Radio

[boomerangben]

Its surprising how often CG incident reports comment that the casualties mobile phone batteries were failing thus complicating SAR operations. CG can also often pinpoint a casualty's location by VHF RDF.

I think the key thing here is how many incidents where mobile phones running out of batteries is an issue are from vessels (ie PWC) which don’t carry fixed or hand held radios?

It would be interesting to know what proportion of call-outs of life boats/CG rescue teams/SAR are to individuals/groups who wouldn’t normally consider having by a radio and therefore a mobile phone is the only option?

 

[boomerangben]

I really cannot understand why someone would not have a working VHF radio of some form on their boat. I always thought it was standard kit that everyone has and everyone uses. Both my boats have a fixed and handheld VHF and if for some reason i did not have one working on board i would not be leaving the marina. A mobile is useful but its totally unsuitable for all situations at sea. I would very much doubt if any of the services used in emergencise have my mobile number, probably less than 5% of folks in my marina have it, none of the local commercial traffic, all of them have spoken to me on VHF in the last year. I guess if you are in a river or loch then it may not be used much, but in the sea, i just dont understand why you would not have one. I was equally shocked how few folks have a VHF license. Folks talk about what great boat handlers / navigators and so on that they are, have boats worth tens of thousands of pounds and more, yet dont have what should really be the basics in hand.

I think you need to qualify this with a size of boat. Should I carry a radio in a 7m boat without a 12v system? (I do). Should a kayak or jet ski carry one? Do you always have one when you go out in the dinghy?

In my limited experience, I find that people hate using the radio or have little radio etiquette, or are so bound up by saying everything three times that messages are either non existent or overly verbose. There’s a need for radio licensing but because people get so little practice/it was so long ago, is the current licensing system fit for purpose

 

[johnalison]

So in going to the Netherlands- which I believe that you have done, fairly recently- you would not consider a VHF an essential means of communication, with locks, bridges & ports of entry etc.?

It is several years now, too many, since I visited Dutchland. Clearly, anyone going to sea should comply with whatever regulations are in force for the area, and for visiting countries with specific obligations, such as the Scheldt estuary. There are plenty of small day-boats that negotiate inland Holland without radios, as we did in the ‘80s, so it must be possible, but I haven’t looked at the regulations lately, having had compliant radios myself for many years. Even with normal radios you can be caught out, as we found at Scheveningen where the marina VHF channel was some weird one that we don’t use in the UK. As I have said, the regulations must absolutely be obeyed, but if someone wants to make life hard for themselves by denying what the rest of us enjoy, that is entirely up to them as far as I’m concerned.

 

[Refueler]

It is required if your boat is more than 7.5m and you want to use the locks, marinas etc.
It also has to comply with the VDES regulations coming into force next Monday, with ATIS enabled and GMDSS disabled once you are on the inland waterways.

Will have to look into this .... GMDSS disabled ??

 

[Daydream believer]

Will have to look into this .... GMDSS disabled ??

Yes.--Switching ATIS on for canal regulated channels, should mean GMDSS is automatically switched off, on a modern radio. At least that is how I understand the issue is managed. I am not sure what happens on coastal waters.

 

[Refueler]

Yes.--Switching ATIS on for canal regulated channels, should mean GMDSS is automatically switched off, on a modern radio. At least that is how I understand the issue is managed. I am not sure what happens on coastal waters.

I have radios with ATIS and GMDSS capability ... never looked deeper into it ...

 

[diverd]

Its really up to you if you use one, i do, and always will, some folks i guess see it as an inconvenience or unnecessary expense , as i say, i dont understand why you would not carry a VHF. The size of the vessel is probably less important that whats its doing, a mile off shore in a trawler or a kayak carrys the same exposure when you end up in the water. I certainly see the sea kayakers using them, but i dont think i have ever seen a jet ski using one, and way back when i had a jetski i did not use one, but that was decades ago. When in the dingy i use a waterproof handheld. Its probably a greater risk than the yacht, and its way better than my phone, which is probably not waterproof. I like to be as self sufficient as i can be, and where possible to do things correctly.

30 years in the emergency services does make you think differently about the risks, and the discussion about a mobile v a VHF to me is obvious, most of us have both anyway. I agree lots of folks dislike speaking on the radio, i spent most of my working life with one clipped to my jacket so dont even think about using one, its a tool to be used. Etiquette on the radio is often very poor, but practice and education can fix that very quickly.

I was just thinking about the last time someone that i did not know contacted me my VHF. A survey boat skipper, was contacting every boat heading into and out of a very large quiet bay a lot of us use. He was towing some kind of side scan device and anytime anyone looked to be heading into the bay, or anyone running parallel to him was called and asked what our intentions were, which is fair enough. The port control told us as we were leaving to watch for him, so we knew he was there but he contacted everyone and explained what he was doing and the space he needed. He wanted to make sure none of us wrecked his search pattern. Obviously this would be impossible by mobile phone, he would not have had my number. We did however hear a discussion between port control and the survey boat, complaining a yacht had ignored his calls on the port channel and 16, both were quite uncomplimentary about the yachtie, who had probably turned it off as soon as they left the harbour.

