Buy British campaign
- Thread starter henryf
- Start date
MapisM
Well-known member
Now, this is sad.
Not only the Country which, according to the previously quoted FT supplement, still manages to build more superyachts than its four followers together, was stolen of one of its most famous dishes (well, its name, if nothing else) by a couple of guys out of nowhere in Kansas.
I must now hear that someone is thinking that the junk they sell pretending it's food has something to see with Italy...
henryf
Well-known member
Not an Aygo I am afraid, it is a Toyota IQ that has a re-modelled body and a total interior retrim. I recently attended a lecture at which Ian Minards from AML gave a very interesting presentation on the Cygnet as it is known, quite a lot has been changed, except the engine and drive train. The reason it is built - at all - is probably only to comply with the EU requirements for all car manufacturers to have a small eco friendly vehicle to offset their bigger vehicles. Companies like Bentley and Porsche do not have to bother conforming to this dictum as the parent company (VW Audi Porsche) already have a small car range in the VW Lupo etcetra so they comply by default. As for the rust comment - steady on there. They did have rust issues on the old V8's / DBS etc of the 70's and 80's but, lest we forget, so did all manufacturers at that time, yes, even Ford, BL and all the other "British", German and European manufacturers! Since those days, all manufacturers have much improved anti corrosion methods in place and or build in Aluminium anyway.
As for UK boats, true, we do build some very fine boats here at home. I for one am proud of our boat building heritage. By and large they are rightly something to be proud of but in truth, I think it is hard to build anything but well in this day and age - maybe therein lies the problem.
Our overseas Asian competitors have much cheaper labour rates and this is a real problem for us and a very tangible benefit for them. Team this up with a European Management team and they have a real recipe for success.
All boats nowadays, from wherever, tend to have engines from Volvo or MAN or Cats or Yanmar etecera, nav systems from Garmin, Raymarine or Simrad, they are built from GRP that is made elsewhere before being imported and assembled into a ready moulded hull. Teak decks are sourced from where? Not from Nottingham or the New Forest! So just how "British" are we in reality?
I agree we should be proud to be British but the fact is that products from overseas cannot be discounted. Where does your TV come from? Your camera? Your washing machine or even crockery?
As you will know, we offer Dutch boats but also a British designed boat from Bill Dixon called a Johnson. It is built in the very best Taiwanese yard and its build is overseen by European management as a result it is a lesser cost than for example the same size Sunseeker. I wish we could build it here but it is simply cost prohibitive to do so. When Atlantic was alive and well, we were building the 38, 42 and 50 models here in the UK at a site right next door to Fairline. Many of the team had worked at Fairline previously but sadly the cost of building here became too much and that facility closed. I actually believe that the Atlantic's built here in the UK were some of the best we built. But, in the end the market place will have its say and for Atlantic, the cost of build was too high and the quality would never be reduced to a lower level. Look at the price of the Broom 445 - four or five years ago it would have been £200k less at least. So a good 5 year old UK built boat has to be a bargain.
Superyachts built in the UK 86....hmmmm
Thanks for that well balanced reply. Just to clarify my thread title is probably misleading. In hindsight I wish I had titled it "Made with pride in Great Britain" because that's what I'm arguing about primarily if you read my posts. I'm fully aware and said from the very outset that individual components for our boats come from far afield but the labour that turns them into the wonderful boats they are is Great British labour. That bit of teak was machined into a rough plank by relatively unskilled labour. The skill came in selecting then cutting and jointing it to form a beautiful deck top.
As for the Aston Martin Cygnet I know very well why it was built but it isn't an Aston Martin in the sense of what makes the hair on the back of our necks stand on end when we experience a "real" Aston Martin. It has been dressed and covered by Aston Martin as a styling exercise. The Boxster however is pure Porsche and possesses all the necessary ingredients to make you smile. My reference to rust was aimed at the £10-20k second hand Aston Market were you are buying less "classic" older examples of the Marque.
