Volvo TAMD 73/74 and 75 ECU - Cause for concern?

[oldgit]

How many do they need to run off in the first batch ,only economic if produced in Shenzhen ?
Will need to be trade off between producing enough to make it economically viable and not having 249 ECUs on stock for years to come.
The original ECUs were eyewatering enough pricewise , how much each for a bespoke low volume run.
Somehow they will need to find out just how many are likely to be actually sold as opposed the perceived demand.

 

[kashurst]

If the electronic components are through hole technology, for the number involved it's easy to set up to build a few hundred. Just need a human and a soldering iron and a test rig.
If the technology is surface mount, you need a lot of set up and kit to build one, so may as well build 1000.
I doubt the actual unit costs more than £100 in parts. It's the set up time and software people are paying for.

 

[vas]

K, some other ECUs I've seen from that era (car ones though) were thru hole ones. Agree re 100quid or euro in parts.
Thing is they'll have to find/fabricate the plugs/sockets whatever you call them, where the harness will plug to, that'd be fun
well, fingers crossed that they keep on communicating with Mike and things progress!

V.

 

[petem]

How many do they need to run off in the first batch ,only economic if produced in Shenzhen ?
Will need to be trade off between producing enough to make it economically viable and not having 249 ECUs on stock for years to come.
The original ECUs were eyewatering enough pricewise , how much each for a bespoke low volume run.
Somehow they will need to find out just how many are likely to be actually sold as opposed the perceived demand.

As I said in an earlier post, my guess is that there's c. 20,000 engines out there with these ECU's. EC failures are not uncommon (I replaced one earlier in the year). At a retail price of £3,000+ if Volvo don't make a fresh batch then I am confident somebody else will.

 

[petem]

We do know who made the original units and they are purely manufacturing automotive parts now and were unable to help at all.
A good thought nonetheless.
Mike

Mike, are you saying that someone other than Nira will be making the new ones?

I wonder if they will be made to a new design.

 

[rafiki_]

We do know who made the original units and they are purely manufacturing automotive parts now and were unable to help at all.
A good thought nonetheless.
Mike

Mike, you want an automotive manufacturer to make these parts. They will be quality assured to TS 16949. Marine only suppliers will not have this process capability. Whether the ECU’s are fitted to cars, trucks or boats will make little or no difference.

 

[Imperial One]

Mike, automotive parts as in ECUs again, or moved to something else without PCBs, chips et al?
Struggle to understand the "Moved to automotive" tbh! It means nothing.
I think you should start pressing sooner rather than later as the whole process (if they are indeed keen to pursue!) may imply an redesign of the thing as someone mentioned already in the thread.
Wont be easy and wont be fast getting through QA on something that most likely don't even have a bl00dy engine to test on!!!
Genuine Q, Can Volvo actually get someone to built something afresh, program it with their tools and give it to one of their engineers to test it on a boat and that's it? very much doubt it!

good luck!

V.

Vas,
All good observations, I guess only tim ewill tell but they shoal dhave all the specs drawings and test rig somewhere.
We have offered the boat in question as a test bed so Volvo certainly have an option there already.
The owner and I are 100% certain the engine will start as Volvo Paul swapped the units from one to the other to be 100% certain the ECU was duff. Duff!! How polite am I being?
They know of Volvo Paul and commented that he has a good reputation, so if they have no engineers available, Paul is the go to man.

Thanks again for all the support from everyone.

Mike.

 

[Imperial One]

Mike, are you saying that someone other than Nira will be making the new ones?

I wonder if they will be made to a new design.

Pete,
My understanding is they are looking for a new manufacturer as Nira are out of the game.
Sorry for slow reply.

Mike.

 

[Imperial One]

How many do they need to run off in the first batch ,only economic if produced in Shenzhen ?

As far as I am concerned just one will do initially.?
I If this idea worked out, I wonder if anybody might want to come and crew for me as well as being interested observers and agreeing to complete a questionnaire to send back to Volvo?
We could call it a Forum cruise........
Mike.

 

[Imperial One]

Mike, you want an automotive manufacturer to make these parts. They will be quality assured to TS 16949. Marine only suppliers will not have this process capability. Whether the ECU’s are fitted to cars, trucks or boats will make little or no difference.

Hi Rafiki,
Volvo will/should be well aware of this and I hope will be able to find a suitable prouction facility.
Cheers,
Mike.

 

[rafiki_]

Hi Rafiki,
Volvo will/should be well aware of this and I hope will be able to find a suitable prouction facility.
Cheers,
Mike.

There are lots of manufacturers who can do this in the U.K. They need a spec and volumes to agree a price/unit.

 

[volvopaul]

There are lots of manufacturers who can do this in the U.K. They need a spec and volumes to agree a price/unit.

Not sure if you have seen one , it’s not an ecu that sits in a plastic box , it’s a combined fuel filter housing with separate boost sensor all in one , the original process must involve at least 3 different companies to produce it . Over the last few months mike and myself have tried to extract from Volvo which part of the link is missing because the same blank ecu fits the 44/300/73/74/75/Some TD industrial engines etc , it’s produced blank and programmed after order through VP network specific to order obviously by a human and sent to dealer , a non returnable part so no actual stock ever held as a programmed unit .

No answer as to which part of the link is missing , maybe NIRA automotive got pissed off with Volvo trying to shave down the price every year .

 

[sharpness]

Following on from Volvopaul, for anyone unsure what the ecu in question looks like, below is a pic of one from a TAMD75, not mine I should add, it's a picture taken from internet.

 

[petem]

Following on from Volvopaul, for anyone unsure what the ecu in question looks like, below is a pic of one from a TAMD75, not mine I should add, it's a picture taken from internet.
View attachment 104646

That's an early one I believe. The later ones have thicker cloudier potting compound completely obscuring the circuit board.

 

[petem]

Not sure if you have seen one , it’s not an ecu that sits in a plastic box , it’s a combined fuel filter housing with separate boost sensor all in one , the original process must involve at least 3 different companies to produce it . Over the last few months mike and myself have tried to extract from Volvo which part of the link is missing because the same blank ecu fits the 44/300/73/74/75/Some TD industrial engines etc , it’s produced blank and programmed after order through VP network specific to order obviously by a human and sent to dealer , a non returnable part so no actual stock ever held as a programmed unit .

No answer as to which part of the link is missing , maybe NIRA automotive got pissed off with Volvo trying to shave down the price every year .

I read somewhere that they are attached to the fuel filter to aid cooling.

 

[jon and michie]

I wonder if they will be made to a new design.

With today's technology why not ? and as Volvopaul has stated it's a 3 in 1 unit - Why not make an updated separate one instead of complicating things thus having this situation that Imperial One is experiencing.

Jon

 

[kashurst]

The picture of the ECU reveals that the design is typical 1990s surface mount assembled electronics. Microcontroller, flash memory, small RAM,some power transistors and simple logic gates and op amps to glue it all together. Problem will be getting those parts.
Re-designing it is easy enough. Unfortunately it will then need proper testing. Hopefully Volvo will be happy to do that.

 

[volvopaul]

Following on from Volvopaul, for anyone unsure what the ecu in question looks like, below is a pic of one from a TAMD75, not mine I should add, it's a picture taken from internet.
View attachment 104646

nice one john , I tried to post one but this forum is absolute rubbish when it comes to loading pics .

 

[Imperial One]

As yet I have not had my weekly update but it was nearly 6pm last week so fingers crossed.

Mike.

 

[Imperial One]

No weekly update after all!