EU/ex UK residents applying for new UK driving licence ?

[billskip]

Yes, I made a mistake, one can have dual citizenship but not it seems dual nationality - Difference Between Nationality and Citizenship (with Comparison Chart) - Key Differences

This is the problem with all these things. Another country another language another definition of a word.

If the Spanish chose to use the word nationalization meaning it to mean their choice of definition, it's not for me to question,the English choice of definition doesn't mean the Spanish is wrong, it's only wrong to the English pedant.

 

[billskip]

Yes, I made a mistake, one can have dual citizenship but not it seems dual nationality - Difference Between Nationality and Citizenship (with Comparison Chart) - Key Differences

Quote:-
Each country has its own nationality laws based on its own policy. Persons may have dual nationality by automatic operation of different laws rather than by choice. For example, a child born in a foreign country to U.S. national parents may be both a U.S. national and a national of the country of birth.

 

[Graham376]

Quote:-
Each country has its own nationality laws based on its own policy. Persons may have dual nationality by automatic operation of different laws rather than by choice. For example, a child born in a foreign country to U.S. national parents may be both a U.S. national and a national of the country of birth.

Where does that quote come from? Doesn't seem to appear in the link I gave, which says :-

Can it be possible to have nationality/citizenship of multiple countries?

No, a person can be national of only one country.

Wherever one looks there are so many contradictions it's impossible to know which one's correct.

 

[billskip]

Where does that quote come from? Doesn't seem to appear in the link I gave, which says :-

Can it be possible to have nationality/citizenship of multiple countries?

No, a person can be national of only one country.

Wherever one looks there are so many contradictions it's impossible to know which one's correct.

It was from one of the google search I copied and pasted...but as said it really does appear to be dependent on the countries own laws and definition.
I was discussing it with Tibi and she says her son is Venezuelan, but has Dutch citizenship . The Venezuelan government want her son to denounce his Venezuelan nationality. I said to Tibi how can he do that, he cant change where he was born, Tibi said it's the law in Venezuela.

 

[st599]

Where does that quote come from? Doesn't seem to appear in the link I gave, which says :-

Can it be possible to have nationality/citizenship of multiple countries?

No, a person can be national of only one country.

Wherever one looks there are so many contradictions it's impossible to know which one's correct.

Not only is a person born of US parents a US citizen, the US tax them on income made anywhere in the world. I have a colleague who has never set foot in America who gets a letter from the IRS every year.

 

[25931]

It was from one of the google search I copied and pasted...but as said it really does appear to be dependent on the countries own laws and definition.
I was discussing it with Tibi and she says her son is Venezuelan, but has Dutch citizenship . The Venezuelan government want her son to denounce his Venezuelan nationality. I said to Tibi how can he do that, he cant change where he was born, Tibi said it's the law in Venezuela.

Things appearing on Google are often wrong.

 

[Alicatt]

Exchanged my UK licence for a Belgian one last December, had to get a medical for the bus and truck classes on the licence and will have to renew my medical every 3 years.

My wife has been warned about driving my car in Belgium as it is/was a UK registered vehicle at the time not only would she get a fine but she would also have to pay the back tax on the car from the time it entered the country which for mine is about €6k per annum, consequently she never drove the car in Belgium again

Also in December I took my car to a local garage and got them to convert it to a light freight by removing the seatbelts and rear seats, the car has been tested and homologated and now imported to Belgium tax on it is now €158 per annum, insurance is a lot more expensive, third party only is just over €400 per annum where before I was paying around £360 for fully comp, the insurance companies won't even quote for fully comp here, the car is over 4 years old and they are not really interested.

2 years ago I got hit in the rear door by a car reversing out of a parking spot, when I took the car to the garage they said, age of the car and needing a door = write off, all it needed was a door skin and a lick of paint, in total just over £1k worth of repair, here they quoted €6k.

Now, mind you, the car is almost 14 years old and has done 173k km I've had it since new and it was built to my spec, left hand drive and complies with Belgian traffic regulations. The car was valued at €4500 as a passenger car and now €19k as a light freight

 

[sailaboutvic]

One new year Eve a fews years ago my partner who Dutch ask if I wouldn't mind driving her mum car as I don't really drink that much . In Holland it's the car that's insured not the driver . It just happen a neighbour was a police officer and we being not sure of the rules we ask and was told it was illegal for me to drive it on my UK license .
Reading what some have wrote here I suspect the rule are the same in the EU .

