Uricanejack
Well-known member
With an outboard is it not a back to front end and top and bottom bearing.
Buying small motor boat - Seller has not access to water to run engine.!
- Thread starter onemanorthree
- Start date
Portofino
Well-known member
For clarity for those ( sorry for the basic explanation or assuming numbties ) …….the big end is the connection of the con rod to the crank and the “ main “ is the bearing connecting the crank to the block .
If it starts and at least runs then it’s a go er .We await with bated breath for this WE s viewing with the OP to report + hopefully back with a vid of the thing running ,
Beats anchor threads does this .We have found a surrogate = buying a used 2 T OB …loving it new territory not seen before on here !
If it starts and at least runs then it’s a go er .We await with bated breath for this WE s viewing with the OP to report + hopefully back with a vid of the thing running ,
Beats anchor threads does this .We have found a surrogate = buying a used 2 T OB …loving it new territory not seen before on here !
billskip
Well-known member
Some may have one in the middleWith an outboard is it not a back to front end and top and bottom bearing.
onemanorthree
Member
He sent 2 vids, let me know if you can tell anything from these? Obv' not recent as he has them in water.
scottie
Well-known member
If the engine works any will do but if it’s knacked then he only needs is attached to back of boat
Scubadoo
Well-known member
That brings back memories, I had a Fletcher Arrowstreak 161 GTO (Black Max) in customised red with a 80hp Mercury which I bought new back in the late 80s. Absolutely great capable boat for skiing and in my case quite a few diving trips across the South coast, it was immaculate when I sold it, never to be seen again, I wonder what happened to it. I think with the Red and White Gelcoat I guess make it a rare boat, never seen another Fletcher like it, should have kept.
onemanorthree
Member
Fletcher Arrowstreak 160 with 115 HP Mercury for sale in Antrim for £1,900 on DoneDeal
You might like this so, same site I'm looking on for a boat ,pity the engine doesn't rev!
QBhoy
Well-known member
Amazing. That would be the last of the line of them, I’m sure. That’s the model I always wanted. In that very colour scheme. I’d say that the arrow flash 15 likely replaced that model. And the arrowstreak turned into a 16 then a 17 model just after the 161 arrowstreak. Very rare to find one like the one you had these days. Amazing hulls. I had a 79 arrowsport 150 inboard decades ago. Stunning looking thing. Later had a few others to include a arrowsport 16 with a 90 merc. Fast forward lots of boats and years later. Recently got my self a nice wee 19 gto sc for regular use and to keep the old classic and modern v8 hooligan boat less used and in good shape. Fletcher is a great all rounder for me. Must admit. She has a modern 2016 4 stroke merc mariner 2.1l outboard on her. Never thought I’d see the day i owned a 4 stroke outboard ! They are the devil I always thought
. But honestly can’t fault it. Glad I never had to pay for it though !
Last edited:
QBhoy
Well-known member
Hard to make out clearly there. Is it pumping water from the tell tale there ? Second video abounds like it’s straggling for fuel or something there and stopped on its own. Maybe he got that sorted out for the top video though. Look for signs of corrosion around the block itself and the head. Look at the head bolts too. See if they’ve been messed with previously or corroded beyond any reason.
QBhoy
Well-known member
Also maybe not at Smokey as I’d like to see on a cold started old 2 stroke ? Hard to make out. Not sure I can see any smoke at all even. Aka him about if he is pre mixing the oil or is it still oil injection. Mention that you can’t see much smoke from her
rotrax
Well-known member
The engine MIGHT be noisy with a bad small end. Not always, depends whether it has a caged rolling element, an open rolling element or a plain bearing.
Highly stressed racing two stroke motorcycle engines had silver plated roller cages. Worked better than soft copper.
A worn little end WILL NOT SHOW UP DURING A TWO STROKE COMPRESSION TEST!
A totally knackered and seized one will-the piston will not freely articulate, limiting the sealing of the rings.
By the time you become aware of a small end problem, the rollers might have already rattled out of the exhaust port.
