cherod
Well-known member
I dont know of any cruisuing yachtsmen “ making a living “ , perhaps you might like to elaborate ?
Orca attack
- Thread starter Sailfree
- Start date
Bristolfashion
Well-known member
When we were cycling in France, my wife was knocked off her bike and bitten by an alsatian (we were just cycling on the road through a perfectly normal village), which also raised some rabies fears, should we,
1. Cull all dogs,
2. Cull all Alsatians
3. Cull all French dogs,
4. Just cull that dog?
1. Cull all dogs,
2. Cull all Alsatians
3. Cull all French dogs,
4. Just cull that dog?
billskip
Well-known member
5. Nuke the village....
LePacha
Well-known member
Stop cycling? Wear greaves? Change wife?
capnsensible
Well-known member
We did.
Graham376
Well-known member
You said - apparently it is ok for someone from one part of the world to move into another part of the world and start killing off the wildlife so that they can “ make a living “
I replied - I find that reply ill informed, suggesting the complainants are all immigrants and totally ignoring the view of the many sailing/boating citizens of the countries concerned, who want to see a small number of orcas culled.
How is my reply a misinterpretation of your statement that immigrants are the problem?
cherod
Well-known member
“ someone “ does in no way imply every one
. From what i read on here it is mostly the passing cruisers doing the complaining , according to one poster , incomer , it is the local wild life that is the problem , what nxt , the indiginous population ?
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noelex
Well-known member
It depends on the circumstances, but dogs that have (unprovoked) attacked and bitten people are often euthanised. Dangerous breeds that are frequently involved in attacks have been banned in some areas.
Even in Australia wild animals that attack humans, (including protected species) have been destroyed because of the perceived ongoing danger. For different reasons (mainly economic) we also cull wild kangaroos (around 3 million per year).
I am not sure that culling even a very small number of orcas is justified at this stage. They are magnificent mammals, and I abhor cruelty to animals. Personally, I would like to see other non lethal measures properly trialled, but it is not right to suggest that a cull of the very small number of mammals (10-15) that are endangering human life is unprecedented, or that serious consideration of this option is ludicrous.
This problem needs to be solved both for the long term good of the orcas as well as humans. If this behaviour spreads more drastic measures will be needed in the future.
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Zing
Well-known member
Probably the same humanity despising idiots that think it cute to have wolves reintroduced in the woods where little children used to play.
cherod
Well-known member
Morrocans are from Morroco , spanish are from Spain 
, what a wonderful insight into the demographics of the area 
, and english yachtsmen are from england but still want to dictate local practices , i suppose thats the type of hypocrisies from those who cant see the bigger picture .
, what a wonderful insight into the demographics of the area , and english yachtsmen are from england but still want to dictate local practices , i suppose thats the type of hypocrisies from those who cant see the bigger picture .
capnsensible
Well-known member
British people in Gibraltar. Not good at geography?Morrocans are from Morroco , spanish are from Spain
But never mind its not your livelihood threatened is it? Or the lives of your crew. Or severe damage to your yacht. Or the difficult problems faced by the local fishing fleets. And harbours. And those in fish production and delivery. Etc etc. Like I said if a pack of wild animals were preventing you from carrying out your normal life you and others like you would probably be raging.
Now tell me again about hypocrisy....
Your all right Jack.
Graham376
Well-known member
“ someone “ does in no way imply every one
Maybe it hasn't occurred to you that what you read here is because it's an English speaking forum, hardly surprising it's not frequented by French, Portuguese, Spanish and Moroccan only speakers. My wife being a citizen, many of our sailing/boating friends are also Portuguese citizens and I can assure you they are very vociferous about wanting something done about the problem.
When we leave the Ria, whether heading east or west, we're immediately sailing in the Tuna migration area and several boats have been attacked within a couple of miles of here. If that happened on your sailing area, I think your attitude would be very different.
capnsensible
Well-known member
Indeed it's abundantly clear that some posters have no idea whatsoever about the scale of the problem. Dozens of ports and marinas. Thousands of yacht, many thousands of people. Who knows how many Small Moroccan small craft hand lining. Plus of course hundreds and hundreds of yacht and their crews passing backwards and forwards through the Straits.
Still, 1500 miles away, I'm all right Jack.....
RobbieW
Well-known member
Coupla things...
Hadnt read until the last week about fishermen suffering Orca problems. Until now the feeling here was that fishermen had the power to outrun Orca but that may reflect Spanish & Portuguese rather than Moroccan. Isnt hand/long lining always going to suffer predation from up the food chain though and is it more than that ?
On leisure sailors, there are routes which are shown to be safer. As Orca have a history of fads, qv wearing fish on thier heads in the NW Pacific, which last a finite time, it is likely the current fad of interfering with yachts rudders will also disappear over time. It may be inconvenient but surely using those safer routes for now is the way to go ?
As you know, I'm no stranger to those waters but not sailing there currently. There are also reports here from frequent users who have not had problems, are they just lucky or do they play the odds and use the suggested routing ?
doug748
Well-known member
Yes. Plus the elevation of "conservation" and "animal rights" to a quasi religion. The concept of sacred cows used to baffle us, now the new age types have brought this ideology to our own doorstep.
.
Graham376
Well-known member
Close inshore is the safest route when nets don't get in the way. Bearing in mind the number of boats along the Portuguese and SW Spain coasts, the majority will not have a problem. In truth, those attacked are in a tiny minority but we don't want to join them.
Bristolfashion
Well-known member
No, no, you've completely missed the point, any animal that even threatens to inconvenience a human must be instantly destroyed.
Bristolfashion
Well-known member
I agree with you - research and non - lethal techniques. Some here, however, advocate culling or the introduction of untried techniques that are medieval design/ of unknown effectiveness or may cause serious injuries or a lingering death.
Bristolfashion
Well-known member
Nice try, but whilst the number of people on the water may be large, the number of significant attacks is tiny in comparison.
I'm happy to confirm to local restrictions for environmental, social, economic or military reasons wherever I sail - you aren't, which is your decision.
You may wish to restrict your own concerns very tightly to the area in which you operate, but the environment knows no such boundaries, so, I'm afraid, I won't.
Of course, you love to keep repeating this "1500 miles" mantra, but even this year I've been within 90nm of the nearest Orca attack shown on the CA record AND I've seen orcas whilst sailing. Incidentally , I was only about 115nm from the second nearest attack location this year as well.
I was also a similar distance from the outlier attack in Shetland and also saw orcas very close to the boat whilst there.
WindyWindyWindy
Active member
On the Iberian peninsula there's history...
There really needs to be a low damage way to deter these things, so that people don't resort to killing them.