In terms of "a reasonable sized manufacturing operation" how large do you have to look? I think Princess employs around 2,000 people give or take. That's a pretty decent sized operation isn't it? I have no idea as to the union involvement within the factory but I suspect workers are as proud to be there as the workers I met when touring the Ferrari factory in Maranello. So they should be.
I can't really comment on your Johnson I'm afraid (sorry - schoolboy humour
), because a). I've never seen one and b). size wise they are somewhat out of my league. I only get to go on the larger Princesses because as a customer they let me wander around and trust me not to nick anything Once again thanks for your input I understand what you are saying and for what it's worth the Atlantic was, whilst unusual in layout, on my admired list.
Henry
Nautical
Active member
Just on the matter of Asian builders not at any great advantage because they are using EU or US sourced product. True they are using the same components as we are but what you find is they club together and form co-operatives and then rather than go out and ask for bids on (for example) 100 engines they are now asking CAT , Volvo or whomever for 2000 engines. This repeated throughout the sourcing process, another example how they are beating up the EU and US suppliers on price which is giving them even further advantage over us.
If I were building in the UK I would (and I doubt this would ever happen) get all four of the majors to get around a table and collate all their common parts and machinery together and go with a bigger stick to the main engine, genset, electronics etc suppliers, I warrant that any supplier will shave their prices if all engines going into UK product was collectively negociated. 10% shaved on the juicy stuff would have a noticable affect on the retail price, no huge but maybe another little edge.
If I were building in the UK I would (and I doubt this would ever happen) get all four of the majors to get around a table and collate all their common parts and machinery together and go with a bigger stick to the main engine, genset, electronics etc suppliers, I warrant that any supplier will shave their prices if all engines going into UK product was collectively negociated. 10% shaved on the juicy stuff would have a noticable affect on the retail price, no huge but maybe another little edge.
volvopaul
Well-known member
Im not going to comment on makes of boat, uk versus european I have my own opinion of uk boats and a league table in my own head which will remain there as not to offend my customers, what I will say is that I favour uk boats for simplicity to work on over eu built boats.
If anyone has a gripe with henry f take a look at his website and see how fair he would be if you were to buy a used car from him, the backup he is offering is a lot greater than a main dealer can possibly deliver on a second hand car of that marque.
If anyone has a gripe with henry f take a look at his website and see how fair he would be if you were to buy a used car from him, the backup he is offering is a lot greater than a main dealer can possibly deliver on a second hand car of that marque.
Nautical
Active member
Not an Aygo I am afraid, it is a Toyota IQ that has a re-modelled body and a total interior retrim. I recently attended a lecture at which Ian Minards from AML gave a very interesting presentation on the Cygnet as it is known, quite a lot has been changed, except the engine and drive train. The reason it is built - at all - is probably only to comply with the EU requirements for all car manufacturers to have a small eco friendly vehicle to offset their bigger vehicles. Companies like Bentley and Porsche do not have to bother conforming to this dictum as the parent company (VW Audi Porsche) already have a small car range in the VW Lupo etcetra so they comply by default. As for the rust comment - steady on there. They did have rust issues on the old V8's / DBS etc of the 70's and 80's but, lest we forget, so did all manufacturers at that time, yes, even Ford, BL and all the other "British", German and European manufacturers! Since those days, all manufacturers have much improved anti corrosion methods in place and or build in Aluminium anyway.
As for UK boats, true, we do build some very fine boats here at home. I for one am proud of our boat building heritage. By and large they are rightly something to be proud of but in truth, I think it is hard to build anything but well in this day and age - maybe therein lies the problem.
Our overseas Asian competitors have much cheaper labour rates and this is a real problem for us and a very tangible benefit for them. Team this up with a European Management team and they have a real recipe for success.
All boats nowadays, from wherever, tend to have engines from Volvo or MAN or Cats or Yanmar etecera, nav systems from Garmin, Raymarine or Simrad, they are built from GRP that is made elsewhere before being imported and assembled into a ready moulded hull. Teak decks are sourced from where? Not from Nottingham or the New Forest! So just how "British" are we in reality?