 

[25931]

One new year Eve a fews years ago my partner who Dutch ask if I wouldn't mind driving her mum car as I don't really drink that much . In Holland it's the car that's insured not the driver . It just happen a neighbour was a police officer and we being not sure of the rules we ask and was told it was illegal for me to drive it on my UK license .
Reading what some have wrote here I suspect the rule are the same in the EU .

In Portugal it is the car which is insured and can certainly be drven on a UK licence by someone who is not a resident but residents must have a Portuguese licence.

 

[Alicatt]

One new year Eve a fews years ago my partner who Dutch ask if I wouldn't mind driving her mum car as I don't really drink that much . In Holland it's the car that's insured not the driver . It just happen a neighbour was a police officer and we being not sure of the rules we ask and was told it was illegal for me to drive it on my UK license .
Reading what some have wrote here I suspect the rule are the same in the EU .

My last UK licence was an EU one, checking on that I was informed both by police and insurance agent that it was legal for me to drive a Belgian car with that licence and that it was the vehicle that was covered to be driven and not the particular driver.
The insurance system here is very different than in the UK and to put my own mind at rest sought out the info and legalities.

In 2007 I bought a motorbike in Belgium, insured it and taxed it for the road, I had no problems at all in doing any of that. I have ridden the bike in the UK and it was only after the incident with my soon to be wife in driving my car that I found out about a Belgian not being able to drive a foreign registered vehicle in their own country unless they were in the process of importing it or it was a company car or a hire car. Even in the process of importing vehicle you only have a limited amount of time in which you can drive the vehicle and the number plates as well as insurance are time limited.

 

[billskip]

2 Quotes from Google

Their insurance will tell you but usually drivers with a full license over the age of 26 can drive covered under the insurance with the consent of the policyholder. You can therefore drive anyone elses car provided you have their permission. ...Aug 4, 2009

Yes, as long as you have a valid driving licence and, if necessary, an International Driving Permit. Check your insurance carefully to see if you're covered to drive someone else's car abroad, including any restrictions on driving abroad. ..I

 

[Alicatt]

2 Quotes from Google

Their insurance will tell you but usually drivers with a full license over the age of 26 can drive covered under the insurance with the consent of the policyholder. You can therefore drive anyone elses car provided you have their permission. ...Aug 4, 2009

Yes, as long as you have a valid driving licence and, if necessary, an International Driving Permit. Check your insurance carefully to see if you're covered to drive someone else's car abroad, including any restrictions on driving abroad. ..I

My insurance policies have usually stated that I am allowed to drive anyone else's vehicle as long as it is not hired, leased or on hire purchase to me and that I have 3rd party insurance while driving said vehicle.
Motorcycle policies I've had were what is normally called garage policies and that I was covered to drive any other motorcycle with fully comprehensive cover, these policies are now very hard to get.

In 2007 I had a Yamaha YZF-R1, it was insured fully comp with extended EU coverage for up to a year, summer 2007 while at a car event at Circuit Zolder my R1 was stolen, it was the pay out from that I used to pay for the Belgian Yamaha FJR1300 I bought to replace the R1. Full comp insurance for the FJR was €6500 or third party only at €105, I took the €105. Summer 2020 I was on a tour with my brother in law as part of a memorial ride out in memory of his son that got killed on a motorbike, at a junction I got rammed in the back by a Honda Goldwing that didn't stop, his insurance paid for writing off of my FJR, I miss my bike.

 

[sailaboutvic]

In Portugal it is the car which is insured and can certainly be drven on a UK licence by someone who is not a resident but residents must have a Portuguese licence.

In Holland it's the same . It's the car that's insured .

 

[Graham376]

I wrote to DVLA asking if, as a UK (and Portuguese) resident, I can drive in the UK on a Portuguese license. Their reply, which doesn't directly answer my question -

We can only issue licences to customers who are resident in GB, whether or not they were born in Britain or have British citizenship.
Customers living abroad should contact the driving licence authority for advice on driving there and exchanging.
The Interpretation of the law is a matter for the courts and the Agency advises customers to seek legal advice if necessary.
When determining your status as a resident or a visitor, you may like to bear in mind that legal precedents have determined that ‘temporarily visiting’ indicates presence in this country for casual purposes as opposed to the regular habits of life.
Because neither visitor nor resident is defined in driver licensing legislation you should seek your own legal advice if you need further help determining your status.
The ultimate decision is down to the individual concerned and they must be prepared to justify their status if challenged.

