Blue Sunray
Well-known member
...but not, I suspect, on the Norfolk Broads?
Independence | Upadates & Cruising
- Thread starter londonrascal
- Start date
...but not, I suspect, on the Norfolk Broads?
londonrascal
New member
I just popped over to Simrad and worked out the rough backbone of the system I had wanted to have put in when the boat was in Plymouth, and this will be the basis of the what will go in now it is in Norfolk.
Although technology does indeed move on all the time, just as with laptops, tablets and smartphones the majority of the features have reached a plateau where the look and feel remains little changed from new model to new model and just a few improvements are made with cameras and sensors working a little faster and so on year on year - take Samsung and Apple neither have made a ground breaking change of late.
The same can be said for games consoles - so the current crop of high end navigational gear won't be making any super strides forward like it has over the last five years as an example. I expect the main improvements will be with mapping (which is down to a lot of third parties and more crowd sourced data) and this further refined to bringer faster draw times and speed. Higher pixel density screens will come which will offer less zooming in to show as much detail, but I doubt we are going to see a massive change in the next ten years other than software which may well work on the current crop of new hardware with updates but time will tell.
As for coming to sell and the new gear being out of date, that depends how long you keep something for before you move on and up.
- AutoPilot Controller: AP48
- AutoPilot Computer : NAC-3
- Drive Unit: RPU160
- Rudder Feedback Units RF3000
- Four IS42 Colour Repeater modules
- 4ft Open Array HALO Radar
- 16" NSS Evo 3 Multifunction Scteen for lower helm
- 12" NSS Evo 3 Multifunction Screen for upper helm
- GPS Smart Antenna and combined solid State Compass HS70
- 9" R20009 dedicated Radar Control Unit (Controller and Screen)
- Structure Scan 3D transponder and controller
- AIS Class B Transponder - NAIS500
Although technology does indeed move on all the time, just as with laptops, tablets and smartphones the majority of the features have reached a plateau where the look and feel remains little changed from new model to new model and just a few improvements are made with cameras and sensors working a little faster and so on year on year - take Samsung and Apple neither have made a ground breaking change of late.
The same can be said for games consoles - so the current crop of high end navigational gear won't be making any super strides forward like it has over the last five years as an example. I expect the main improvements will be with mapping (which is down to a lot of third parties and more crowd sourced data) and this further refined to bringer faster draw times and speed. Higher pixel density screens will come which will offer less zooming in to show as much detail, but I doubt we are going to see a massive change in the next ten years other than software which may well work on the current crop of new hardware with updates but time will tell.
As for coming to sell and the new gear being out of date, that depends how long you keep something for before you move on and up.
ashtead
Well-known member
When's the next instalment of your vid due Robin ?
londonrascal
New member
Short answer is when I get round to editing it (and some other material too) - there is not much more to come however because I did not film too much after we left Brighton, well actually much after we past Eastbourne as we began to hit the rougher stuff which built up more as we went. With hindsight I wished I had even if it was a case of wedging the camera somewhere and letting it just run.
sorabain
Member
I imagine a fair few questions could be asked about many "sea" leisure boats that spend all their time < 2 miles from the coast but have much greater capabilities, or those with high performance sports cars that never see a track.
I assumed that he's keeping it on the broads and might use it there predominantly, but has the capability to take it out to sea if/when he wished.
Nigelpickin
Active member
The Simrad EVO 3's will be great - we have the B&G equivalent and really impressed with them. Responsive, crisp and communicate well with IOS and other data feeds. Ours have built in Predict Wind so we can overlay weather based route planning which is fun.
Personally I wouldn't bother with the R2009 as its a bit clunky and ugly compared to your MDU's and I always keep the radar on and overlaid on the main plotter or split if need be but you might be trying to fill some space on the helm...
I'd also look at integrating a sound system, like a fusion, with the system as it's nice to be able to control everything from the main control...
