Copper sheathed hull.

[levellingtheland]

hello, can anyone tell me if a copper sheathed hull is a good idea? or is it just as bad an idea as a grp sheathed hull ? any info welcome!

keith

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[rich]

If you can afford it go ahead.

<hr width=100% size=1>rich ) <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.jersey-harbours.com>http://www.jersey-harbours.com</A>

 

[Peterduck]

As Rich says, "If you can afford it . . ." It also has to be done properly, not half-heartedly. This involves a layer of tarred felt being applied to the hull before the copper sheet is applied. A suitable source of felt is the suppliers of "geotextile", a felt used in road construction. A suitable "tar" would be bituminous emulsion, used to "glue" asphalt to the rock base of the road. This is quite fluid, like paint, and could be applied by roller. The copper is applied in small sheets, the size being determined by the amount of curvature of the hull which has to be accommodated.
Peter.

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[ccscott49]

if the hull wasn't copper sheathed before, why do it now? Once the sheathing is on, you have no way of knowing whats going on underneath it. it was used in ancient times as an antifouling and teredo protection, we have moved on, with antifouling paints etc. You can also never get a real smooth finish. I would strongly advise against it. It's also an absolute bugger of a job to do and you need somebody who knows what they are doing, not somebody who thinks they do and think it's not a big deal!

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[levellingtheland]

thanks for the replies the reason i ask is because a boat that i was interested in has been covered in copper, it was originally a double-diagonal teak hull, so i guess this became to rotten to repair, like you say theres no way of knowing what condition the wooden hull is in, mmm probably a bad idea then!

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[mickshep]

I'd be very slow to write the vessel off you are interested in. I've come accross a few old vessels that were coppered and on removal the timber beneath has without exception been in fantastic condition. Copper cladding below the waterline bears no relation to the cladding of a rotten hull with g.r.p. All the coppered hulls I've come into contact with were done when new, The "tarry felt" beneath the copper sheeting being still oily and sticky in one case after over 60 years. The result was wood below the waterline that was saturated with oil, not water. That combined with Teak (one of the best timbers known to man) meant rot didn't stand a chance in hell of getting a hold. I very much doubt that the sheathing was done as the hull was beyond repair, It was an expensive and time consuming method of preserving a boat that IMHO proves she was a quality vessel built to a very high standard. If I were you I'd start trying to find out more, When/where built, who for etc, I bought a "pig in a poke" some 5 years ago, Built of double diagonal Teak and ashore in the open for 10 years, Not one square inch of rot and not one steamed frame cracked after 60 years, basically a repaint, re-rig and refurbished engine, I've just sold her, Surveyors comment? "an outstanding example of her type...................... the quality of the marerials used" The boat you've found could be just such a gem. Good luck, Mike

<hr width=100% size=1>"Naaa mate, she's made of tin"

 

[ccscott49]

You do not sheath in copper to save a rotten hull, doesn't work. If your double diagonal hull is copper sheathed, it sounds like it's ex naval. What boat is this?

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[ccscott49]

What boat was it you had? I agree with you by the way, but a lot of double diagonal boats aren't made of teak, mores the pity! By the way, mineral oil soaked wood is a recipe for disaster, have a look at some of the old fishing boats, with no engine trays, the wood under the engine is rotten, due to oil leaks. The best sheathing, was bedded in felt soaked with stockholm tar from real trees.

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[mickshep]

She was a Robert Clark 5 tonner, built in India in 1946, The owner/builders son is still alive and his father selected the Teak himself from stock laid up well before the war, tough didn't come into it, she spent a night under a former owner on her side on a reef in scillies, no damage! Probably the finest little ship I'll ever own but too small for growing family, Sounds to me like Kieth has found an old R.N or Customs/Pilot vessel. It'll be interesting to know more. Regards, Mike.

<hr width=100% size=1>"Naaa mate, she's made of tin"

 

[ccscott49]

My boat is iroko hull, but burmese teak upperworks, don't ask me where John Bain found the teak, but it's definitely burmese! I think he knew of some old naval stocks, hidden away in Chatham, where she was built. New teaks' just not the same, as I'm sure you are aware.

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[Mirelle]

I've had the same thing said by more than one surveyor and builder about mine (built 1937).

I too have heard the story that Silvers kept a stash of teak concealed, during the War. Very sensible - no point in wasting it on MLs and MTB's. Interestingly, the exuse offered by Claude Whisstock to Philip Allen for running well over budget on what is now my boat (I was given the correspondence by Philip, who was the first owner) was, "The Navy are buying everything and driving prices up."

How long a war were they expecting to fight, that they were buying teak and nonferrous metals in such quantities?

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[levellingtheland]

hello the boat im interested in is a ex-admiralty harbour launch, built 1956, a pic of it is here: www.classicsales.co.uk/images/boats/whiteh.jpg dont know if that'll work!, i have also seen an identical boat for sale, but without the copper sheathed hull and not as old cant remember exactly now but i think its about 1965.


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[mickshep]

Janina, my 5 tonner was also Burmese Teak, much closer grained than the modern "plantation" Teak they try to flog you now. Builder was a Colonal F. Seymour Williams OBE DSO who also built the Bailey Bridge accross the Chinwhin river during the war,(at the time the longest of its type I believe) At the same time and from the same stock he also built a 9 tonner called Chinwhin, I wonder if she is still out there anywhere as she was shipped home to England with Janina. Regards, Mike.

<hr width=100% size=1>"Naaa mate, she's made of tin"

 

[ccscott49]

It was John Bain of Silvers, who designed and ultimately supervised the choice of materials and construction of Englander, his last design. I wonder??

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[ccscott49]

Lovely looking boat. What is the hull material, I suspect it isn't teak and also that it will have been built with linsedd oiled calico between the layers. The only thing with this is, it will need a very good wooden boat surveyor to check it out and i doubt very much you will be able to insure it, insurance companies run a mile when you mention DD. But that doesn't make it a bad buy, it could of course be very sound. Great if it is.

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[Mirelle]

Look at both, of course; the older of the pair may well be the better.

In the post - War era the shortage of the traditional materials led to quite a few innovations. Iroko in place of teak, for instance. Iroko turned out to be a good idea, but quite a few "mahoganies" turned out to be ghastly mistakes. There were similar errors in using "yellow metal" for fastening. What you get is really pot luck.

I know an older sister ship doing duty as a houseboat; the hull is fine.

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