Fame free diesel

The theory (and 'theory' emphasized) was that fuel outlets on tidal waters sell FAME-free and those on non-tidal waters sell FAME fuel. However, best to check with the outlet concerned, if indeed they know themselves.
 
EN590 covers all diesel including road diesel which can include up to 7% FAME and must be ultra low sulphur
 
Momac said:
EN590 covers all diesel including road diesel which can include up to 7% FAME and must be ultra low sulphur
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Ah, so the website I quoted is just saying that their EN590 product is FAME free, so Titchmarsh’s diesel supply isn’t necessarily FAME free. Apologies for misleading folks.
 
Plum said:
The myth of FAME free has been covered before, it just means it has less than 5% FAME
Post in thread 'Diesel' Diesel
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If you check with your marina (as I did), who can then look at the spec on their invoice you may discover that they are using effectively FAME free 'diesel' (ie very significantly lower FAME rates than 5%).
 
Pye_End said:
If you check with your marina (as I did), who can then look at the spec on their invoice you may discover that they are using effectively FAME free 'diesel' (ie very significantly lower FAME rates than 5%).
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I was referring (in the link) to our fuel industry guy who has stated in a PBO thread that the standard for fame free is actually "less than 5%"
 
Plum said:
I was referring (in the link) to our fuel industry guy who has stated in a PBO thread that the standard for fame free is actually "less than 5%"
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Indeed I am aware of the posts on the matter. Less than 5% could mean 4.99% or 0.01%, so I wanted to find how 'something I read on a forum' compared to what I was taking from my local marina. I cannot recall the figure, but it was nowhere near 5% - which is why I suggest others ask the same question. Ie. in practice it might not be so much of a myth.
 
Is there any punter-practical test for a "significant" (say, greater than 1% by weight or volume?) percentage of FAME?
Pros use FTIR spectroscopy, so I'd guess not.
 
ducked said:
Is there any punter-practical test for a "significant" (say, greater than 1% by weight or volume?) percentage of FAME?
Pros use FTIR spectroscopy, so I'd guess not.
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I doubt it, but I wonder if something based on putting a drop at on end of a strip of blotting paper might work? The various components would travel along the blotting paper at different rates depending (mainly) on their molecular weight.
 
AntarcticPilot said:
I doubt it, but I wonder if something based on putting a drop at on end of a strip of blotting paper might work? The various components would travel along the blotting paper at different rates depending (mainly) on their molecular weight.
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I had a very brief play with the Blotter Spot Test, (before I was banned from the US-based BITOG oil obesssives site), using thermal decomposition of vegetable oil as a model system, with a scan of a digital photograph (using some freeware TLC scanning software for visualisation/semi-quantification), graphed in Excel. and laser printer/photocopy paper as media.

Blotting paper is, I think, too coarse. Proper silica TLC medium would probably be better but I didn't have the budget or really sufficient personal interest for that, though I did consider this as a possible student project

Degredation showed as a decrease in spot size and a change in colour, The former was probably due to an increase in viscosity which might reduce both uptake into and delivery from the "pipette" (I used a ball point pen tip) and reduced mobility in the paper. Colour change showed, and could be measured, as a separation between the RGB pixel traces for the later more degraded spots.

This was just simple radial chromatography and I never tried solvent elution


Graph seems to be lost, but I did some quick ad hoc blotter tests on some six year old oil from my car here

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/engine-after-sitting-in-humid-environment.297146/page-2

Post number 21. Rather poor photography, but the faint debris ring can be seen. This was quite black oil but from a petrol engine. Its much heavier in published pictures of sooty diesels

While it seemed to have some potential (and apparently is now the basis for an ASTMS method for soot quantition) I doubt it would be up to the DIY FAME identification task, though I suppose there might be an outside chance if the FAME ingredient was visible, either under while light or UV
 
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ducked said:
I had a very brief play with the Blotter Spot Test, (before I was banned from the US-based BITOG oil obesssives site), using thermal decomposition of vegetable oil as a model system, with a scan of a digital photograph (using some freeware TLC scanning software for visualisation/semi-quantification), graphed in Excel. and laser printer/photocopy paper as media.

Blotting paper is, I think, too coarse. Proper silica TLC medium would probably be better but I didn't have the budget or really sufficient personal interest for that, though I did consider this as a possible student project

Degredation showed as a decrease in spot size and a change in colour, The former was probably due to an increase in viscosity which might reduce both uptake into and delivery from the "pipette" (I used a ball point pen tip) and reduced mobility in the paper. Colour change showed, and could be measured, as a separation between the RGB pixel traces for the later more degraded spots.

This was just simple radial chromatography and I never tried solvent elution


Graph seems to be lost, but I did some quick ad hoc blotter tests on some six year old oil from my car here

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/engine-after-sitting-in-humid-environment.297146/page-2

Post number 21. Rather poor photography, but the faint debris ring can be seen. This was quite black oil but from a petrol engine. Its much heavier in published pictures of sooty diesels

While it seemed to have some potential (and apparently is now the basis for an ASTMS method for soot quantition) I doubt it would be up to the DIY FAME identification task, though I suppose there might be an outside chance if the FAME ingredient was visible, either under while light or UV
Click to expand...
OTOH it would probably be quite easy to determine a fuels relative susceptibility to diesel bug,(which is probably the main reason FAME is of interest) with a suitable inoculum, and perhaps incubator, though ambient temperature would do and is perhaps more relevant.

A pinch of garden soil provides a huge variety of microbes, then once you had a culture growing on diesel you could use that instead, or as well,

You'd probably ideally want "guaranteed" FAME free diesel as a control. I suppose you could also maybe test biocide effectiveness.

Unfortunately I recently threw out my hoard of test tubes and lab glassware.
 
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