I agree we should be proud to be British but the fact is that products from overseas cannot be discounted. Where does your TV come from? Your camera? Your washing machine or even crockery?
As you will know, we offer Dutch boats but also a British designed boat from Bill Dixon called a Johnson. It is built in the very best Taiwanese yard and its build is overseen by European management as a result it is a lesser cost than for example the same size Sunseeker. I wish we could build it here but it is simply cost prohibitive to do so. When Atlantic was alive and well, we were building the 38, 42 and 50 models here in the UK at a site right next door to Fairline. Many of the team had worked at Fairline previously but sadly the cost of building here became too much and that facility closed. I actually believe that the Atlantic's built here in the UK were some of the best we built. But, in the end the market place will have its say and for Atlantic, the cost of build was too high and the quality would never be reduced to a lower level. Look at the price of the Broom 445 - four or five years ago it would have been £200k less at least. So a good 5 year old UK built boat has to be a bargain.
Superyachts built in the UK 86....hmmmm
Agree with you on all those points, bar one.... "is built in the very best Taiwanese yard",..... well almost the very best Taiwanese yard !!
or maybe equal best Taiwanese yard perhaps !
grumpy_o_g
Well-known member
Aren't Flemings an "American" boat built in a Taiwanese yard by a Brit?
Assassin
Well-known member
Nautical:
This is an interesting point you make, and one we in the engineering community have tried to do without success, such co-operatives have many price advantages from quantity discounts, but try getting people to see it, let alone do it.
This is an interesting point you make, and one we in the engineering community have tried to do without success, such co-operatives have many price advantages from quantity discounts, but try getting people to see it, let alone do it.
Nautical
Active member
Grumpy
Yes that is correct, and, one of the nicest built yachts of her ilk you will find with a legendary following amoungst die hard enthusiasts. Indeed, if I remember corrrectly in a recent MBY report our own Dave Marsh said it was one of his favourite yachts of all time or something similar(ish), high praise from someone that has probaly sailled and tested more boats than all of us put together on here.
Taiwan builders have a very belt and braces approach to boat building, not the most sophisticated perhaps but hugely built and over engineered everything. No much use for lighter weight planning boats and whizzy stuff but if you want belt and braces and solid, durable construction they are exceptionally good at the long distance slower speed cruising yacht stuff.
Yes that is correct, and, one of the nicest built yachts of her ilk you will find with a legendary following amoungst die hard enthusiasts. Indeed, if I remember corrrectly in a recent MBY report our own Dave Marsh said it was one of his favourite yachts of all time or something similar(ish), high praise from someone that has probaly sailled and tested more boats than all of us put together on here.
Taiwan builders have a very belt and braces approach to boat building, not the most sophisticated perhaps but hugely built and over engineered everything. No much use for lighter weight planning boats and whizzy stuff but if you want belt and braces and solid, durable construction they are exceptionally good at the long distance slower speed cruising yacht stuff.
oldgit
Well-known member
Aston Martin in the real world
Two friends,bought Astons,3 or so years ago,both cars were about a year old, if your looking for good scary way to lose money fast,you will have to go some to beat this method.
They tell tell me that once sanity returns to the finanicial world they may be able to unload them.Funny old world because both of them are hard as nails regards money.
They did consider Porsche but as it was a bit too reliable and sensible went elsewhere.
Two friends,bought Astons,3 or so years ago,both cars were about a year old, if your looking for good scary way to lose money fast,you will have to go some to beat this method.
They tell tell me that once sanity returns to the finanicial world they may be able to unload them.Funny old world because both of them are hard as nails regards money.
They did consider Porsche but as it was a bit too reliable and sensible went elsewhere.
PowerYachtBlog
Well-known member
I wonder working in the UK how many other EU boats u work. The UK boating community is still very much a very home protected market, and when the things where getting interestingly competitive by the French, here come the UK£ devalution...
By your posts u do here I can very much imagine your list though...
Nothing wrong by that, but I imagine out of ten boats your work, eight to be British, which really is not a level of comparison to make a good judgement of the competition.