 

[snowbird30ds]

As most harbours and ports require a listening watch on their working channel it seems madness not to have one to me.

 

[Alicatt]

Yes.--Switching ATIS on for canal regulated channels, should mean GMDSS is automatically switched off, on a modern radio. At least that is how I understand the issue is managed. I am not sure what happens on coastal waters.

That is how it should work, there are also different channels between Belgium and Holland, with the adoption of the VDES (VHF Digital Exchange System) channels we now get channel 31 which was an exclusive Dutch channel here for marinas, the Dutch also have ch37 for marinas which is not allowed in Belgium.
We have a different check box on the ship's radio licence for DSC (GMDSS) enabled radios, same for handheld, and a separate licence/exam qualification for GMDSS enabled radios.
For coastal waters we can use GMDSS and switch off the ATIS. I'm not sure if I can have both on at the same time, don't have my radio to hand to check, but GMDSS and ATIS can be enabled and disabled with the programming software for the handheld. My radio has 3 operating modes, so I can have one set of channels for ATIS, one for GMDSS, and one international for say the UK.
Standard Horizon have not got their firmware updated yet for VDES, but, you can switch on and off the required channels, however, at the moment the radios don't use the new data channels to send and receive data.

This is my ship's radio licence:

 

[Daydream believer]

Standard Horizon have not got their firmware updated yet for VDES, but, you can switch on and off the required channels, however, at the moment the radios don't use the new data channels to send and receive data.

Interesting comment.
I am about to purchase a new fixed VHF for the boat.In view of that I may hang back a coule of months if an upgrade is on its way. I do not need it just yet & installation is a straightforward swop for my old Simrad

 

[Bilgediver]

VHF every day.



Plus the Coast Guard can sometimes triangulate your approximate position just from your transmission even if you don’t have DSC.

Regardless of the help of DSC most larger lifeboats can DF. On a VHF signal with remarkable accuracy . This can be a big help when trying g to find a small vessel in a confused sea.

 

[Refueler]

Interesting comment.
I am about to purchase a new fixed VHF for the boat.In view of that I may hang back a coule of months if an upgrade is on its way. I do not need it just yet & installation is a straightforward swop for my old Simrad

The price of the SH VHF was lower on special deal couple months back ... so I bought one. The GPS/E version of course being in EU.

Just had a look at the manual and it has a couple of pages dedicated to setting up ATIS ... without going into it deeper - I just quick read it .. basically I can enable or disable ATIS .. and it appears to have grouping of ch's .. where I choose International, Canada or USA channel mapping. I didn't see any mention of selecting individual ch's ... but as I say - I only quickly looked.
It had no mention of ATIS vs GMDSS ... again need to read it more carefully to be sure.

Will I enable ATIS ?? Not so far .. only if I venture further afield to inland waterways etc. of Germany etc.

TBH - its still in box as I will wait to install ... with change of registry planned for the boat - I don't want to play with MMSI etc. yet. The old Green box Sailor VHF will do till then.

 

[Buck Turgidson]

On my B&G V50 it's either or.

 

[Tomaret]

My oneline answer to that is simple, do you know how busy the Solent is?

The chances of us being the nearest boat without actually seeing the person in distress are VERY slim. If the radio was turned up I would probably of tuned out of the chatter in my head anyway.

There is only a requirement to listen for GMDSS alerts by law if I recall correct. Radio turned down low, it's still surprising the amount of distress we hear. My thinking is when I get Class B AIS, I may even turn it down further. Others will be able to tell me if I am closer - now I am going to get a telling off.

Although I will probably miss the dull back ground chatter and turn it up, I notice if a winter (less traffic) the radio is generally turned up more.

The only times we have rendered assistance in the Solent has been because we have seen them with our own eyes. There's one we still exchange Christmas gifts with over a decade later.

Other times I have been close but another boat has been better able to get there before I could. On one occasion we where going to small vessel, lower freeboard and better able to assist (small boat outboard breakdown). The other boat still insisted on being the rescue vessel, I wasn't going to argue.
The other boat left them in the boat and towed them. With an hour's towing we would of invited them onboard, put the kettle on and opened biscuits.

If people used the NCI Coast watch instead of the coastguard the rest of us would not have to listen to constant inane radio chatter.

Last summer a single-handed sailor in a mobo made a mayday call in the Solent, as we were heading west past Cowes en route for Weymouth. We listened to the exchange with Solent Coastguard and quickly realised that the casualty was in our vicinity. We were able to spot the boat and went to her assistance. We were by no means the closest vessel - plenty of others were either not monitoring Ch16, or not interested in coming to the aid of a fellow sailor. Had nobody responded the RNLi would have been turned out to tow the boat back to Cowes.