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Deleted User YDKXO
Guest
Yup even Ferretti fit one of those but I'm not sure the ammeter is accurate enough to register instantaneous start up loads
New Boat - all to get underwater lights!
- Thread starter admillington
- Start date
BartW
Well-Known Member
I still would like you to see doing the test with a separate connection to the airco first.
when the startup current is more then 16 amps the Multiplus could be helpfull, but you would still need a separate 230V supply line.
In my eyes the most economical and foolproof solution.
In BA I have a 3000W Multiplus, but I fortunately don't need it in the airco supply,
Its used as a charger for the domestic banc, and invertor for all 230V sockets, I don't use the power assist function.
you don't have the specs from your airco compressor on hand ?
model or type nr ?
jfm
Well-Known Member
Sorry, maybe I'm not keeping up with the plot. I thought we had. If your pronblem is only start up, then fit a VFD (aka soft start device) to smooth the start up spike. Job done, QED. Cheaper than a multijobbie and easier to fit But you need to get the data
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Deleted User YDKXO
Guest
I'm getting them from the marina staff
Elessar
Well-Known Member
Sorry to pick on your post J but I disagree with a lot of what's being said!
The lead he has here is benign as you recognise, but with male female reversed it is indeed lethal.
But only because plugging in 1 male will leave another male live.
If you manage not to touch the live pins, so what if you connect 2 different phases? Current will flow and a breaker will break.
So much fuss about 3 phase. Any phase to earth is 240. To get more than that you need to touch the live of one and the live of another. That's careless.
And it's about 65v to kill you so 240 will do anyway.
In summary, 240v is lethal treat it with care. 3 phase is just as bad.......
jfm
Well-Known Member
I understand everything you write there Ellesar. I agree that if you touch it and bridge it to earth your body is spanning only a 230v potential difference, but if ever you managed to span the gap between the pin of one of the two plugs and the socket (which is unlikely; it would have to be with wet hands, after you had plugged in the first plug of the the LBOK, and as you were plugging in the second) you would then bridge a 380v potential with your body. Plugs are designed not to let this happen (else it would happen @240v) but obviously 380v can jump further than 230v.
As I say i am not disagreeing. But the very fact anyone makes one of these means (a) he fully understands 3ph therefore knows when not to use it or (b) he thinks he is just paralleling 2x230v supplies and hasn't a clue about the different phases and therefore shouldn't be using this thing
I know 230v can kill but we've all touched a live 230v and got away with it. 380v is considerably worse (I have read; i've never done it)
I think the right message to give out is use LBOKs if you understand them, but don't if you don't
benjenbav
Well-Known Member
unless you happen to have a faraday cage handy?
jfm
Well-Known Member
I'd be v interested to hear what you'll do with the cage BJB. Could you explain, and draw a diagram please?
benjenbav
Well-Known Member
As it happens, I have a little video clip. It's more a hobby than a day job for me...
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jimmy_the_builder
Well-Known Member
Scary flying, properly. V impressive skill to hold it in such a stable oge hover, but single-engined, in wires, tethered? Huge cojones.
Cheers
Jimmy
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Blimey J, why not envisage that you could be barefoot, and obviously while it's raining cats and dogs!?!
I suppose that statistically it's more likely to be stroken by a lightning while opening your umbrella...
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Now, that puts my LBOK in perspective.
The guy doesn't even seem secured with a harness...!
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Yep, fully accepted. That's precisely what I meant with the second paragraph of my post #114.
But just to expand a bit further, my procedure for using the LBOK (and always only myself personally, even in the only occasion in which I borrowed it to someone else) was as follows:
First and foremost, turn off BOTH the adjacent 16A sockets on the shorepower box (if not already off, as they should be).
Then, in no specific order:
- turn off general AC breaker onboard;
- connect the 32A female of the LBOK to my 32A shorepower cable;
- connect the two 16A males.
And after that:
- turn on the shorepower connections, one at a time;
- eventually, turn on the onboard AC breaker.
And needless to say, exactly the reverse when leaving.
Now, I can't see any risk in such procedure - aside from, as already established, the fact that someone else could disconnect one of the males afterwards.
Anyway, I don't think Deleted User - or any other sensible and careful boater for that matter - wouldn't be able to do the same.
Whoever can handle a boat safely must surely be aware of much more than this, anyway...
Btw, I've used the LBOK for half a dozen years (can't remember exactly), and even if I used it just occasionally - surely less than 10 times per season, I never had any problem. Not even one single shore breaker tripping.
jfm
Well-Known Member
Teehee. Your first video, before the edit, was actually a proper looking faraday cage but wasn't functioning as one and was merely functioning as the chopper/man in the second vid. The chopper and man are no different from the birds you see sitting on 440,000volt power lines without sizzling to death. But yes, nice flying. If the guy pissed himself and the stream of piss got near the earth he'd know about it, for about a nanosecond, as would the chopper crew. There are no RCD devices on 440kv power lines!
Anyway, here are the electrocutes playing a gig in LA
Anyway, here are the electrocutes playing a gig in LA
jfm
Well-Known Member
Blimey J, why not envisage that you could be barefoot, and obviously while it's raining cats and dogs!?!
I suppose that statistically it's more likely to be stroken by a lightning while opening your umbrella...
As I said, I accept (and concede) the unlikeliness of what you'd have to do to bridge a 380v potential with your body. Let's agree to disagree on whether it is sensible to post a suggestion of making an LBOK (post 99) without even mentioning the phases point and the fact, as background knowledge, that you're exposing a 230v pin and bridging a 380v potential difference
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Oh no, on that point we don't disagree at all!Let's agree to disagree on whether it is sensible to post a suggestion of making an LBOK (post 99) without even mentioning the phases point and the fact, as background knowledge, that you're exposing a 230v pin and bridging a 380v potential difference
In hindsight, you're right, I should have given also some warnings in my first post, possibly together with the "procedure" of my previous post.
Sometimes, we're brought to underestimate and/or consider very simple what we know (or think to know) rather well, while the very same thing can be much less obvious to someone else who couldn't care less about that.
...otoh, that's a nice thing of this forum: reality checks are always prompt, whenever someone throws in mad hat suggestions!
BartW
Well-Known Member
Deleted User if you want, I can draw you a diagram for making something like this:
a safe 2 x 16A combiner; the unit won't combine/link when no equal voltage on both 16A connectors.
a few controll lights on the box could be usefull.
if you have a local electric engineer who can wire a few relay's and 2 Limit value relay's, you have what you want for not too much money.
If you really insist I can have one made here in the company.
(need to find time first)
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Deleted User YDKXO
Guest
Thanks Bart, I now have contact details for the ex Victron guy who has a marine electrics business near Split. He's English and will be able to help me out. I'll certainly show him your drawing
PS V sorry to see the news about the Belgian coach crash in Switzerland. Terrible tragedy
BartW
Well-Known Member
its terrible Mike, Belgium is mourning.
One of our workers is from Lommel, where most of the children come from.
He has a son, similar age like these children,
very glad his boy and his acquaintances are not among the victims,
but nevertheless a terrible tragedy for the family's of the victim children.
Nick_H
Well-Known Member
A coach carrying British school children on a ski holiday also crashed in France recently, fortunately only one death. It was the school where my best mate's daughters go, and it's only by chance that they didn't go on the ski trip this time, as they've been in previous years. Last year my mate went as an assistant, and shared a room with the teacher who died in the crash.
The moral of the story is to buy a boat and not worry too much about the cost, as you never know when your number's up.