£40k is easily spend on this kind of gear but it'll transform the way you feel about the boat - I'm not sure that keeping the boat on the 'Broads should even raise an eyebrow when you consider the value of dead stock sitting in most marinas - you've already done the sea time to qualify for this kind of fit out
and I agree that whilst you won't get a £ return on the investment; It'll make independence easier to move on if/when the time comes....As for coming to sell and the new gear being out of date, that depends how long you keep something for before you move on and up.
Should we look forward to a new boat thread anytime soon?
londonrascal
New member
Oh that would be telling, we would not want to have a 'Delia' effect on brokerages in Norfolk if I was to go shopping now would we.
General Update:
I will work on the next instalment of the Blog, plus an update filmed two weekends ago onboard as soon as I can as I know people are eager. To be honest, there is not too much left to come in the delivery Blog because once we past Eastbourne things began getting lively and continued to as we progressed along the coast get ever more rough. I should have perhaps just got the camera wedged somewhere and left it roll to have given some insight but at the time it really was not on my mind as we had fishing pots you would see then loose sight of as another bunch of water covered the screens or a wave trough took you out of sight of it so you had to be focused on that together with float switches sticking and Charlie bravely off down to investigate while being flung around making something that was a piece of cake when alongside a real challenge especially the further forward you go lifting off the cabin sole as the boat's bow became air bourne for a couple of seconds prior to meeting the next wave and burying itself again.
So, this is just to rely some information I have had from Norfolk Yacht Agency (NYA) who have begun working on the boat this morning. I cannot praise them enough - an email and a phone call to go over things they have been working on and finding out issues and I am learning yet more about this fuel system, the tanks and the manifold.
Firstly they carefully removed the fuel stand pipe from the centre tank but found the tank under pressure still and full. so it was quickly back in investigations begun on just how the tank was getting fed with fuel even though four separate valves in the balance pipe connecting the centre tank to the two wing tanks were closed. A lot of head scratching later and turns out the fuel delivery manifold is supplying fuel to the centre tank (return balance) all the time - even when there is no engine/generator running - and since the main large diameter balance pipe was closed, all the pressure was heading down a much smaller copper pipe 'injecting' fuel into the tank - this fuel therefore needs somewhere to go - up the vent pipe until it reaches the level with the wing tanks - and you have a split in the vent pipe as we know I do, you get the fuel coming out there again. Of course when I have the heater running or generator trying to take pressure and fuel out the centre tank, the pressure is greatly reduced which means I was lulled into thinking it was getting better - but leave it all off for a few days and it is returns just as bad as ever it was.
So NYA traced all the lines from the manifold and worked out if they turned off the centre return feed in the engine room and then also the main fuel shut off under the saloon seating this fully isolated the fuel system and fuel stopped entering the centre tank once and for all. They then could drain some out and begin working on the stand pipe for the heater fuel supply. Just as in Plymouth with people working on the fuel system and so on I am loosing more fuel this way than I am burning it so I think a spring time trip out and top up at Broom will be in order.
NYA then had a look generally at the heater installation, I have to say it never looked that great and there are a number of connections where the ducting joins together which were loose (literally had come apart) but it has transpired the heater bracket that the heater sits on and the heater that sits on to the bracket was loose. They could not understand how all the fasteners would universally have come loose to the same degree, so can only presume they were finger tight to begin. NYA have now gone over this and secured all the fasteners. They are now working on what the best course of action will be as per the vent pipe split form the centre fuel tank. Not only to cause it to comply with the BSS but also so it cannot split again by being able to rub agaisnt anything else.
I thought be nice to update the thread with this while I am able before I can post some more videos.
RIB Naming
As you know, some time back I put out the idea of people naming the RIB and some interesting names were put forward, however you will also note I did not promote the 'naming of the RIB' idea too much because I frankly I had not figured out the best way to run such a competition - would I just pick a name I liked? Or would I put names to a vote etc so in the end I put the idea on hold.
