Are old boat prices dropping again?

[MikeBz]

There is no sign of an end to the shortage of desirable/mid-price yachts on the market. Brokers sites consist mostly of 'Sold' or boats which have been on the market since before demand became rampant.

A chap in the same yard as me put his Westerly Fulmar on the market last month at a price which would have been optimistic a year ago. Within 24 hours he had 5 enquiries. It was sold subject to survey another 24 hours on. A short while later another Fulmar appeared on the market asking £10k more than this one!

 

[xyachtdave]

There is no sign of an end to the shortage of desirable/mid-price yachts on the market. Brokers sites consist mostly of 'Sold' or boats which have been on the market since before demand became rampant.

A chap in the same yard as me put his Westerly Fulmar on the market last month at a price which would have been optimistic a year ago. Within 24 hours he had 5 enquiries. It was sold subject to survey another 24 hours on. A short while later another Fulmar appeared on the market asking £10k more than this one!

That’ll be the ‘Concerto’ influence on used Fulmar prices, just like Seajet and Anderson 22’s!

 

[Concerto]

That’ll be the ‘Concerto’ influence on used Fulmar prices, just like Seajet and Anderson 22’s!

I was surprised by the number of people at the Southampton Show who were looking to buy a secondhand boat and were so impressed with Concerto, they said they were adding Westerly Fulmars to their short list. I have to say there is nothing like having a classic boat that is highly rated and in top condition, she gets lots of favourable comments all the time.

 

[jac]

I was surprised by the number of people at the Southampton Show who were looking to buy a secondhand boat and were so impressed with Concerto, they said they were adding Westerly Fulmars to their short list. I have to say there is nothing like having a classic boat that is highly rated and in top condition, she gets lots of favourable comments all the time.

For most people of working age, paying off a huge mortgage, trying to save for a pension, perhaps get kids through school, a new boat costing 6 figures is out of reach but a nice used one that can be on the water in really good condition for 1/2 that is. IMHO, Westerly, especially some of the later designs, are really unfairly maligned as they can do everything your modern boat can without looking like an ikea showroom!! ( Ducks and hides from the inbound!!)

 

[Concerto]

For most people of working age, paying off a huge mortgage, trying to save for a pension, perhaps get kids through school, a new boat costing 6 figures is out of reach but a nice used one that can be on the water in really good condition for 1/2 that is. IMHO, Westerly, especially some of the later designs, are really unfairly maligned as they can do everything your modern boat can without looking like an ikea showroom!! ( Ducks and hides from the inbound!!)

Funny you should mention Ikea, that comment was very common about the new boats. So many commented on the traditional wood interior and how she felt so stable in the water compared to the modern boats. On the first day I can still remember 4 young men in their mid 20's who sailed out of Poole, they sat below and said Concerto felt like a real yacht and you would expect that age group to want the Ikea look, but no they all said they hated the latest offerings.

I still believe most older boats were designed to be sea kindly and to sail easily, but the Fulmar excels on many fronts as they were raced, cruised and used by sailing schools. The ballast ration is greater than moder boats of a similar size that rely on form stabilty. Not having a vertical bow means the volume of the hull forward increases as it plunges into a wave, also it makes anchoring much easier. The aft run of the hull lifts nicely, so no wave slap with small wavelets meaning a better night's sleep aboard. I could go on but jac you do not need to duck from the inbound.

 

[Birdseye]

Highly unlikely anyone will end up in "negative equity" with a boat as few are bought with significant finance - lenders are well aware of potential falling values so limit loan to value ratios to avoid such a situation.

Not unusual for stock of boats for sale to rise at this time of year as sellers seek to avoid winter coasts and buyers have other things on their mind.

"Negative equity" is very different from simply losing money. I sold my boat at the beginning of the epidemic and bought another 6 months later. I sold at 10k more than I could have got before the epidemic and paid £10k more than pre pandemic prices for its replacement. I fully expect to lose at least £10k on the new boat but at 76 how many sailing years have I got left. £10k for one of them seems sense to me. It could well be my executor / kids worrying about the loss anyway.

I will enjoy my boat and my sports car and if they lose money - so what!

 

[Concerto]

"Negative equity" is very different from simply losing money. I sold my boat at the beginning of the epidemic and bought another 6 months later. I sold at 10k more than I could have got before the epidemic and paid £10k more than pre pandemic prices for its replacement. I fully expect to lose at least £10k on the new boat but at 76 how many sailing years have I got left. £10k for one of them seems sense to me. It could well be my executor / kids worrying about the loss anyway.

I will enjoy my boat and my sports car and if they lose money - so what!

Quite right. It is your money to enjoy. You cannot take it with you.

 

[PhillM]

Project boats in the Solent are still carrying a premium. I don't see anything much below £3K much even on ebay. Anything with a mooring will go for more.

