chrisharris
Active member
I think that about covers it! ?
Premier Marinas - Why haven't they furloughed staff?
- Thread starter migs
- Start date
matt1
Well-known member
As I understand it Marinas were instructed to close by authorities and the Police. I don't think it was their decision
I just don't get this. Boats are still secure, connected to electric, possibly still connected to wifi and still subject to access control / CCTV and inspection by marina staff. If I follow the logic of this thread then if I was a car lease holder on an 12kpa car lease I'd be stopping my DD to the lease co or asking for a refund! As previously mentioned. I'm on a pile mooring and it never even crossed my mind to to ask the Hbr authority or Crown Estate for a refund. I guess Marinas also have to pay Crown Estate fees?
Bobc
Well-known member
The government regulations say that you are only allowed to travel for necessary things such as food shopping. If you are abiding by this, you shouldn't even know whether the marina is open or not.
The reality is that if the government had said that you were allowed to travel to your boat and take it out, then the marina would be open and providing the relevant facilities, and if not, asking for a rebate would be valid.
It is not the marina's fault that you can't use your boat of their facilities, and as such why should they be forced to provide compensation.
With regard to furloughing their staff, why should the taxpayer (i.e. me) pay for your discount? I am pleased that they have kept all staff on and are not relying on the taxpayer. If they have to rely on the taxpayer, it should only be for protecting the employees, NOT for providing you with a rebate.
The reality is that if the government had said that you were allowed to travel to your boat and take it out, then the marina would be open and providing the relevant facilities, and if not, asking for a rebate would be valid.
It is not the marina's fault that you can't use your boat of their facilities, and as such why should they be forced to provide compensation.
With regard to furloughing their staff, why should the taxpayer (i.e. me) pay for your discount? I am pleased that they have kept all staff on and are not relying on the taxpayer. If they have to rely on the taxpayer, it should only be for protecting the employees, NOT for providing you with a rebate.
chrisharris
Active member
I think we have been round this loop rather more than is useful. There are people firmly on both sides of the discussion. The marinas have decided to close in response to the gov guidance, they were not legally required to do so. The RYA has a really good explanation of the law, guidance, and responses across the marine industry, and importantly the potential impacts if people disregard the current guidance. The marinas 'could' furlough their staff under the terms of the scheme offered, they 'could', or possibly even will, receive a rates rebate. They are unlikely to be affected significantly by Covid, at least for this yr. They will certainly be doing a great deal better than many other businesses. The marinas 'could' offer their customers/berthholders some credit against fees paid as a goodwill gesture in recognition of the current situation. It would be very difficult to compel them to do so, even if anyone would be inclined to try. The tax payer argument is all dependent on whether the marinas decide to take up the offers of gov support, if they do then (in my view) it moves the balance further towards some sort of rebate/credit as many of us would be effectively paying twice!
FlyingGoose
Well-known member
Read the guidelines which were updated . read then carefully and you will see words like exercise read them carefully plenty of arguments on here have now been disproven
You as the tax payer are not paying my discount the marina is, if this is hard for you to understand I can spell it out for you or even show you how a profit and loss account works if you like.
As per many previous posts regarding service industries which no one responds to , if this was a hotel would you be happy
, you keep harping on about marinas as if you owned them , but with you attitude that we are all rich with boats and we should suck it up shows how far away from society you are ,This goes for the constant barrage of stay at home, which is factually incorrect and morally wrong for those needing to get out ,
Consumer law not marine law, offering a service and not getting that service no matter what happens , contractual law . not you opinion will win in the end , oh and if you do not get or ask for your refund thank you for paying for mine
,
Bobc
Well-known member
Me, me, me. It's all about me with you isn't it, and to hell with everyone else. Well best of luck.Read the guidelines which were updated . read then carefully and you will see words like exercise read them carefully plenty of arguments on here have now been disproven
You as the tax payer are not paying my discount the marina is, if this is hard for you to understand I can spell it out for you or even show you how a profit and loss account works if you like.
As per many previous posts regarding service industries which no one responds to , if this was a hotel would you be happy
This goes for the constant barrage of stay at home, which is factually incorrect and morally wrong for those needing to get out ,
Consumer law not marine law, offering a service and not getting that service no matter what happens , contractual law . not you opinion will win in the end , oh and if you do not get or ask for your refund thank you for paying for mine
,
duncan99210
Well-known member
Just to say that while central government regulations don’t absolutely require the closure of marinas at least in Falmouth the Harbour Commissioners have issued a NTM effectively closing the harbour and marinas facilities for recreational vessels (Link https://www.falmouthharbour.co.uk/w...RS-0820-Compliance-with-COVID-19-measures.pdf). I’ve not bothered searching for other harbours but it wouldn’t surprise me to find that there are similar notices in force elsewhere.