In the mean time Shiela has been talking about the RIB a lot - she is dead keen on this and has ideas about us taking it out to the likes of Bargate, dropping a mud weight and having a picnic or going to the Surlingham Ferry on it for a meal. She also came up with a name. Now she looks after two toddlers as a Nanny, and for some reason they have called her ' Picca' and she said why not called the RIB this? Well I liked it because it is very unusual, sounds cute, and has some meaning behind it representing Shiela so that is the name we are going with for the RIB so I need to get the RIB cleaned up, get some new tie down straps, a cover and some decals for the new name.
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londonrascal
New member
I have just finished editing the final part of the delivery trip Blog, and I have to say depending on the mood you are in does rather change how you produce content. Going over things and narrating how I was feeling at the time brought things back as to what everyone dealt with and contributed.
I can't post the finished video just yet, as it is going to have to render overnight so tomorrow late afternoon expect it to be ready to watch on You Tube, but what I can share now is the short segment. This shows some of the memories, prior to our leaving, during and up to arriving in Great Yarmouth. It shows the photos, that covered our journey and the crew who did so much and without whom none of this would have been possible, finally not to mention the safe, incredibly well built Trader 535 - Independence herself.
I can't post the finished video just yet, as it is going to have to render overnight so tomorrow late afternoon expect it to be ready to watch on You Tube, but what I can share now is the short segment. This shows some of the memories, prior to our leaving, during and up to arriving in Great Yarmouth. It shows the photos, that covered our journey and the crew who did so much and without whom none of this would have been possible, finally not to mention the safe, incredibly well built Trader 535 - Independence herself.
Mr Googler
Well-known member
Pm sent :encouragement:
londonrascal
New member
Well it has taken sometime to get to this point, but here the last in the series of videos charting the delivery of Independence to Norfolk. Thanks to those who helped and did so much for so little and while some might question the choices that were taken at times, not to mention my own decisions overall looking back on things and seeing how well the Trader 535 did does make me proud. If you just like to see a boat in a bit of a chop then you will likely enjoy this video:
KevB
Active member
I don't know the answer to this or whether it's relevant but when people spec new boat electronics do they consider whether it's Galileo compatible or is everything compatible by default. Or doesn't it matter?
londonrascal
New member
Since the Galileo system won't have its full compliment of satellites until 2020 I can't really say it is a 'grown up' navigation system, but when it is fully operational and mature it will certainly perform better than the American GPS system in terms of accuracy. However, there is already the Russian GLONASS system (it and GPS are the only two that offer true global coverage) China and India have semi-global systems.
Now most Android phones and Apple phones support both GPS and GLONASS out the box, I know not if manufactures of marine gear also offer this, but if they do then it would seem sensible to add support for Galileo system in time - it would surly be just an updated chip capable of receiving the different frequencies of the Galileo system along with GPS and GLONASS.
Now most Android phones and Apple phones support both GPS and GLONASS out the box, I know not if manufactures of marine gear also offer this, but if they do then it would seem sensible to add support for Galileo system in time - it would surly be just an updated chip capable of receiving the different frequencies of the Galileo system along with GPS and GLONASS.
KevB
Active member
Just googled, seems some are already offering marine Galileo enabled devices.
http://www.usegalileo.eu/EN/inner.html#data=maritime
If you have a recent Snapdragon chipped phone it'll be able to see Galileo sats.
http://www.usegalileo.eu/EN/inner.html#data=maritime
If you have a recent Snapdragon chipped phone it'll be able to see Galileo sats.
jrudge
Well-known member
Do bear in mind that most systems have a remote GPS receiver and they are cheap - £100 odd. If it became a need to have compatibility with more then one system I am sure you would just change the GPS mushroom.
KevB
Active member
True, but the GPS antenna listed above is £1700... I think
londonrascal
New member
The HS70 is about £1,700 odd because it includes:
- A Heading Sensor
- GPS
- A Rate of Turn Sensor
- Integrated Gyro and Tilt Sensors
bluetooth
Active member
Quite an emotional video Robin. Brings tear to the eye. (Not least as ive been caught in some heavy stuff and wished i was back in land). Well done for showing.
petem
Well-known member
Robin, an interesting video, thanks for sharing. Good quality footage too.
Some observations / queries...