RESIDENCY LEGISLATION
In order to apply for a GB driving licence you must be resident in GB.
This requirement is implemented by virtue of Section 89 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 as amended. A copy of the Road Traffic Act 1988 may be viewed on the website of the Office of Public Sector Information: www.legislation.gov.uk
As long as you have the appropriate leave to remain in GB for 185 days or more, you can apply straight away for a driving licence.
Please be advised you would have cover to drive in the UK either as a visitor or resident on a valid Portuguese licence.

 

[25931]

I wrote to DVLA asking if, as a UK (and Portuguese) resident, I can drive in the UK on a Portuguese license. Their reply, which doesn't directly answer my question -

We can only issue licences to customers who are resident in GB, whether or not they were born in Britain or have British citizenship.
Customers living abroad should contact the driving licence authority for advice on driving there and exchanging.
The Interpretation of the law is a matter for the courts and the Agency advises customers to seek legal advice if necessary.
When determining your status as a resident or a visitor, you may like to bear in mind that legal precedents have determined that ‘temporarily visiting’ indicates presence in this country for casual purposes as opposed to the regular habits of life.
Because neither visitor nor resident is defined in driver licensing legislation you should seek your own legal advice if you need further help determining your status.
The ultimate decision is down to the individual concerned and they must be prepared to justify their status if challenged.

RESIDENCY LEGISLATION
In order to apply for a GB driving licence you must be resident in GB.
This requirement is implemented by virtue of Section 89 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 as amended. A copy of the Road Traffic Act 1988 may be viewed on the website of the Office of Public Sector Information: www.legislation.gov.uk
As long as you have the appropriate leave to remain in GB for 185 days or more, you can apply straight away for a driving licence.
Please be advised you would have cover to drive in the UK either as a visitor or resident on a valid Portuguese licence.

Is the last line not clear ?

 

[Graham376]

Is the last line not clear ?

It is but, I was hoping for a straight yes or no Holding a UK license depends on the residence requirement mentioned so, by the looks of it, there will be quite a few non-resident liveaboards not entitled to renew a UK license. I meet the 185 days some years but not others.

 

[grumpygit]

It is but, I was hoping for a straight yes or no Holding a UK license depends on the residence requirement mentioned so, by the looks of it, there will be quite a few non-resident liveaboards not entitled to renew a UK license. I meet the 185 days some years but not others.

It's like being between the devil and the deep blue sea . . . .
See if this answers your question Driving licence exchange and recognition in the EU

 

[billskip]

It is but, I was hoping for a straight yes or no Holding a UK license depends on the residence requirement mentioned so, by the looks of it, there will be quite a few non-resident liveaboards not entitled to renew a UK license. I meet the 185 days some years but not others.

As I said ( in pos 2 I think) you have (are supposed ) to live in UK .
This goes far beyond the driving license, its counsel tax,pension, some bank acc's etc.
Most flying under the radar claim they are resident using family or friends address.
There are also people that make a living from "renting their address "
All this works,until something goes tits up .....

 

[sailaboutvic]

As I said ( in pos 2 I think) you have (are supposed ) to live in UK .
This goes far beyond the driving license, its counsel tax,pension, some bank acc's etc.
Most flying under the radar claim they are resident using family or friends address.
There are also people that make a living from "renting their address "
All this works,until something goes tits up .....

Bill like most things in life , it works till it goes tits up .
From the driver who parks on yellow lines to get his fish and chip to the guy drive someone car without knowing what the law is, until some one hurt or worst killed .

 

[billskip]

Bill like most things in life , it works till it goes tits up .
From the driver who parks on yellow lines to get his fish and chip to the guy drive someone car without knowing what the law is, until some one hurt or worst killed .

This is true, I've possibly got about 10 active years left at best, I've sold up and rent now because I want the freedom of doing anything upping sticks and moving without hassle of possessions.
Its becoming more and more difficult to do that, all this discussion on here doesn't change the fact wherever you go you have to abide by some restrictive legislation one way or another.