Who should be blamed in this collision???

[Scotty_Tradewind]

From the position of the poles on the following S'sail boats, the skipper of the yacht involved in the collision may have changed his mind somewhat too late to get to the windward side of the ship rather than to be leeward side with a very long wind shadow.(?)

Whatever happened can anyone see any way the ship could be 'at fault'?

 

[fireball]

From the position of the poles on the following S'sail boats, the skipper of the yacht involved in the collision may have changed his mind somewhat too late to get to the windward side of the ship rather than to be leeward side with a very long wind shadow.(?)

Could be because at the time of making the late decision he was anticipating the ship to be turning to starboard - therefore going across the bows would've got them out of trouble ...
A bit like startled rabbits in the headlights - which way do they go?!

 

[Twister_Ken]

Could be because at the time of making the late decision he was anticipating the ship to be turning to starboard - therefore going across the bows would've got them out of trouble ...

Maybe, but he'd still be in the wrong, as well as in the soup.

 

[fireball]

Maybe, but he'd still be in the wrong, as well as in the soup.

yup - although if he'd gybed he probably wouldn't be looking to replace his mast and sails right now ...

50/50 call ... and he got that wrong too ...

 

[ScottishVega]

Don't know if anyone has noticed that on the video at at 0:25 before the collision it looks as if one of the crew has fallen in the water.

SV

 

[andygc]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tUoUxzt9sI&feature=related

Pretty clearly the yacht is pretty much HTW flogging the kite just before the incident. He sure as hell didn't get to that point sailing like that, so it must be a last second evasive reaction.

This is the first frame where he is fully visible. Sorry about the quality, but that's about the best you can do with a YouTube image. He continues to point straight at the camera, or slightly to the right (ie downwind) in subsequent frames. Note the direction of the boat in the foreground, which appears to be close-hauled on port tack. Boats behind the tanker are running. The racing fleet that crosses the line soon after the collision is also running. Look at the flag on the large motorboat marked Aberdeen which is not making any significant way through the water. Which way is the wind blowing? How far off the wind can you be and still be classed as head to wind?

Yes, he is certainly flogging the kite, but because he is close reaching, not HTW. I have no idea why he put himself onto that heading rather than bearing away somewhat earlier, and I don't plan on speculating.

 

[Oscarpop]

I take it all back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you watch the video, at 23 seconds he loses a man overboard.

 

[l'escargot]

True, but thank God and pure luck that there was no loss of life this time . But have you already forgotten the Ouzo incident and are you entirely satisfied that all risks have been mitigated or at least assessed ???
How about the co ordination between port authorities and race officials to regulate commercial shipping traffic during a race involving so many boats sharing the same strech of waters. Can you imagine an Olympic cycling road race sharing the same roads with lorries?

I haven't forgotten the Ouzo at all but the only common factor is there was a yacht and a ship involved. It wasn't Cowes week, it wasn't racing, it wasn't broad daylight, it wasn't in the Solent, it wasn't in a buoyed channel, it wasn't under control of VTS, it wasn't in a restricted zone. I don't really see the relevance of introducing it to this thread.

 

[Oscarpop]

MOB

He definitely losesa a crew member 10 seconds beforehand

 

[l'escargot]

MOB

That was when SCG were first alerted to an incident. One of the Sunsail boats put out a Mayday saying that there was a MOB from a boat near 'the big orange ship'.

 

[Oscarpop]

We really should all be eating humble pie. Myself included.

 

[Poignard]

We all make mistakes but the skipper will/should never live this one down.

And this forum will see it as its sacred public duty to make sure he isn't allowed to.

 

[alahol2]

There's another Video showing the yacht from slightly earlier.

 

[flaming]

Yes, he is certainly flogging the kite, but because he is close reaching, not HTW. I have no idea why he put himself onto that heading rather than bearing away somewhat earlier, and I don't plan on speculating.

Well if not HTW - definitely not an angle that his kite is going to work on. Hence my point being that he didn't arrive there sailing that angle - crossing at right angles. His course was basically the same as the Sunsail boats at that point in the race. So it appears to me that he arrived there head on to the ship.

 

[Oscarpop]

And this forum will see it as its sacred public duty to make sure he isn't allowed to.

PLease see my previous posts.

He lost a man overboard.

 

[l'escargot]

Despite your having a pop at me earlier in this thread, I think we actually agree on that. It seems so far backalong that I suggested that this is a pointless thread since it just restarts the Scuttlebutt one (which equally got nowhere), and wouldn't it be better to wait for the

That wasn't a pop. You made a quite unequivocal statement which indicated knowledge of the exchange between the skipper and the patrol boat. I just asked if you had that knowledge.

I think that exchange will have serious implications on how blame is apportioned.

 

[stav]

I haven't read all the posts for this but surely someone who needs to answer some questions is the skipper of the port authority boat heading in the opposite direction........"Oh showers this looks like paper work, get out of here"

My wonderings where if the ship delayed his turn to allow the yacht to clear and then the yacht stood on assuming the ship was going to turn, thus both ending upin the wrong place at the wrong time. Hope the Ships Captain does not get too much grief, that we have all learnt something and the port authority boat will be more proactive.

My 2p worth and so glad I am not based in the solent anymore.

 

[flaming]

There's another Video showing the yacht from slightly earlier.

Does he broach as he sails into the shot? Not very clear but if so... Blimey....

Trying to bear away (maybe saw it late, trying to obey instructions of the launch) - then broach and wind up slap in front of it and stopped. Seemingly also with a man in the water.

Doesn't explain why he was that close, but might explain why he's basically stopped.

 

[ScottishVega]

Whilst all this questioning of who is to blame is going on here, my thoughts are for the poor crew member who fell in. It looks like he/she fell in very close to the ship.

SV

 

[l'escargot]

...My wonderings where if the ship delayed his turn to allow the yacht to clear and then the yacht stood on assuming the ship was going to turn, thus both ending upin the wrong place at the wrong time...

There has been a suggestion that the ship signalled a turn to starboard and then didn't/wasn't able to follow through.