So it would appear that there is some legal force behind some marina closures.
So it would appear that there is some legal force behind some marina closures.
newtothis
Well-known member
If the marina has to give you a discount, it will furlough its staff, then I will be paying for you to get a discount on your hobby.
Sound fair?
Everyone has got to make sacrifices, even those poor hit-upon people who keep their boats at south coast marinas.
dom
Well-known member
Mind you, if second home owners manage to collect £10,000 while dodging Council Tax through a drafting loophole in the UK Govt Covid support packages, well that would be really taking the mick and the Govt will pay for it dearly.
steveeasy
Well-known member
Well strictly speaking they did not ask my business to close nor all of our competitors, but for some crazy irrational reason we all did. (IT WAS BECAUSE OF A WORLDWIDE PANDEMIC WITH THE REAL RISK MILLIONS OF PEOPLE COULD DIE IN A SHORT PERIOD OF TIME) Carrying on would have ruined our reputation, potentially lead to some people catching the virus and of course our own wealfare and that of staff. I feel really sorry for shops still trading with the risks to them and indeed any other persons putting themselves in danger. A hotel would refund you cos you would not be there. Your boat is parked up and and really who gives adame if you cant walk down your pontoon for a few weeks. Id be really peeved if some people could and could not.
Its not just premier who are not offering refunds/discounts or a freebee, the majority of places are not. my yard are not and id not even consider asking them too. they may well expect me to but im not. cos its my responsibility to pay for my boat while its on one of their berths. Of course if I find out some people have had access and I cant then its a different matter.
Steveeasy
Its not just premier who are not offering refunds/discounts or a freebee, the majority of places are not. my yard are not and id not even consider asking them too. they may well expect me to but im not. cos its my responsibility to pay for my boat while its on one of their berths. Of course if I find out some people have had access and I cant then its a different matter.
Steveeasy
FlyingGoose
Well-known member
Marinas are however sympathetic to boat owners who are unable to access their boats and/or find themselves having to pay increased fees due to the Covid-19 crisis; marinas therefore encourage boat owners who find themselves in this situation to talk to their marina manager who will consider each customers situation carefully
This ferocious fear of a virus with a very low worldwide death rate to the population and will be brought under control is for the fear mongers and the Armageddon hanger ons , move on from this fear it will put people into an early grave
Such a British attitude , no dear we must not tell the waitress there is a fly in my soup keep quite .
Marinas are therefore obligated to discourage people from visiting their boats and additionally to close their sites to berth holders and visitors
Marinas are however sympathetic to boat owners who are unable to access their boats and/or find themselves having to pay increased fees due to the Covid-19 crisis; marinas therefore encourage boat owners who find themselves in this situation to talk to their marina manager who will consider each customers situation carefully
Impact of Covid-19 on marinas and marina customers - The Yacht Harbour Association
You do not ask you do not get , me I will be asking and getting my discount, paid for by you lot what a laugh that one is , plenty of marinas have contacted their customers and told them they will look at it once they get a grip on the financial benefits they can apply for ,
This ferocious fear of a virus with a very low worldwide death rate to the population and will be brought under control is for the fear mongers and the Armageddon hanger ons , move on from this fear it will put people into an early grave
Such a British attitude , no dear we must not tell the waitress there is a fly in my soup keep quite .
