it's an all wood interior so anyone handy can sort things out to suit themselves, I have the original builders' plans and am in contact with the ex-M.D. of Andersons, who has funded everything from spare keels to anchor well lids and outboard well fairing plugs.
We were very seriously considering putting the boat back into production as Patrick ( the ex-M.D. ) has the moulds, but it was beginning to look like more of a project than we could handle; this is still 'pending', we're looking for some support really, there was talk of the design being used for boatbuilder training but I don't know if anything will come of it.
If anyone fancies a look around or a sail next season, they're welcome, I'm based in Chichester Harbour, andylaw119@hotmail.com
- but my boat is not for sale at any price ! As I mentioned, I tried a larger boat, but always missed the Anderson and managed to buy 'Silent Running' back.
I think so far she's done 24 Cross Channels, and been in 55 knot squalls ( she was happy even if I wasn't, unintentional I would add ! ).
The website is at www.anderson22class.co.uk
-there are reviews available from the magazines concerned, please contact me.
As I say I don't make anything out of this, in fact the opposite, but it's a labour of love, and as the design has done so much for me, the least I can do is a little support !
Photo below courtesy of Rick Buettner, 'Sailing Today' magazine.
Well I always have a list of prospective buyers, most of whom if keen join the association so as to get more information & join the private forum, even before they get a boat.
The last really good ( modified, ) standard one was sold before she was even advertised, but the sale fell through as the buyer lost his job so as far as I know 'Windsong' is for sale, see website.
As I'm at pains to point out, I don't get a commission or anything, it's free for members to advertise.
Andersons vary greatly in standard of fit out, but the great thing is it's an all wood interior so anyone handy can sort things out to suit themselves, I have the original builders' plans and am in contact with the ex-M.D. of Andersons, who has funded everything from spare keels to anchor well lids and outboard well fairing plugs.
We were very seriously considering putting the boat back into production as Patrick ( the ex-M.D. ) has the moulds, but it was beginning to look like more of a project than we could handle; this is still 'pending', we're looking for some support really, there was talk of the design being used for boatbuilder training but I don't know if anything will come of it.
If anyone fancies a look around or a sail next season, they're welcome, I'm based in Chichester Harbour, andylaw119@hotmail.com
- but my boat is not for sale at any price ! As I mentioned, I tried a larger boat, but always missed the Anderson and managed to buy 'Silent Running' back.
I think so far she's done 24 Cross Channels, and been in 55 knot squalls ( she was happy even if I wasn't, unintentional I would add ! ).
The website is at www.anderson22class.co.uk
-there are reviews available from the magazines concerned, please contact me.
As I say I don't make anything out of this, in fact the opposite, but it's a labour of love, and as the design has done so much for me, the least I can do is a little support !
Photo below courtesy of Rick Buettner, 'Sailing Today' magazine.
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chrishelen
N/A
Sorry it wasnt meant to be a negative comment and i dont want to put people off looking for one of these boats with a view to buying,
I am sure ther are lots of good used Anderson 22 for sale.
I am sure ther are lots of good used Anderson 22 for sale.
Seajet
...
Actually I took it as a positive comment, don't know if you meant there are lots, but good ones are rare, I thought you meant good ones are sought after, which they are !
In fact there are never many Anderson 22's of any sort for sale, and recently I've had more enquiries than ever, I've guessed partly as we had a good summer, partly because as the recession hits people are looking for a good boat which will go on cheap half-tide moorings.
In fact there are never many Anderson 22's of any sort for sale, and recently I've had more enquiries than ever, I've guessed partly as we had a good summer, partly because as the recession hits people are looking for a good boat which will go on cheap half-tide moorings.
alexrunic
Well-Known Member
There are several Mac westers in our club including Nick Robinsons off this thread, they are bomb proof boats the 27 is a much better boat than the 26 and do fetch more money and do sail better, both require a good wind to get going. I own a Mac wester Rowan 22 and it's quicker and points better than either the 26 or 27 in winds less than a force 4 but they have the edge off the wind if it's much stronger.
NickRobinson
Well-Known Member
Hi Alex-
Did the pressure washer work?
Nick (who really must get to the boat and start the winter jobs......)
Did the pressure washer work?
Nick (who really must get to the boat and start the winter jobs......)
alexrunic
Well-Known Member
yes mate they are all looking a lot cleaner, it did not get the barnacles off or weed but least the dreaded gib mud has gone.
I know what you mean I've only been down once and that was to build a new bridge not to do any work on my own boat. It will soon be Christmas lol. Might get down the weekend after next busy busy!!
Bosun Higgs
N/A
We have two at our club. One sank completely and the other is currently having one of its bilge keels glued and bolted back on - after having the other keel done a few years ago.
Seajet
...
Bosun Higgs,
Are these keels encapsulated ? I thought they were but this isn't a design I've been involved with apart from helping an owner crane one out years ago, and sailing straight past them which doesn't take a genius in a normal boat !
If re-bolting keels which are encapsulated, I can imagine the process, also that a great deal of hassle would be involved...
Are these keels encapsulated ? I thought they were but this isn't a design I've been involved with apart from helping an owner crane one out years ago, and sailing straight past them which doesn't take a genius in a normal boat !
If re-bolting keels which are encapsulated, I can imagine the process, also that a great deal of hassle would be involved...
NickRobinson
Well-Known Member
Hi
Keels encapsulated, with two huge studs/nuts/saddle inside the boat. No external join or seam.
Magna's second owner told me he bought her after the first owner had sunk her in Ramsgate after hooking a keel on the wrong side of submerged piling on a falling tide and removing it.
Only 29 years ago.... I wonder if the repair's out of warranty!
Nick.
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