Dip the rope

[jerrytug]

A big win by the 'very kind man' in the OP, sounds like a witty guy!

 

[dombuckley]

And yet if you Google "dipping the eye", you'll get a plethora of descriptions, illustrations and even a Youtube video on how to do it. You even get a thread similar to this one on Cruisersforum, where one of the posters states "it has always surprised me as to how many experienced boaters have no idea how or why to do this".

 

[Floyd Raser]

So let me get this straight, you contrived a situation where you could embarrass 'a very kind man' using a obscure term for what seems to be merely your own pedantic gratification.

"dip the rope" is not a commonly used term. In fact, just to make sure I looked it up in a 1943 Admiralty handbook that I was given a few years ago, and despite illustrating very well how it is done with a hawser, their Lordships made no mention of the term "dip the rope". The way they put it is that the heaving line is stopped to the crown of the eye so the hawser can be pulled up through the eye of the other ship's hawser.

When someone takes your lines it is a courtesy that is not to be abused. Dropping it over a cleat and leaving you to tidy it up the way you want is more than sufficient. Beware he might decide it's time to go below and put the kettle on the next time he sees you coming it.

I might have done what you wanted if you'd been able to explain it in appropriate nautical language. Or I might have just dropped it over the cleat and left you to it. Or if you'd really wound me up I'd have just thrown your line back and told you to do it yourself.

By the way, I would really only use the technique for bollards or bitts. For a cleat I'd tie a round turn and a bowline (or just a bowline if crowded) around the leg of the cleat below everyone else's lines. That way I have control regardless of what others do (whether through ignorance or chagrin after having previously been ridiculed on the internet).

Very well explained, but I prefer "pompous pratt" from #38

If the bloke has just got off his "saily boat" then you could assume he would know what to do without instruction. To do so is unworthy of his generosity.

What's an "exiting rope"? For hanging perhaps?

 

[southseaian]

I've been an RYA instructor of over thirty five years and have never used the expression 'dip the rope'.
As a matter of fact I've always made a point of keeping things as simple as possible and avoiding salty terms.
In my experience people are often put off boating when faced with a stream of difficult to understand instructions.

 

[chrishelen]

I've been an RYA instructor of over thirty five years and have never used the expression 'dip the rope'.
As a matter of fact I've always made a point of keeping things as simple as possible and avoiding salty terms.
In my experience people are often put off boating when faced with a stream of difficult to understand instructions.

+1

 

[NealB]

Eye up through the loop then all party's can slip "basics" tsk

Well aware of the method, thanks.

Just never heard it called 'dip the rope'.

I can't find the term in any of my (numerous) boating 'how to' books or dictionaries, nor online.

 

[Searush]

The idiot to the right has effectively blocked the other two lines.

Not really, they only have to untie & cast him off. Same with the blue line if you want to release the central line. Seems straightforward to me.

 

[NealB]

And yet if you Google "dipping the eye", you'll get a plethora of descriptions, illustrations and even a Youtube video on how to do it. You even get a thread similar to this one on Cruisersforum, where one of the posters states "it has always surprised me as to how many experienced boaters have no idea how or why to do this".

I think we're talking of language, not technique.

I've just googled 'dipping the eye', and, as you suggest, get loads of results.

However, I've not heard that term either, and the sites in the google results all seem to be American.

I'm not American: I'm English.

 

[PuffTheMagicDragon]

Not really, they only have to untie & cast him off. Same with the blue line if you want to release the central line. Seems straightforward to me.

???

The blue line was there first. The middle line (flecked with red) is led properly up through the blue eye and over the cleat. Both he and the blue can be released independently of each other... were it not for the idiot who tied his bowline above the other two.

 

[cliff]

FFS see my post #29 above - that is how one "dips a rope"

 

[VicS]

FFS see my post #29 above - that is how one "dips a rope"

That would have been a surprise for the OP then if you'd been the person taking his lines.

 

[Poecheng]

Ok a test. Came alongside today and a very kind man got of his saily boat and took my bow line (made off in a loop). The only cleat available already had a looped rope over it so I asked him to "dip the rope". He dangled it in the water and then dropped it over the cleat on top of the exiting rope! What would you have done?