 

[Stemar]

Project boats in the Solent are still carrying a premium. I don't see anything much below £3K much even on ebay. Anything with a mooring will go for more.

In the Solent, I suspect the mooring would be worth more without the boat, especially if it's a deep water one.

 

[jac]

I get a feeling that the market may be turning. I'm still looking 3-4 times a week and boats seem to be going more slowly. I use the same search each time and the numbers that reveals have crept up a little, Small sample of course but i've also seen a few price reductions ( albeit from stupid starting prices) and seen a few new boats ( in good condition) emerge on the market recently and still be for sale a week later rather than sale agreed.

I wonder if this is the boaty equivalent of lockdown puppies. Massive demand now giving way to buyers remorse and more realistic prices.

Don't think things are normal yet and a good, mid sized, mainstream boat in good condition will still be sought after of course and the junk will still hang around for ever.

 

[Zing]

Suddenly seems to be plenty of boats for sale again, and seen a few that were lockdown/furlough purchases being put back on the market.

That's not my observation. The shortage is now worse than it has ever been.

It will return to normal, but the change will not happen fast. The reasons for the current glut took years to take their effect and it will take a long time for the effect to unwind. The cause is money printing x pandemic idleness x 2 years x a boom in residential equity. All this produced a surplus of savings and a real and perceived wealth effect. Those savings and surplus equity will take time to be diminished The coming recession will also take years to have full effect. My guess is it will take 2 - 3 years to unwind this mess.

 

[doug748]

Well, I’m one of those who bought a boat ‘a few months ago‘ and I’m absolutely delighted with it. Not all of us have the luxury of waiting x years until the bottom of the market. I may have paid a premium for buying in the Covid surge but I’m on the water now rather than just dreaming about it.

Good show, the difference between top and bottom dollar is often less than a year or two's mooring fees. You have to buy when you want and sell when you have to. It's no good wasting life waiting to see what happens in the longer term; In the longer term we all pass into history.

Post a photo of your new boat and cheer the thread up a bit.

.

 

[Simon__]

Still appear to be rising (or at least the marque I’m tracking is). One has popped up today, which sold in 2021, 20% above the price it was last year. Peculiar though as they’ve gone to great length to hide the boat name in the videos and pictures and the length of ownership appears “mis-keyed” stating 11 years rather than 1 year. Quite evasive when I sent an email to clarify too.

 

[jac]

Still appear to be rising (or at least the marque I’m tracking is). One has popped up today, which sold in 2021, 20% above the price it was last year. Peculiar though as they’ve gone to great length to hide the boat name in the videos and pictures and the length of ownership appears “mis-keyed” stating 11 years rather than 1 year. Quite evasive when I sent an email to clarify too.

I'm still seeing more for sale in my search parameters and definitely a number that are sticking around or seeing large price cuts ( admittedly from some chancer prices!) but not sure that's significant as much as that initial glut of people thinking " I want a boat for the summer," together with all the talk of recessions, inflation etc.

personally i doubt normality will return until this autumn / winter when there may be some purchasers selling as costs / reality bite and fewer people decide that buying a UK based boat is the best use of their hard earned money.

 

[V1701]

I agree that at the lower end sellers are starting to reduce prices and they seem to be coming back to the sorts of prices they were pre-covid. The older, smaller Moodys, Sadlers, Westerlys, e.g. and the same is happening with older narrowboats. Lots of ads with reduced prices. Maybe we'll start looking after our older boats a bit better now buying second hand in the EU is a no go...

 

[KeelsonGraham]

Good show, the difference between top and bottom dollar is often less than a year or two's mooring fees. You have to buy when you want and sell when you have to. It's no good wasting life waiting to see what happens in the longer term; In the longer term we all pass into history.

Post a photo of your new boat and cheer the thread up a bit.

Here she is, my lockdown boat, sitting in A Coruna as we prepare to re-cross Biscay.

 

[Frogmogman]

I don’t expect the price of recent boats to start dropping anytime soon, as the manufacturers seem to have applied some fairly eye watering price hikes on new boats over the last year or so.

 

[lustyd]

manufacturers seem to have applied some fairly eye watering price hikes

They’ve just been passing on higher costs. Inflation is about 20% in reality despite what the government propaganda says so a boat delivered in 2 years time will certainly be a lot more than one a year ago. I expect profits will be down for boat builders as well

 

[Frogmogman]

They’ve just been passing on higher costs. Inflation is about 20% in reality despite what the government propaganda says so a boat delivered in 2 years time will certainly be a lot more than one a year ago. I expect profits will be down for boat builders as well

I wasn’t having a dig at them; just making an observation.

 

[hurley]

Here she is, my lockdown boat, sitting in A Coruna as we prepare to re-cross Biscay.

Beautiful looking boat, bags of fun and adventures await you. Enjoy!