Nautical
Active member
Assassin
That is the issue with the Far East builders, a whole different mind set to western commerce, many industries are part government owned and they will negociate collectively for the greater good (for them anyway) to find every angle, edge or price point to leverage their product into the market. If the yard, factory etc runs at what we may consider suicidial margins or losses for ten years they don't care if they achieve their end goal and that is what makes them (from our perspective) dangerous in the long term. They certianly have the technology and more besides, they have the EU and US designers on their books, they have mountains of skilled cheap labour (relative to the EU), state of art shipyards, huge budgets and cash, add into the mix a few years down the line some strategic acquisitions and one can figure out the rest.
One hopes our yards are on the ball and formulating new stratagies, product and technology to out gun them as time progresses and not resting on their laurels patting themselves on the back how great and untouchable they are, we have history to show us where that road ends :-(.
That is the issue with the Far East builders, a whole different mind set to western commerce, many industries are part government owned and they will negociate collectively for the greater good (for them anyway) to find every angle, edge or price point to leverage their product into the market. If the yard, factory etc runs at what we may consider suicidial margins or losses for ten years they don't care if they achieve their end goal and that is what makes them (from our perspective) dangerous in the long term. They certianly have the technology and more besides, they have the EU and US designers on their books, they have mountains of skilled cheap labour (relative to the EU), state of art shipyards, huge budgets and cash, add into the mix a few years down the line some strategic acquisitions and one can figure out the rest.
One hopes our yards are on the ball and formulating new stratagies, product and technology to out gun them as time progresses and not resting on their laurels patting themselves on the back how great and untouchable they are, we have history to show us where that road ends :-(.
henryf
Well-known member
Hey, if we all had to justify every penny we spent the world would be a dry old place
Because of what do for a living I find it hard to get excited about buying a brand new car. My boat is my bit of madness which keeps me sane.
Henry
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henryf
Well-known member
I think you only have to look at the key players to see they are not resting on any laurels. In producing ever larger boats the companies are acquiring new skills and abilities which find their way down to the more mundane sized vessels.
Witness the investment in new production facilities, ever improved quality and so on. Motorboat manufacturing in the Uk isn't based on some niche Market retro craft such as a Fairey, its competing head on in the world Market and innovating.
For me one of the Uk builder's biggest strengths is the way they manage to integrate this new technology and innovation into a framework which doesn't try to re-invent the wheel. They aren't pushing boundaries to the point where usability suffers for the sake of art. That would be one of my main criticisms of a lot of the boats I see coming out of Italy for instance.
Henry
Imperial One
Active member
Morning all!
Thanks Henry for your comment - not sure my wife would agree on being balanced though Next time I am at a boat show with one of our Van der Valks or Johnson's you and all others are welcome to look over her.I am of the old school who allow anybody over the boats at a show. We all started somewhere, in my case it was a clinker dinghy with a hole in it, so why not let folk have a look over?
Nautical, sorry, sorry sorry, I forgot hat you of course also build high quality motoryachts in that far flung corner of boat building! Goes to prove that there are two decent yards there at least! What next, a third perhaps
OG, the trouble with newer Aston's is that they are built in a high tech factory and have to be produced in volume for the company to survive. I am afraid to admit that they are now perhaps no different than so many other "volume" produced cars, they are very good at what they do, are very reliable but because of the numbers of them out there they do depreciate quickly. The older, rarer hand built cars are the opposite. Sure they depreciate at first but then they turn the corner and start to appreciate. At the recent auction at Newport Pagnell the older cars were going for crazy money. So the good news is that proper British built and crafted products are an investment, be they a car or a boat and will always be something to be proud of.
Henry, "My boat is my bit of madness which keeps me sane. " long may it last. I build and sell boats for a living and without doubt it is the best job I have ever had - but, does anybody know for a low priced, low mileage AM Vanquish S?
Just don't tell my wife I asked though!