Two stroke compression can only start once the ports are covered by the piston. Most wear occurs around the hot exhaust port, with all the subsequent dramas associated with an out of round bore.
Two strokes are very good, or very bad, little in between.
As my old mate and world leading OHC Norton tuner Stan Johnson used to say " Bloody two strokes, they only work by accident!"
I never agreed with him and had a fair bit of success racing two stroke engines of all types.
Bottom line, if it has enough compression to start, you will, by running it, find out far more than giving it a pretty meaningless compression test.
An imbalance between cylinders on a multi cylinder job would be the most useful information from a compression test.
IMHO, after 60 years of fixing and racing them.
QBhoy
Well-known member
We aren’t really discussing motor bikes here, but thanks for the input…I think !
Hopefully putting an end to this silliness now.
So this is an old 1984 Yamaha v4 that came in an old boat I bought years ago. (only a few years earlier in age, than the op posted engine) She actually started, all be it, only just and rough sounding.
Please have a good look at what was found, when I opened her up !
Imagjne this was bought by the OP on the advice given here (if it starts it will be ok…blah blah blah…)
Let’s be careful what we advise please !
Attachments
Last edited:
rotrax
Well-known member
You said it in line four. 'She actually started, albeit only just, rough sounding.
Very clear from the pictures it was knackered, had been hard used and roughly treated for some time previously.
The rings had rattled out of the exhaust port - those bits that had not stuck in the pistons anyway...........................
You are correct, time to get onto something more productive.
Schnuerle type two strokes often have little resistance to their rotation when cold. This is to do with their porting and often their bore and stroke. The shorter the stroke, the less distance the piston has to compress the combustion space after the ports have been closed by the piston. To avoid seizures many high performance two strokes have wide piston / cylinder clearances when cold, tightening up when expanded and at working temperature.
Because of this, unless the engine is at working tempreture a compression test is of very limited value. As I previously stated, comparison between cylinders on a multi cylinder job would be the most useful.
Very clear from the pictures it was knackered, had been hard used and roughly treated for some time previously.
The rings had rattled out of the exhaust port - those bits that had not stuck in the pistons anyway...........................
You are correct, time to get onto something more productive.
Schnuerle type two strokes often have little resistance to their rotation when cold. This is to do with their porting and often their bore and stroke. The shorter the stroke, the less distance the piston has to compress the combustion space after the ports have been closed by the piston. To avoid seizures many high performance two strokes have wide piston / cylinder clearances when cold, tightening up when expanded and at working temperature.
Because of this, unless the engine is at working tempreture a compression test is of very limited value. As I previously stated, comparison between cylinders on a multi cylinder job would be the most useful.
billskip
Well-known member
You know you can get very cheap endoscope and poke it through the plug hole and inspect the piston
QBhoy
Well-known member
It was a v4. There was more water than oil, in the oil injection tank in the bilge. Presumably for a good while. Normally great engines, but as you correctly say…seriously neglected and abused for sure. Such a shame.You said it in line four. 'She actually started, albeit only just, rough sounding.
Very clear from the pictures it was knackered, had been hard used and roughly treated for some time previously.
The rings had rattled out of the exhaust port - those bits that had not stuck in the pistons anyway...........................
You are correct, time to get onto something more productive.
Schnuerle type two strokes often have little resistance to their rotation when cold. This is to do with their porting and often their bore and stroke. The shorter the stroke, the less distance the piston has to compress the combustion space after the ports have been closed by the piston. To avoid seizures many high performance two strokes have wide piston / cylinder clearances when cold, tightening up when expanded and at working temperature.
Because of this, unless the engine is at working tempreture a compression test is of very limited value. As I previously stated, comparison between cylinders on a multi cylinder job would be the most useful.
Totally agree about the variance being the important thing. Tells a real story. Said this in a previous post.
My point in showing these pics…this engine under the hood was in almost pristine time warp condition. Mint under there. A newbie to all this could easily think she is good to go…if it wasn’t closely looked over.
