Another which boat to buy post.

[Noah78]

Thanks for the stability / weight comment. It seems to me to be prudent to consider safety preparedness on any long trip. Surprised to get such overwhelmingly negative responses. Air Cargo, like lugguge, gets lost. Sad if you look at the statistics. Would delete my post if I could figure out how. Kittens are regularly placed in dumpsters here with impunity or poisoned or shot or runover as the roads are used for racing, so perhaps living in some other places, some might not have the same perspective of what is an adventure and what is mistreatment. We are professionals, but live humbly, with our resources going to care for the animals we come across here. I suggest Adventure Cats for those who have not seen people travel with their cats before. I did look at catamarans, thanks frog, but they tend to be expensive, maybe I will have another look. I do see them used by some families on youtube. They are also 100% stable upside down however and they don't naturally 'spill' a gust. Thanks for the input. Thank you Mr. Baxter, that is true, I did mention the possibility of being limited on stops in my post, but this is another reason to be sure we are carefully provisioned and why I wanted to check the weight stability issue with everyone. I could never get my head around a concrete boat, but I see two people mentioned it, I will look. I remember reading a blog years ago about a couple who sailed the world in one which was so huge non of the yacht owners talked to them as they looked commercial. A couple of motorsailors we looked at are larger steel hulls and would carry a lot I expect. Interesting about the hull maintenance comment, thanks, we looked at a larger Carter 41, which has a really rough looking hull, but I think it's mostly dodgy paint, so it's safe but puts in almost in our budget because it's not pretty. Thanks Penfold, will skip the wooden hull.

 

[Biggles Wader]

The obvious choice would be a catamaran.

Must tri harder.
Will you enter the ARC?

 

[Wansworth]

I thought he wanted a cat?

 

[Stemar]

I won't add to the "Don't do it" comments, though they should begiven serious consideration, but one thing to consider is that you won't buy a boat at any sensible price and just set off across oceans. Whatever you buy will need fettling, which costs money. A €20k boat will probably need a fair bit of fettling - rigging, sails, instruments, etc., so I'd be looking more around the €15-17k range, to leave a budget for that.

The right 28 footer can cross oceans - as can plenty of smaller boats - Google "Shrimpy", but with all the supplies and paraphernalia for a long trip, it will be crowded and you won't be going as fast as you did on your trial sails.

Finally, I wouldn't limit myself to an Etap just because they're unsinkable. Yes, yachts do sink but, given the number that cross oceans, the number that do is extremely small. Also, cats can swim, even if they aren't very keen on it, and if you make it to the liferaft, I reckon you'll find the cats extremely keen to join you.

Finally, a top tip for cruising with animals is to have a piece of Astroturf and train them to use that. When they've done, tow it behind you for a few minutes. That'll save you 100kg of kitty litter!

 

[Wansworth]

There have been and there are boats demed unsuitable by the YBW forum but occasionally what would be classed as totally unsuitable makes a sea voyage,it’s really the skipper who Carrie’s the boat,all this choosing the right boat is ok but when there isn’t a choice it’s the crew that pull it through.

 

[Praxinoscope]

I still feel that confining an unspecified number of cats ( but several more than 5 according to the OP) on a relatively small boat, for what might easily become more than the 30 days envisaged, to be close to animal cruelty and would be very concerned about these poor creatures.
As Stemar #24 points out cats can swim but I don’t think halfway across the Atlantic is a reasonable distance so it could well be a frightening and watery end to one or more of your feline companions.
As for the Etap unsinkable? Wasn’t that how the Titanic was described?

 

[Biggles Wader]

That's a lot of animals in a small space. A bit of a squeeze which won't be cool for cats.

 

[jac]

Maybe consider something with a doghouse to ensure some protection on watch.

 

[dankilb]

Whisker pole is a must for a downwind crossing

 

[Praxinoscope]

Maybe consider something with a doghouse to ensure some protection on watch.

But no self respecting cat would use a doghouse unless it was glowing in the satisfaction on evicting the dog.

 

[doug748]

Whisker pole is a must for a downwind crossing

Yep, I would also have my mast in a tabbynacle.