1) The Fairline (or whatever is was) at the start was much closer to the shore. I wonder if that might have offered you better shelter? Same comment applied after Dungeness.
2) I'm curious to know, how do you transmit your AIS? Is it from your nav gear or an app on your phone?
3) Looks like with a bit of speed on the forward porthole can get submerged. Definitely have to check that one is closed before setting out!
4) Regarding your panic attack. I wonder what would have happened if your mates weren't with you. Perhaps adrenaline might have kicked in and you'd have reacted differently (self preservation and all that)?
5) Your vid has reminded me why I don't like doing out if there's any chance of my cockpit getting splashed!
Pete
Some observations / queries...
1) The Fairline (or whatever is was) at the start was much closer to the shore. I wonder if that might have offered you better shelter? Same comment applied after Dungeness.
2) I'm curious to know, how do you transmit your AIS? Is it from your nav gear or an app on your phone?
3) Looks like with a bit of speed on the forward porthole can get submerged. Definitely have to check that one is closed before setting out!
4) Regarding your panic attack. I wonder what would have happened if your mates weren't with you. Perhaps adrenaline might have kicked in and you'd have reacted differently (self preservation and all that)?
5) Your vid has reminded me why I don't like doing out if there's any chance of my cockpit getting splashed!
Pete
londonrascal
New member
Hi Pete,
1. Yes the Fairline was closer to the coast and it did look far calmer there, but having been delayed leaving Brighton we opted for a 'mid way' course that was closer in shore than the first plan, but far enough out to reduce distance (straighter line) to get to Ramsgate in the shortest time which as it happened did not happen but we still cut down overall millage doing that.
2. I used the Marine Traffic App - then added on the 'Cruise Mode' and you put in your MMSI number, photo of boat, size and so on and hey presto if you have a data connection it will send your position, speed and so on back to a server than then will send it to one of the many radio stations (many of which people run on an amateur basis) that sends our your data over VHF. Equally VHF signals are received by these stations and populate the AIS Apps and websites we are all familiar with. Cheap and easy to use and since most people are in sight of land and since most have a smartphone or tablet little reason not to use AIS.
3. Yes the port lights at the bow do get a hammering - nice to know they are sturdy stuff and have laminated glass in them. Charlie did leave one open upon leaving Dover for a while before Howard noticed sea water rushing in to the forward passageway, I lost two cushions I did not much care for but other than a lot of salt water to clean up no lasting damage even the carpet dried out ok.
What annoyed me was the fact I literally slowed down and then 'crashed'. It was not a panic,, sweating, scared feeling more just firstly what the hell is going on with me, then omg I can't seem to stop feeling like this, then heaps of guilt and before long it was a spiral. We were going into waves then where the anchor would be burred and bow safely rails half submerged. Do you know what I kept thinking though and had spoken to Shiela about the day before in Brighton was the rolling of the boat and this Forum. I just kept going over my mind when all the discussions had taken place and somehow they added up to this worry of what would happen if the sea we were headed into bow first was to change to a beam sea. The fact is the following day, just passed the Thames Estuary that's exactly what they were facing - hour after hour of it far far worse seas than when we approached Dover but they were fine, the boat was too so as ever so much of it was in my mind.
4. I recon if alone or short handed, yeah I would have dealt with it differently and more logically - I might inside feel one thing but I have been in some pretty worrying situations in the past like crashes on a bus and you just switch from the panic and fear to I am ok let's get out and help mode. Maybe having others there doing things made me feel more as a passenger - more helpless even I am not sure.
5. You know the part where we were headed past the Seven Sisters - shortly after the sea swell grew, our bow rope that was formally neat and secured on the bow got lifted up and moved, then with each passing wave that came over was pushed ever more closer to the edge of the deck. Howard suited up and went out to re-secure it heading down the side decks two hands and on all fours. I think that was the most worrying moment of the entire trip - him out there for one or the rope going over and getting sucked into a prop.
1. Yes the Fairline was closer to the coast and it did look far calmer there, but having been delayed leaving Brighton we opted for a 'mid way' course that was closer in shore than the first plan, but far enough out to reduce distance (straighter line) to get to Ramsgate in the shortest time which as it happened did not happen but we still cut down overall millage doing that.