Thanks Henry for your comment - not sure my wife would agree on being balanced though
Next time I am at a boat show with one of our Van der Valks or Johnson's you and all others are welcome to look over her.I am of the old school who allow anybody over the boats at a show. We all started somewhere, in my case it was a clinker dinghy with a hole in it, so why not let folk have a look over? Nautical, sorry, sorry sorry, I forgot hat you of course also build high quality motoryachts in that far flung corner of boat building! Goes to prove that there are two decent yards there at least! What next, a third perhaps
OG, the trouble with newer Aston's is that they are built in a high tech factory and have to be produced in volume for the company to survive. I am afraid to admit that they are now perhaps no different than so many other "volume" produced cars, they are very good at what they do, are very reliable but because of the numbers of them out there they do depreciate quickly. The older, rarer hand built cars are the opposite. Sure they depreciate at first but then they turn the corner and start to appreciate. At the recent auction at Newport Pagnell the older cars were going for crazy money. So the good news is that proper British built and crafted products are an investment, be they a car or a boat and will always be something to be proud of.
Henry, "My boat is my bit of madness which keeps me sane. " long may it last. I build and sell boats for a living and without doubt it is the best job I have ever had - but, does anybody know for a low priced, low mileage AM Vanquish S?
Just don't tell my wife I asked though!
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PowerYachtBlog
Well-known member
Interestingly those boats are always copied. Now if you like them or not is another thing, but they are copied, especially by the Brits.
Now thinking of it I always have an argument
Fairline, Princess, and Sunseeker today in real terms are building Italian, Med boats made in UK.
There is nothing British about there design, looks and usage. Nil - 0 - or whatever you want to call it.
The only real British builder, which makes boat for the UK market is actually Broom, and Sealine is a bit of inbetween. But still Sealine has Med use in mind but with a certain British practicality.
Do you need a Sunpad aft in a sport cruiser, on the flybridge, do you need biminis for the UK. How about an open wet bar in the cockpit? These are all useless ammenities for a boat used in Britain, where it rains 7 out of 10 days???
Do u need a transom hydraulic passarelle when you moor to the side.
Sure they made well to follow the market and it paid well in there pockets, but it is sad that none of the above builders actually left a line for a real British boat like a Broom.
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Wiggo
New member
Now, this is sad.
Not only the Country which, according to the previously quoted FT supplement, still manages to build more superyachts than its four followers together, was stolen of one of its most famous dishes (well, its name, if nothing else) by a couple of guys out of nowhere in Kansas.
I must now hear that someone is thinking that the junk they sell pretending it's food has something to see with Italy...
That was actually from one of those "You know when you're from [insert somewhere trashy] when you think..." lists.
"You know when you're from Dale Farm when you think Pizza Hut is an Italian restaurant..."
henryf
Well-known member
I don't agree with you powerblog.
First of all Broom. One of the boats I am really interested to look round. I met up with aqua power when in Brixham and he told me of some design changes to their new boats. The pictures of the 455 posted up on this thread recently made it look stunning, a far cry from the pink carpets of old. It's one of the boats I'm looking forward to seeing at the weekend. So hopefully a rosy future in front of them.
As for your proposition that the British now build Italian boats I'm afraid I'm going to have to disagree. For me Italian boats have represented design over functionality. They've tried too hard and usability has suffered. They also run the risk of dating very quickly. They have never appealed to me.
I may have conservative tastes and that's why I settled on a Princess for my last boat. Good solid build, modern but not vulgar and built to a standard whereby I'm not getting upset looking at faults all the time.
It doesn't have a Bimini cover on the flybridge (are you claiming the Italians have sole rights to putting a sun shade on a flybridge? It doesn't have a passerelle, (most are used as dinghy lifts and to future proof against a potential next owner's wants and needs), it doesn't have a cockpit wet bar, (the flybridge chiller is very hand though as is the drink fridge by the saloon doors), it does have sun bed option on the flybridge which was lovely this August falling asleep with the sides of the flybridge providing protection against any breeze. A real sun trap. You are claiming Italian design rights on cushions as well I suppose.
Design is all around us and different people have a different angle on what might be a very similar concept. Many design icons are actually variations on an original less successful concept. It was the variation which made it work. I spent 5 years at art college and trained as an industrial designer. I still use my eyes and keep a designer's open mind.
