Rivetting boat windows?

DangerousPirate

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I was waiting all late autumn to get my windows done again, but the mate just never had the time to do it while it was still good weather for it. Current windows are only temporary and the refurbished frames are sitting, waiting to be put back in properly. I made new inner rings to counter and cut the plastic to size.

So just found my old rivet gun and came up with the idea to just rivet them. Put a bit of butyl down, rivet them down. I wouldn't need anyone on the inside to counter with a nut (huge advantage).


Has anyone done it before, any reasons why it shouldn't be done?


Pro:

-Quick
-Easy
-Don't need a second person to do it
-Neater

Con:
-Might not seal well (not sure)
-Semi-permanent (needs to be drilled out and replaced)


Any experience doing this is highly welcome. Never seen anyone do it, there might be a reason why, but that could also mean, that no one thought of it before or couldn't be bothered to do it that way.
 

Neeves

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You don't mention what you were going to do before you thought of your riveting idea. Many windows are now simply attached with an adhesive or interscrews. Adhesives usually need a big overlap to give the adhesive the necessary robustness. Windows that are attached with a nut and bolt is a practice used by boat builders who always have enough hands working on assembly to have someone on the inside (as well as outside). They never consider that the windows might need to be replaced by a cruising couple, one of whom has to prepare dinner and do the laundry :)

When you pop the rivet a part of the pin remains in the core of the rivet, it rusts. You can knock the core out, with a small punch, but I'd be concerned this might damage the acrylic and you would then be left with a small hole, which will leak (big time as you might have lots of rivets). The hole you will need to fill, maybe from both sides and then clean up. Your idea has merit - but also some downsides you did not mention (possibly because you thought them minor).

Jonathan
 

Stemar

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My first thought is that a pop rivet squeezes the parts together pretty hard, so may force the sealant - butyl or whatever - out. If you don't want a nut inside, you can always use interscrews but, done right, I don't think a domed nut looks bad. The frame in the pic is 3mm ply, but it was only really needed because the gelcoat around the cutout was damaged.

Window.jpg
 

RunAgroundHard

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You do see caravan panels, for example, assembled with pop rivets and the hole sealed, so I guess it is possible. Pop rivets can exert quite a bit of force and could crack the plastic parts.

Personally, I would wait for a mate and assemble the windows with a nut and bolt.
 

The Q

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Fibreglass and perspex have different expansion rates, hard tight rivetting is likely to shatter the perspex.
 

DangerousPirate

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To be fair, my frames hold the plastic and it's not going through the plastic at all. Only the holes of the aluminium frames.

So I guess this isn't a bad idea then.

Pretty sure you can get non rusting pop rivets, there must be different materials out there....

And if they start to leak, I just replace the rivet?

I literally just plan to put the frame on, either some butyl or acrylic between frame and boat on the outside, then put the pop rivet in with a bit of butyl in the hole (you said it'll be all squeezed out but will have to experiment if it's water tight or not in the end) and that should be it.

Would safe me a lot of trouble of organising help with the windows.
 

Stemar

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I did the window in my photo on my own. A few longer set screws through the fixing holes and plain nuts nipped up on the inside to pull it all together, then fitted screws of the right length. I used Allen heads, as the Allen key stays in better than an ordinary screwdriver, which helps to prevent the screws turning. I then put the right screws in and the washers and dome nuts on the inside, with an assortment of Mole grips, ring spanners etc., to prevent them spinning, and tightened then from the outside.

Yes, it was a bit of a faff going in and out, but I reckon the end result was a lot better than seeing the wrong end of a pop rivet.
 

rogerthebodger

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A cubic meter of water weighs over a ton. I would not want my windows held on with pop rivets.

The momentum of a ton of water can exert a lot more force than a ton when hitting a window panel/

My windows are held in with M6 socket csk set screws in to tapped holes in an outer frame
 

DangerousPirate

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I did the window in my photo on my own. A few longer set screws through the fixing holes and plain nuts nipped up on the inside to pull it all together, then fitted screws of the right length. I used Allen heads, as the Allen key stays in better than an ordinary screwdriver, which helps to prevent the screws turning. I then put the right screws in and the washers and dome nuts on the inside, with an assortment of Mole grips, ring spanners etc., to prevent them spinning, and tightened then from the outside.

Yes, it was a bit of a faff going in and out, but I reckon the end result was a lot better than seeing the wrong end of a pop rivet.
Wow that sounds ingenious but very time consuming to set up. Although a picture of that would be interesting to see how you arranged them to not spin with the nut.
 

Stemar

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Wow that sounds ingenious but very time consuming to set up. Although a picture of that would be interesting to see how you arranged them to not spin with the nut.
It wasn't too bad. The screws were bedded in butyl tape, so they were quite stiff, so the nuts started quite easily - in fact, most of them nipped down nicely. It was only the last turn or two that needed to be done from the outside, with the nut held in a ring spanner or mole grips
 

RunAgroundHard

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You will need to use pop rivets that won’t start corroding the alloy frames.

Looking at your pictures that is an easy nut and bolt job single handed. Mount the frames with your sealant, poke the bolts through, go inside and screw on the nuts. You will likely find there is sufficient friction to nip up by hand all the bolts. Then go round and start tightening as required. Use thin nose pliers to hold the bolt if required.
 

KevinV

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My concern would be that butyl takes time to change shape, but pop rivets work quickly and imprecisely. They also often don't seal themselves.

Find a mate who is available - putting a nut on doesn't require great skill, especially if you give them a small torque wrench to ensure even tightening in increments.
 

DangerousPirate

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You will need to use pop rivets that won’t start corroding the alloy frames.

Looking at your pictures that is an easy nut and bolt job single handed. Mount the frames with your sealant, poke the bolts through, go inside and screw on the nuts. You will likely find there is sufficient friction to nip up by hand all the bolts. Then go round and start tightening as required. Use thin nose pliers to hold the bolt if required.
I have done it before, the bolt usually starts spinning with the nut unless you counter.
 

William_H

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A simple solution to do single handed bolt and nut is to go slightly bigger bolt and tap a thread in to the GRP . Thus you screw the frame down from the outside and later if you want fit nuts or dome nuts on inside. However you might try just pushing screews through from the outside hoping the sealant will grip the screw for you to get a nut on. No I would not go pop rivets. ol''will
Tapping thread in GRP is so quick with tap in a battery powered reversable drill.
 

Mister E

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If on your own a small blob of superglue on the head of the bolt to stop it turning might work.
Then tighten the nut from the inside .
 
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