2. I used the Marine Traffic App - then added on the 'Cruise Mode' and you put in your MMSI number, photo of boat, size and so on and hey presto if you have a data connection it will send your position, speed and so on back to a server than then will send it to one of the many radio stations (many of which people run on an amateur basis) that sends our your data over VHF. Equally VHF signals are received by these stations and populate the AIS Apps and websites we are all familiar with. Cheap and easy to use and since most people are in sight of land and since most have a smartphone or tablet little reason not to use AIS.
3. Yes the port lights at the bow do get a hammering - nice to know they are sturdy stuff and have laminated glass in them. Charlie did leave one open upon leaving Dover for a while before Howard noticed sea water rushing in to the forward passageway, I lost two cushions I did not much care for but other than a lot of salt water to clean up no lasting damage even the carpet dried out ok.
What annoyed me was the fact I literally slowed down and then 'crashed'. It was not a panic,, sweating, scared feeling more just firstly what the hell is going on with me, then omg I can't seem to stop feeling like this, then heaps of guilt and before long it was a spiral. We were going into waves then where the anchor would be burred and bow safely rails half submerged. Do you know what I kept thinking though and had spoken to Shiela about the day before in Brighton was the rolling of the boat and this Forum. I just kept going over my mind when all the discussions had taken place and somehow they added up to this worry of what would happen if the sea we were headed into bow first was to change to a beam sea. The fact is the following day, just passed the Thames Estuary that's exactly what they were facing - hour after hour of it far far worse seas than when we approached Dover but they were fine, the boat was too so as ever so much of it was in my mind.
4. I recon if alone or short handed, yeah I would have dealt with it differently and more logically - I might inside feel one thing but I have been in some pretty worrying situations in the past like crashes on a bus and you just switch from the panic and fear to I am ok let's get out and help mode. Maybe having others there doing things made me feel more as a passenger - more helpless even I am not sure.
5. You know the part where we were headed past the Seven Sisters - shortly after the sea swell grew, our bow rope that was formally neat and secured on the bow got lifted up and moved, then with each passing wave that came over was pushed ever more closer to the edge of the deck. Howard suited up and went out to re-secure it heading down the side decks two hands and on all fours. I think that was the most worrying moment of the entire trip - him out there for one or the rope going over and getting sucked into a prop.
Murv
Well-known member
Having seen you in action with the suspected fire incident on the broads, I don't doubt you'd have handled it very differently on your own.
With such a capable crew to hand, emotionally detaching from the situation would have been a very easy, and completely understandable, "way out!"
The worst I had was when I was very new to boating, and a very bad decision saw me out and anchored on a force 7 wind over tide in a 22' desperately unreliable planing boat. Long story short but after sawing through the anchor warp after the bow roller broke off, we made it back in after thinking that each crashing wave would be the last thing we'd ever see. Not sure it would have gone so well if I hadn't been forced into being solely in charge of the boat. Adrenaline and blind fear are powerful things!
I must admit I did cringe seeing that rope on the bow, mine are always tied up on the rails unless it's flat calm but lots of people do it without issue so it's not a criticism.
Anyway, it was an ambitious plan that worked well and the objective was achieved, so feel proud!
With such a capable crew to hand, emotionally detaching from the situation would have been a very easy, and completely understandable, "way out!"
The worst I had was when I was very new to boating, and a very bad decision saw me out and anchored on a force 7 wind over tide in a 22' desperately unreliable planing boat. Long story short but after sawing through the anchor warp after the bow roller broke off, we made it back in after thinking that each crashing wave would be the last thing we'd ever see. Not sure it would have gone so well if I hadn't been forced into being solely in charge of the boat. Adrenaline and blind fear are powerful things!
I must admit I did cringe seeing that rope on the bow, mine are always tied up on the rails unless it's flat calm but lots of people do it without issue so it's not a criticism.
Anyway, it was an ambitious plan that worked well and the objective was achieved, so feel proud!