 

[PeterMax]

I have an 1985 Etap 30 which I love and it's fine for one or two people on short offshore journeys but I would not attempt a trip like this particularly if you have no experience. Odds are you will have a torrid time and possibly make it with some luck but you could more probably be on the news after a rescue or for throwing cats overboard to stay sane. It is not designed for crossing major oceans. It is too light although it's a nice boat to sail, only weighs about 4 tonnes. A boat of that age will need major work done due to age, wear and tear, etc. It will not have enough storage for everything you want to take and it would be tantamount to animal cruelty to have so many of them on a boat like this. When I bought it I sailed it up from Cowes to the Medway with a delivery skipper in semi-rough conditions and although it was fine it was very rough on me, moving around the boat by hanging onto handholds. If you get seasick you will be miserable all the way. You need a 40 footer for a trip like this. If it is sound it does not have to be unsinkable - if you wander in front of a Dover ferry in an Etap it will still be unsinkable but probably in million pieces which you would not survive. People on here sound brutal but its cold reality. The sea needs your respect or it will kill you, don't mess around with it.

 

[Tinto]

I still feel that confining an unspecified number of cats ( but several more than 5 according to the OP) on a relatively small boat, for what might easily become more than the 30 days envisaged, to be close to animal cruelty and would be very concerned about these poor creatures.
As Stemar #24 points out cats can swim but I don’t think halfway across the Atlantic is a reasonable distance so it could well be a frightening and watery end to one or more of your feline companions.
As for the Etap unsinkable? Wasn’t that how the Titanic was described?

ETAP are unsinkable and are certified as such by passing the necessary tests. You can cut one in half with a chain saw and both ends will still float. Otherwise, you can open the sea cocks until the water level is the same inside as outside and it will keep sailing. In tests, it lost 1 knot on boat speed.

ETAP are a great company. Everything they did was done to the nth degree. I worked for the lighting company and they would hold a new product back a year just to get another 1% in efficiency. Everything they made was the most efficient you could buy. At one point the boats and light fittings were made in the same factory. Yachting then move 1km down the road but some components would be finished in the lighting factory, like anything that needed to be anodised, went in the aluminium reflector anodising bath.

Now and then I would be in the lighting factory and have a customer who was interested in boats, so I would take them down to the yachting factory and give them a tour of that. It was great, but it did smell a bit.

I would not be sailing one with 5 cats, that sounds like a very bad idea.

 

[boomerangben]

8 out 10 cats would probably find an ocean crossing a bit of a conundrum. They’ll be counting down the days with avid enthusiasm.

 

[fredrussell]

Must admit I share the OP’s liking of the idea of an ‘unsinkable’ boat. Blue water sailing not really my thing but if it were, I always thought a Sadler 34 would be a good boat to use for the same reason.

 

[HissyFit]

I'm beginning to wonder if the OP is simply suffering from nominative determinism.

I think he came up with the 'plan' before deciding on the username, so it doesn't count.

 

[Wansworth]

If his cats are anything like my two he will be constantly opening and closing the hatch?

 

[PeterMax]

I think the OP has left the show. The Sadler 34 looks great, much larger than an Etap 30, anything over 36 foot will be great and so much roomier than a 30 foot boat. Not sure why the fixation on the unsinkability, what are the stats for yachts that sink? Slept on mine last night during the warmer spell, am 6' 5" and the boat max 5, 11" so banged me noggin a few times. Next boat, main requirement, stand-up headroom. Honestly, size matters, sometimes, do enjoy the boat otherwise.
Etap 30 review is an interesting read.
Stability and Safety
What is Capsize Screening Formula (CSF)?
The capsize screening value for Etap 30 is 2.04, indicating that this boat would not be accepted to participate in ocean races.

Not good enough for ocean racing, definitely not good enough for cats, humans just have to tough it

 

[justanothersailboat]

I feel quite sorry for poor Noah, actually. I am certain that his plan had an awful lot of problems and pretty sure that his calculation of risk is very different from mine (yes pets occasionally die on flights, but it's rare - I've seen figures around one in twenty thousand, which is surprisingly high but I would be really surprised if transatlantic boat cats are that safe). But tearing him to pieces was not nice.

However... this capsize screening formula seems unreasonable to me. It only accepts boats that are narrow and heavy. Nothing on hull form or keel type or centre of gravity or anything. Does anyone really pay attention to this rather than the angle of vanishing stability?

 

[Praxinoscope]

As justanothersailboat, in #29 voices suspicions of the capsize formula,, I have also wondered if it really is up to the job. It seems to throw up some inconsistencies.