An open letter to Twister Ken

[Rich_F]

[ QUOTE ]
Another thought - why do we own boats, if not to go sailing. After all, if we wanted elbow room, comfort, a sea view and cat swinging room then a caravan at Selsey Bill would do the trick.

[/ QUOTE ]

There are lots of reasons to own boats - to race, to sail, to enjoy remote anchorages, to tinker, to participate in a social scene, to bolster status, etc, etc. You seem to argue that boat ownership should be focussed on the act of sailing.

I suspect that if our "sailing holiday" time was analysed, it would be something like 20% sailing, 65% living on the boat, 15% on land. So is it appropriate that sailing qualities should be the overriding concern?

By the way, I'm inclined to agree with your general feelings regarding AWBs. But I'm very happy to see other people solve the compromises of boat ownership in other ways. There's no "right" way to go about it - as long as it's fun and doesn't endanger others.

 

[Ships_Cat]

Wasn't it a family crew on a Rustler or Nicholson that rode out the Fastnet storm while all around them big racers were foundering

That is a myth.

Of the 14 boats over 42 foot that started only one retired, none were abandoned and no crew were lost.

Of the 289 smaller boats that started only 72 finished, 24 were abandoned and 15 crew were lost.

John

 

[cameronke]

Now that is bonny!

Regards
Cameron

 

[Twister_Ken]

But I've also been slowed to a virtual standstill by a 41 footer hobby horsing - I think that's more to do with WL and wave frequency. If the frequency is the wrong harmonic of the WL then not much happens apart from going sideways.

 

[Ships_Cat]

I agree on the slamming thing but is not a universal problem. For example, there are now many custom design/build fast long distance cruising yachts with straight stems and flat after sections which perform very well. No doubt some of the AWB's are capable of the same too.

John

 

[Sans Bateau]

So, at some stage or another any boat, long keel or AWB could be stoped by certain wave action.

 

[tome]

For sure, but a F6 channel chop put the handbrake on our 28ft boat very effectively.

 

[Sans Bateau]

[ QUOTE ]
For sure, but a F6 channel chop put the handbrake on our 28ft boat very effectively

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats odd, we did a channel crossing in our previous boat, a 28, we did Cherbourg to Nab tower in 10 hours! That was in similar conditions.

 

[Robin]

Which is why the skilled helm will sail a different angle on one tack than another, it changes the distance between waves. It is hard sometimes to accept that to go faster (or not stop) it is sometimes necessary to bear off more and point less. Once again no single answer or we would all have winners medals! One advantage of a good modern design is that generally they have the ability to point much closer than used to be the case, such that you CAN bear away for speed or to change the effective wavelength and still make ground fast upwind. On our previous W33 the optimum apparent wind angle in normal seastates was 35 degs, on our current SL41 at 35degs we have actually eased the sheets and are starting to fly so if in some wave conditions we have to use 35 degs instead of 28 then no sweat.

 

[tome]

Coming back was rarely a problem

 

[Guest]

/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[evenkeel]

It does not really matter what you sail .does it? but just a thought a lot AWB,S are just kept to use like a flat on the south coast never ever leave the marina! so they need the space. but people with older boats have less disposable income and dont have much choice but tend to use them. is this setting up a them and us disscusion ? we need to stick together

 

[paulskent]

Quote >>>but people with older boats have less disposable income and dont have much choice but tend to use them.<<<

You didn't really mean that did you ?

I have an AWB.. I am new to sailing. I am learning how to sail, how to keep it maintained and how to keep my crew happy and confident in my ability to keep them safe.

I feel that had I spent the same amount of money (or less) on "an older boat" I would have to spend more time on maintenance, worry, repairs, more worry etc etc. I want to go sailing not working out the best way of getting my body out of a cramped locker.

I would love to have bought a Najad or Southerly but for the money I could not afford one that was in a reasonable state of repair or that I would have been confident in.

One day when the ready cash is available I may change the boat. But for the next 5 years I will be fine.

On our Marina we have an old wooden/gaff rigged 40 footer called Pilkington. It used to be at Liverpool but the owner moved it so he could spend more time sailing and less time getting out of the Mersey. He has offered me a crewing opportunity and I can't wait. Now that will teach me a thing or two.

But I am sailing. I am having a great time..

AWB's, old boats, twisters, tossers, expensive old boats, cheap old boats, I love em all.. Even Cats /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[Sans Bateau]

If we all liked the same type of boat wouldnt it be boring?

You would have to go onto a 'waiting list' to buy a boat.

Its good as it is, and so much to debate!

 

[TigaWave]

Thats just what I was going to say Robin! its not what you've got its what you do with it...or something like that.

I learnt to sail on Twisters, raced on an open 60 and open 30, sigma 38, J24, cruised a Rival 38 and a Sweden 38 and crossed Biscay in my worst storm in a Bav390....
Coastal hopped on a Grimsby trawler, the sailing gaff rigged variety of around 60' if my memory serves me correctly.

You need to treat each boat differently in different conditions to get the best out of it, and have an enjoyable sail. I believe most boats are safe its the people who drive them that often aren't.

Each boat I sailed was great...they floated and got me back safely, some wetter than others.

Neil

 

[beancounter]

Re:Boats with soul

Ken's point about "boats with soul" is a good one, but it implies that it is something gifted to the boat by it's builder. I suspect that a boat's "soul" or character can equally come from it's owner - in some way a reflection of the character of the owner and the way he treats the craft.

Hmm, getting a bit metaphysical here....better get back to work

 

[evenkeel]

No i did not mean it ! sorry but your boat will be old in two years time and you will be spending as much as i am. gone are the days when a design run for ten or more years. here is to the time you join the good old boat set sooner than you think

 

[AlexL]

well said beancounter - and very eloquent too. I don't feel the need to justify my choice of boat to anyone, just as I don't expect anyone else to justify theirs to me. I assume that whatever boat / car / house anyone has that it was the best choice made with a very personal set of criteria, and that is where this argument can get nasty as criticism of that choice, is a criticism of those personal criteria, which is by definitiion a deeply personal insult.
Do I look forward to going to my boat at the weekend - yes - so I'm glad of the choice.

 

[paulskent]

[ QUOTE ]
No i did not mean it ! sorry but your boat will be old in two years time and you will be spending as much as i am. gone are the days when a design run for ten or more years. here is to the time you join the good old boat set sooner than you think

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed but by then I will have 2 more years experience and also a lot more personal time. I have worked it out to be about 4 years actually. All depends on Universities, Standard Life, The state of the IT industry and staying alive/healthy.

 

[Evadne]

The mechanical soul

I have an MAB and I believe she has "soul". I also have two motorbikes, one that is for fun and has bags of character and one that is perfect for commuting, completely biddable, hardly ever goes wrong, starts and stops at teh flick of a switch. That one has no "soul". I really don't know why I like No.1 better: it doesn't stop very well, it uses more petrol and doesn't run all that well most of the time.

Unfortunately I'm coming to the conclusion that a boat with "soul" is one which is imperfect, and who's foibles you ignore at your peril. A "soulless" boat is one which is technically better, but which we find difficulty in anthropomorphising 'cos it behaves as a machine should, doing whatever you tell it to. A boat that is stroppy (try reversing a long keeler) can end up endearing herself to you, but one that behaves as an extension of your tiller arm becomes invisible.

Do you think we like "soul" because sailors are masochists at heart (most MoBo pilots think that, I'm sure!) or is it because we like to think there's more character to our pride and joy than a white plastic magic carpet for getting from A to B whatever the weather?

Like you said, back to work I think....