Marinas are therefore obligated to discourage people from visiting their boats and additionally to close their sites to berth holders and visitors
Marinas are however sympathetic to boat owners who are unable to access their boats and/or find themselves having to pay increased fees due to the Covid-19 crisis; marinas therefore encourage boat owners who find themselves in this situation to talk to their marina manager who will consider each customers situation carefully
Impact of Covid-19 on marinas and marina customers - The Yacht Harbour Association
migs
Active member
Ok all; let’s cut to the chase:
THIS VOTE IS FOR MARINA BERTH HOLDERS ONLY
A: You would like your marina to furlough non-working staff and would appreciate a rebate
B: You do not want your marina to furlough non-working staff and do not require a rebate
NB1. Your vote will be automatically sent to your marina
NB2. Any posters who continue to regurgitate the same old stuff we’ve seen already on this thread will have their icons cut in half
THIS VOTE IS FOR MARINA BERTH HOLDERS ONLY
A: You would like your marina to furlough non-working staff and would appreciate a rebate
B: You do not want your marina to furlough non-working staff and do not require a rebate
NB1. Your vote will be automatically sent to your marina
NB2. Any posters who continue to regurgitate the same old stuff we’ve seen already on this thread will have their icons cut in half
laika
Well-known member
As stated in a couple of other posts, "on full pay" does not mean " not furloughed and claiming the government allowance". Companies concerned with staff retention or "doing the right thing" by their employees may pay the additional 20% to yield "full pay". The OP and others may have not understood this. It would be bad business and bad for public health to not furlough temporarily redundant staff and have them on site but twiddling thumbs, so without evidence to the contrary ( which you may have but I haven't seen) I'd be surprised if no one is furloughed. (Ie this entire thread is based on a misassumption in the OP)
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Sticky Fingers
Well-known member
B.
migs
Active member
A
SaltyC
Well-known member
My current understanding of MY position is:-
I cannot access the marina, so paying full rate but no access, currently on hard and need to complete work.
Marina have Furloughed staff - at staffs request ( OOOOh can live on 80% and do nothing) so costs are reduced, implication is profits are increased.
It is not a South Coast Marina, some cannot afford that luxury, my hope is the Marina will come out of the crisis level so no future increases.
With luck may get to Antifoul and launch this summer so can sail at some point
I cannot access the marina, so paying full rate but no access, currently on hard and need to complete work.
Marina have Furloughed staff - at staffs request ( OOOOh can live on 80% and do nothing) so costs are reduced, implication is profits are increased.
It is not a South Coast Marina, some cannot afford that luxury, my hope is the Marina will come out of the crisis level so no future increases.
With luck may get to Antifoul and launch this summer so can sail at some point
Frogmogman
Well-known member
I just don't accept this argument that because you can't use your boat you deserve a discount from the marina. There are sooooo many other examples of us being unable to use the stuff we've paid for.
I wasn't able to go skiing for the two weeks I was planning in the second half of March, and was unable to rent out my ski flat for the weeks in April. I still have to pay all the charges associated with the building (FWIW that's about €6000/pa). That's just tough tits for me.
I wasn't able to go skiing for the two weeks I was planning in the second half of March, and was unable to rent out my ski flat for the weeks in April. I still have to pay all the charges associated with the building (FWIW that's about €6000/pa). That's just tough tits for me.
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Resolution
Well-known member
B.
I cannot access my marina (in Turkey) , boat is in the water and I am enormously grateful that the staff there are taking extra steps to look after the boat (and others). Very much doubt if we will be able to use it this year. At my age, putting things off till next year is less and less of an option.
I cannot access my marina (in Turkey) , boat is in the water and I am enormously grateful that the staff there are taking extra steps to look after the boat (and others). Very much doubt if we will be able to use it this year. At my age, putting things off till next year is less and less of an option.
Resolution
Well-known member
Do you really mean that having your discount paid for by UK taxpayers is a laugh?
migs
Active member
I agree with Frogmogman that it’s unlikely that a case based on ‘loss of use ‘ would result in a marina discount. This point has been made several times already, but it’s not what this thread is about.
The central issue under discussion is: why hasn’t Premier furloughed its staff?
A secondary question is: if marinas realise excess profits as a result of the pandemic, what is a fair outcome for their customers?
PS. I still believe that Premier have not furloughed staff as the most recent thing we heard from them was “we [Premier] need greater clarity on the extent of Government assistance that is available”. Incidentally, my conclusion was not based on the 100% pay statement as I am well aware that furlough plus 20% top up = 100%. Perhaps someone who works at Premier could clarify the actual situation?
The central issue under discussion is: why hasn’t Premier furloughed its staff?
A secondary question is: if marinas realise excess profits as a result of the pandemic, what is a fair outcome for their customers?
PS. I still believe that Premier have not furloughed staff as the most recent thing we heard from them was “we [Premier] need greater clarity on the extent of Government assistance that is available”. Incidentally, my conclusion was not based on the 100% pay statement as I am well aware that furlough plus 20% top up = 100%. Perhaps someone who works at Premier could clarify the actual situation?