Each of the British motorboat builders have their own style and design ideas. Sunseeker, Princess, Fairline and Sealine are all different in their approach and that's good. But to say they are just copying Italian designs and re-hashing concepts from several years ago is wrong.
Henry
Edited to add:
When you talk about British motorboat builders building for a non UK Market, ie. having sun pads, bimini covers and so on are you suggesting that they should limit their design thinking to Uk boating? Because if you are then you're madder than the cheese in my fridge. My whole argument is the the British Motorboat manufacturers should be complimented on their ability to export British built products to a worldwide audience. They make a boat which people from all over the world want to buy. One of the greatest skills British manufacturers have over, for example, the American manufacturers is that undefinable ability to build style into their products. To be fair it's not just the British, it's a European advantage but the British do it so well.
It's the reason why so many foreign manufacturers and companies want British design and engineering teams.
H.
First of all Broom. One of the boats I am really interested to look round. I met up with aqua power when in Brixham and he told me of some design changes to their new boats. The pictures of the 455 posted up on this thread recently made it look stunning, a far cry from the pink carpets of old. It's one of the boats I'm looking forward to seeing at the weekend. So hopefully a rosy future in front of them.
As for your proposition that the British now build Italian boats I'm afraid I'm going to have to disagree. For me Italian boats have represented design over functionality. They've tried too hard and usability has suffered. They also run the risk of dating very quickly. They have never appealed to me.
I may have conservative tastes and that's why I settled on a Princess for my last boat. Good solid build, modern but not vulgar and built to a standard whereby I'm not getting upset looking at faults all the time.
It doesn't have a Bimini cover on the flybridge (are you claiming the Italians have sole rights to putting a sun shade on a flybridge? It doesn't have a passerelle, (most are used as dinghy lifts and to future proof against a potential next owner's wants and needs), it doesn't have a cockpit wet bar, (the flybridge chiller is very hand though as is the drink fridge by the saloon doors), it does have sun bed option on the flybridge which was lovely this August falling asleep with the sides of the flybridge providing protection against any breeze. A real sun trap. You are claiming Italian design rights on cushions as well I suppose.
Design is all around us and different people have a different angle on what might be a very similar concept. Many design icons are actually variations on an original less successful concept. It was the variation which made it work. I spent 5 years at art college and trained as an industrial designer. I still use my eyes and keep a designer's open mind.
Each of the British motorboat builders have their own style and design ideas. Sunseeker, Princess, Fairline and Sealine are all different in their approach and that's good. But to say they are just copying Italian designs and re-hashing concepts from several years ago is wrong.
Henry
Edited to add:
When you talk about British motorboat builders building for a non UK Market, ie. having sun pads, bimini covers and so on are you suggesting that they should limit their design thinking to Uk boating? Because if you are then you're madder than the cheese in my fridge. My whole argument is the the British Motorboat manufacturers should be complimented on their ability to export British built products to a worldwide audience. They make a boat which people from all over the world want to buy. One of the greatest skills British manufacturers have over, for example, the American manufacturers is that undefinable ability to build style into their products. To be fair it's not just the British, it's a European advantage but the British do it so well.
It's the reason why so many foreign manufacturers and companies want British design and engineering teams.
H.
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PowerYachtBlog
Well-known member
Don;'t agree on your statements as most Italian designs are most of all classic.
Most Italian boats infact have easier cockpit to deck communications then most Brits. My boat is indeed a breeze if you compare it to a Fl Targa. Same goes for my staircase to the cabin. My engine room which includes a Generator, and the Opacmare Passarelle pump is a luxury compared to that of the 37 Targa. And my previous Gobbi 27 Sport had a ship engine room compared to what I have now. Two by 200hp 41s in three meters beam.
Yes Italian have build trendy boats the Conam Chorum now renamed Wide body sticks to mind, or the Posillipo 82, 87, and 47 Technema series represented a novelty because they use the WIdebody concept. Which may be not anyone taste but was highly and is still used in Super Yacht design. Even Sunseeker in its bigger models actually uses it
Considering the Conam 48 Chorum was launched in 1987 with this concept we are ages away.