I would have
a) thanked him very much for troubling to take my bow warp and for securing it to the cleat.
b) thanked him for not entering into a needless discussion about a phrase which the combined and varied wisdom of this forum has simply never heard of and which does not describe the process desired by the OP. [Yes many know the technique but not the phrase used]
c) thanked him for not organising the warps as if everyone in the vicinity was about to leave and I was not aboard my boat. That means I can simply take in the slack on the bow line for the moment, have a cup of tea and then sort out the warps how I want them.
d) said that I had noticed on the way in what a nice boat he had.
e) asked him to kindly not to go on a yachting forum and ask "what kind of **** uses the phrase 'dip the rope'?"

 

[PuffTheMagicDragon]

I would have
a) thanked him very much for troubling to take my bow warp and for securing it to the cleat.
b) thanked him for not entering into a needless discussion about a phrase which the combined and varied wisdom of this forum has simply never heard of and which does not describe the process desired by the OP. [Yes many know the technique but not the phrase used]
c) thanked him for not organising the warps as if everyone in the vicinity was about to leave and I was not aboard my boat. That means I can simply take in the slack on the bow line for the moment, have a cup of tea and then sort out the warps how I want them.
d) said that I had noticed on the way in what a nice boat he had.
e) asked him to kindly not to go on a yachting forum and ask "what kind of **** uses the phrase 'dip the rope'?"

By the time you did all that you could have placed the line yourself!

 

[Jungle Jim]

I've not heard the phrase but it's not surprising as I'm new to this and I'd not realised that there is a right way of placing two lines on a cleat. I've learned stuff today :encouragement:

To the OP it might be wise to not assume that a chap taking your lines is experienced and knows the salty terms. It could just as easily have been me! I often get off posh boats, I've got the kit on and look like I know what I'm doing. Looks can be deceptive

Incidentally is there a right way and wrong way to tie up two boats on a cleat using figure-of-eights as that's all I've experienced so far.

 

[Boz]

Hi JJ
The correct form is loops on the shoreside cleats and 'figure of 8s' and excess warp on the boat..... But I expect some will argue

 

[pcatterall]

So let me get this straight, you contrived a situation where you could embarrass 'a very kind man' using a obscure term for what seems to be merely your own pedantic gratification.

"dip the rope" is not a commonly used term. In fact, just to make sure I looked it up in a 1943 Admiralty handbook that I was given a few years ago, and despite illustrating very well how it is done with a hawser, their Lordships made no mention of the term "dip the rope". The way they put it is that the heaving line is stopped to the crown of the eye so the hawser can be pulled up through the eye of the other ship's hawser.

When someone takes your lines it is a courtesy that is not to be abused. Dropping it over a cleat and leaving you to tidy it up the way you want is more than sufficient. Beware he might decide it's time to go below and put the kettle on the next time he sees you coming it.

I might have done what you wanted if you'd been able to explain it in appropriate nautical language. Or I might have just dropped it over the cleat and left you to it. Or if you'd really wound me up I'd have just thrown your line back and told you to do it yourself.

By the way, I would really only use the technique for bollards or bitts. For a cleat I'd tie a round turn and a bowline (or just a bowline if crowded) around the leg of the cleat below everyone else's lines. That way I have control regardless of what others do (whether through ignorance or chagrin after having previously been ridiculed on the internet).

+1 He probably dipped It in the water to show what he thought of the instruction

 

[Habebty]

I would have
a) thanked him very much for troubling to take my bow warp and for securing it to the cleat.
b) thanked him for not entering into a needless discussion about a phrase which the combined and varied wisdom of this forum has simply never heard of and which does not describe the process desired by the OP. [Yes many know the technique but not the phrase used]

c) thanked him for not organising the warps as if everyone in the vicinity was about to leave and I was not aboard my boat. That means I can simply take in the slack on the bow line for the moment, have a cup of tea and then sort out the warps how I want them.
d) said that I had noticed on the way in what a nice boat he had.
e) asked him to kindly not to go on a yachting forum and ask "what kind of **** uses the phrase 'dip the rope'?"

Yep.

In fact, I find "thanks very much, can you stick the string on that cleat please" has the desired effect. Then tidy up later.

 

[dombuckley]

I've not heard that term either, and the sites in the google results all seem to be American.

I'm not American: I'm English.