QBhoy
Well-known member
You better be careful, giving out good advice like this !! I only suggested a compression test…and the ybm old guard amateur experts shot me down for it
. I’d delete your comment before they turn on you !
Hot Property
Well-known member
My post number #75 seems relevant now....
gordmac
Well-known member
I don't think it is a lot of money for what it is, mind you I wouldn't like to be paying the fuel for an old 2 stroke! If it starts and runs that would be about all you can realistically expect to see at that sort of money.
Does the trailer look ok or corroded, particularly the suspension units? Are the tyres cracked? Can you jack a wheel up and spin it to check wheel bearings? If someone is towing it for you avoiding a blowout or wheel bearing failure, never mind a suspension unit failing, is a good idea!
Is the transom ok? Pull up and down on the engine lower part and see how much transom flex there is.
Does the boat and trailer look ok in general? Does the owner come across as genuine?
Buying old stuff like that is rolling the dice, not being mechanically minded is a hindrance. At the end of the day, gut feeling and desire for it are going to make the decision.
Does the trailer look ok or corroded, particularly the suspension units? Are the tyres cracked? Can you jack a wheel up and spin it to check wheel bearings? If someone is towing it for you avoiding a blowout or wheel bearing failure, never mind a suspension unit failing, is a good idea!
Is the transom ok? Pull up and down on the engine lower part and see how much transom flex there is.
Does the boat and trailer look ok in general? Does the owner come across as genuine?
Buying old stuff like that is rolling the dice, not being mechanically minded is a hindrance. At the end of the day, gut feeling and desire for it are going to make the decision.
onemanorthree
Member
Quick update.
Went to see the boat, the boat itself is in good nic, very clean & the trailer is also in very good condition.
However, the engine wouldn't start as the trim motor on the boat was broken. There is a small device at the back of the boat
that was connected to the battery, that then connected to the trim motor, they couldnt get this work. The trim motor itself, they said worked, and they did get it to trim down a little while I was there.
I dont know what the device was, just looked like a small balck box with 4 connectors coming out of it. They had bought a new one, but it was the wrong type.The steering wheel also didnt turn but
the guy said that the motor needed to be trimed down for the stearing to work and for the engine to start, is this correct?
The guy was really apologeit and said they'd get it working for me, they also found water on the land and said if I brought a barrel they'd run it in water for me.
They do seem genuine but really not set up to be selling this correcfly. It's stored on a borrowed plot of land and they don't spen any time out there to prep' it for viewing.
Link to it trying to start
Went to see the boat, the boat itself is in good nic, very clean & the trailer is also in very good condition.
However, the engine wouldn't start as the trim motor on the boat was broken. There is a small device at the back of the boat
that was connected to the battery, that then connected to the trim motor, they couldnt get this work. The trim motor itself, they said worked, and they did get it to trim down a little while I was there.
I dont know what the device was, just looked like a small balck box with 4 connectors coming out of it. They had bought a new one, but it was the wrong type.The steering wheel also didnt turn but
the guy said that the motor needed to be trimed down for the stearing to work and for the engine to start, is this correct?
The guy was really apologeit and said they'd get it working for me, they also found water on the land and said if I brought a barrel they'd run it in water for me.
They do seem genuine but really not set up to be selling this correcfly. It's stored on a borrowed plot of land and they don't spen any time out there to prep' it for viewing.
Link to it trying to start
Attachments
onemanorthree
Member
I also went to see this today.
Fletcher arrowsport bravo 150 for sale in Westmeath for €4,950 on DoneDeal
Very clean. Started well and ran well. Only issue was that the oil container that is normally in the engine hosing was removed and
the guy said you just mix the oil/fule at the tank instead, is this an issue?
Thoughts on engine sound?
Fletcher arrowsport bravo 150 for sale in Westmeath for €4,950 on DoneDeal
Very clean. Started well and ran well. Only issue was that the oil container that is normally in the engine hosing was removed and
the guy said you just mix the oil/fule at the tank instead, is this an issue?
Thoughts on engine sound?