But for traditional looks few propose classic lookers as much as Italians actually offer. In fact builders from Rome or Naples actually still make flush decks top sides, something only US builders still do.
The Viareggio builders are most of them traditional, as are those in Liguria, and in the Rome areas.
Your Princess 42 is a nice boat, but is still a modern boat which has a lot of a modern Italian med design. I suggest you go an YachtWorld digit 1980s in your search and start searching for some old Italian boats.
You only know about Cranchi, Azimut, may be Ferretti but that is only less 10% if that much of the Italian boating story.
BTW I am a big Broom supporter, and I also forget to mention Pearl which evolved the aft cabin design a step further IMO. We have a Pearl 60 here owned by a Brit which has nothing less to other med designs if you want a pure British boat. The boat is clever looks nice, but has that something British about her.
I also suggest how the Italian with the Ferretti 69 Altura proposed an aft cabin yacht a few years ago. Innovative indeed but the model had discreet market success and was dropped. But Ferretti still sticked to a 840 Altura model.
On the other hand if you look at the new 55 Squadron and change the badge to something Italian I am sure you can be mistaken it comes from Italy.
I clarify again I am not saying the boats from SSPrFL are ugly, on facts they are good lookers well built craft but there design has actually little to nothing British.
Most Italian boats infact have easier cockpit to deck communications then most Brits. My boat is indeed a breeze if you compare it to a Fl Targa. Same goes for my staircase to the cabin. My engine room which includes a Generator, and the Opacmare Passarelle pump is a luxury compared to that of the 37 Targa. And my previous Gobbi 27 Sport had a ship engine room compared to what I have now. Two by 200hp 41s in three meters beam.
Yes Italian have build trendy boats the Conam Chorum now renamed Wide body sticks to mind, or the Posillipo 82, 87, and 47 Technema series represented a novelty because they use the WIdebody concept. Which may be not anyone taste but was highly and is still used in Super Yacht design. Even Sunseeker in its bigger models actually uses it
Considering the Conam 48 Chorum was launched in 1987 with this concept we are ages away.
But for traditional looks few propose classic lookers as much as Italians actually offer. In fact builders from Rome or Naples actually still make flush decks top sides, something only US builders still do.
The Viareggio builders are most of them traditional, as are those in Liguria, and in the Rome areas.
Your Princess 42 is a nice boat, but is still a modern boat which has a lot of a modern Italian med design. I suggest you go an YachtWorld digit 1980s in your search and start searching for some old Italian boats.
You only know about Cranchi, Azimut, may be Ferretti but that is only less 10% if that much of the Italian boating story.
BTW I am a big Broom supporter, and I also forget to mention Pearl which evolved the aft cabin design a step further IMO. We have a Pearl 60 here owned by a Brit which has nothing less to other med designs if you want a pure British boat. The boat is clever looks nice, but has that something British about her.
I also suggest how the Italian with the Ferretti 69 Altura proposed an aft cabin yacht a few years ago. Innovative indeed but the model had discreet market success and was dropped. But Ferretti still sticked to a 840 Altura model.
On the other hand if you look at the new 55 Squadron and change the badge to something Italian I am sure you can be mistaken it comes from Italy.
I clarify again I am not saying the boats from SSPrFL are ugly, on facts they are good lookers well built craft but there design has actually little to nothing British.
henryf
Well-known member
Other than the fact they were designed and built in Great Britain by great British craftsmen, (and women)
Henry.
Edited to say you remind me of the father from the film "my big fat Greek wedding". The bloke who used window cleaning spray as the solution to every conceivable problem and who's catchphrase was, "you know is from Greek word ........."
Keep smiling
Henry
Henry.
Edited to say you remind me of the father from the film "my big fat Greek wedding". The bloke who used window cleaning spray as the solution to every conceivable problem and who's catchphrase was, "you know is from Greek word ........."
Keep smiling
Henry
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