I first heard the term "dipping the eye" when I was a 12-year old sea cadet, courtesy of our seamanship instructor, who had served in the RN during WW2.
It also appears in both my well-thumbed copies of "Seaman's Pocket Book" and "The Admiralty Manual of Seamanship (Vol 1)" (both UK publications dating from 1964 and 1972 respectively).
Later, the bosun of TS Royalist gave us a very practical demonstration of "dipping the eye" and the problems caused if it isn't done (one of which was that you got called a ****ing **** by a very shouty beardy bloke), in situations where you can't just pull the boat in and slacken the line a little.
During my short spell in the merchant navy, the older hands taught us newbies, including - wait for it - "dipping the eye".
During my somewhat longer career in the RN, I personally saw the technique and heard the term used by all ranks and rates in more than a dozen different ships.

To the best of my knowledge, not a single one of them was American.

Converse to what you say, I believe it's a question of technique, not language. The size of boats that most of us have, we yachties can get away without needing to do it: if there's a snakes' wedding on a shared cleat / bollard, we can heave in a bit of slack while we untangle it. Hence the knowledge and practice has fallen into disuse in smaller craft. However, once you get above the size where one man can hold the boat in (say about 15 tons), then"dipping the eye" becomes an essential part of seamanship.

 

[prv]

Incidentally is there a right way and wrong way to tie up two boats on a cleat using figure-of-eights as that's all I've experienced so far.

Figures of eight on the shore cleats is the wrong way regardless .

On a nice tidy marina finger where all the cleats are for your use only, and the pontoon moves with you so there's no need to adjust lines, it won't matter much. So a lot of people who only cruise from marina to marina get into the habit of making the end of each warp fast on their boat, doing all of the line handling from the pontoon, and having figures of eight and coils of warp on the pontoon.

But on an alongside berth where you might be sharing cleats, or rafting, taking up a whole cleat with your turns gets in other people's way. Instead, everyone should simply secure an end to the cleats (or bollards, or rings) ashore, and handle the line from on board their own boat. Then everybody is in control of their own lines, and if the ends ashore have been done correctly, anybody can depart without casting off anybody else.

Alternatively, on a quay wall where you have to adjust line lengths with the tide, climbing up a ladder every time to adjust the ends on shore is a lot of effort when you could just stroll down the deck and let a bit out. You're also potentially leaving coils of rope lying in a road or pavement, and if your warps are exceptionally nice someone walking along the road might even cut off the coil and take it with them. Again, just touching the shore with the ends of your warps and handling the rest on board, is the seamanlike way to do things.

As I said, in a typical marina berth, handling the lines from the pontoon is unlikely to hurt you. After arrival, I always re-rig the lines with ends ashore and slack on deck, but to be frank in a marina it's a bit of an affectation in which my crew humour me . However, always doing it "right" does mean that we're not caught out when we're unexpectedly rafted upon or the situation changes in some other way, as has happened from time to time. On the same basis, I always use a separate line for each job, and try to avoid putting more than one on each cleat (at the aft end this often involves a tugboat hitch on the sheet winch). Thus I can adjust each line individually without disturbing any other.

Pete

 

[VO5]

I first heard the term "dipping the eye" when I was a 12-year old sea cadet, courtesy of our seamanship instructor, who had served in the RN during WW2.
It also appears in both my well-thumbed copies of "Seaman's Pocket Book" and "The Admiralty Manual of Seamanship (Vol 1)" (both UK publications dating from 1964 and 1972 respectively).
Later, the bosun of TS Royalist gave us a very practical demonstration of "dipping the eye" and the problems caused if it isn't done (one of which was that you got called a ****ing **** by a very shouty beardy bloke), in situations where you can't just pull the boat in and slacken the line a little.
During my short spell in the merchant navy, the older hands taught us newbies, including - wait for it - "dipping the eye".
During my somewhat longer career in the RN, I personally saw the technique and heard the term used by all ranks and rates in more than a dozen different ships.

To the best of my knowledge, not a single one of them was American.

Converse to what you say, I believe it's a question of technique, not language. The size of boats that most of us have, we yachties can get away without needing to do it: if there's a snakes' wedding on a shared cleat / bollard, we can heave in a bit of slack while we untangle it. Hence the knowledge and practice has fallen into disuse in smaller craft. However, once you get above the size where one man can hold the boat in (say about 15 tons), then"dipping the eye" becomes an essential part of seamanship.

Now that's a good one....a snakes' wedding....never come across that description before....it goes to show one learns something new every day.
Thank you very much, you have done me a service in further improving my nautical vocabulary.