Berthing under sail.

[lustyd]

Assessment of our ability is always subjective but that does not stop us. This has nothing to do with proving ourselves, being manly, waving willies or all the other accusations in this post. It is all about the joy of developing skills in an activity we love. Otherwise why have sails at all? Surely maneuvering under sail in close quarters is one of the pinnacles of our sport? We just have to make sure we do not hit anything and that comes down to good judgement based on experience.

A junk rig allows you to gain that experience - it gives you a much larger safety margin - see earlier posts.

No, in a busy marina environment it comes down to luck, and you're gambling with other peoples property. As I said, I'm all for using the skill and practicing the skill just don't do it near my boat.

 

[fireball]

No, in a busy marina environment it comes down to luck, and you're gambling with other peoples property. As I said, I'm all for using the skill and practicing the skill just don't do it near my boat.

But some ppl cause damage under engine alone - what should they do ?

Please - can you not just accept that sometimes it is appropriate for a vessel to sail into/out of a marina. Not all of them and not all the time - but sometimes everything just comes together to make it viable - then why shouldn't they ?

 

[lustyd]

But some ppl cause damage under engine alone - what should they do ?

Please - can you not just accept that sometimes it is appropriate for a vessel to sail into/out of a marina. Not all of them and not all the time - but sometimes everything just comes together to make it viable - then why shouldn't they ?

I've already said as much several times - read the thread!

 

[chrisedwards]

No, in a busy marina environment it comes down to luck, and you're gambling with other peoples property. As I said, I'm all for using the skill and practicing the skill just don't do it near my boat.

you have to read the post - how can "good judgement based on experience" come down to luck as you say? - even in a busy marina environment?

 

[rjandhl]

Would your insurance pay out for any damage that you may cause? I know of an instance where the insurance company considered the act of motoring into a busy marina using a jury rigged throttle as "negligent", unfortunately we were on the receiving end when he lost control and rammed us causing extensive damage. Our insurers had quite a job to recover our costs. Would the insurer consider sailing when a perfectly useable engine was available as an act of negligence?

 

[johnalison]

If you know what you are doing, sailing is as safe as motoring.

If you don't know what you are doing, you will be unsafe in any boat.

Sailing into marina seems to be popular in France and I have only seen it done expertly, even under spinnaker. I've only done it once myself, with a defunct engine in a gale. We ended up under bare poles only a few berths from our allotted one, no problem, and no one to watch a since the weather was so foul.

 

[lustyd]

If you know what you are doing, sailing is as safe as motoring.

If you don't know what you are doing, you will be unsafe in any boat.

Sailing into marina seems to be popular in France and I have only seen it done expertly, even under spinnaker. I've only done it once myself, with a defunct engine in a gale. We ended up under bare poles only a few berths from our allotted one, no problem, and no one to watch a since the weather was so foul.

Clearly you have your man badge so perhaps you can explain to the rest of us how you stop or reverse when the unexpected happens in a busy marina under sail. For instance if a boat reverses out of its berth in front of you while you're merrily sailing down to your pontoon without space to sail around them. Or perhaps how you deal with the sudden change of wind direction caused by that high sided mobo on your way in? Or perhaps how you enter and then perform 2 turns 90 degrees to port to get into your berth? How about if the wind dies completely while you're between the high harbour walls at just before low water springs when there is a current running and you lose power?

As I've said repeatedly, why risk it if you're not trying to prove anything?

 

[westernman]

Clearly you have your man badge so perhaps you can explain to the rest of us how you stop or reverse when the unexpected happens in a busy marina under sail. For instance if a boat reverses out of its berth in front of you while you're merrily sailing down to your pontoon without space to sail around them. Or perhaps how you deal with the sudden change of wind direction caused by that high sided mobo on your way in? Or perhaps how you enter and then perform 2 turns 90 degrees to port to get into your berth? How about if the wind dies completely while you're between the high harbour walls at just before low water springs when there is a current running and you lose power?

As I've said repeatedly, why risk it if you're not trying to prove anything?

And how to you manage dealing with those things if your engine suddenly stops for some reason?

 

[chrisedwards]

Please read the posts. We are not "risking it" but using good judgement based on experience. We are not "proving" anything but deriving supreme satisfaction from developing sailing skills - our sport.

I would far rather have a yacht near me - in a marina - being sailed by someone using good judgement based on experience than a yacht being motored by an skipper of unknown skill.

The situations you describe below are either manageable or avoidable.

Clearly you have your man badge so perhaps you can explain to the rest of us how you stop or reverse when the unexpected happens in a busy marina under sail. For instance if a boat reverses out of its berth in front of you while you're merrily sailing down to your pontoon without space to sail around them. Or perhaps how you deal with the sudden change of wind direction caused by that high sided mobo on your way in? Or perhaps how you enter and then perform 2 turns 90 degrees to port to get into your berth? How about if the wind dies completely while you're between the high harbour walls at just before low water springs when there is a current running and you lose power?

As I've said repeatedly, why risk it if you're not trying to prove anything?

 

[marklucas]

Please read the posts. We are not "risking it" but using good judgement based on experience. We are not "proving" anything but deriving supreme satisfaction from developing sailing skills - our sport.

I would far rather have a yacht near me - in a marina - being sailed by someone using good judgement based on experience than a yacht being motored by an skipper of unknown skill.

The situations you describe below are either manageable or avoidable.

Hear, Hear.

I once sailed into a marina - went to grab a shower whilst crew cleaned the boat down - came back and was told that two boats came into the marina under power and had prangs.

Sail is a means of powering a boat - good skippering, planning and helming is the art.

I would happily let students practise sailing into a marina in the appropriate situation, or indeed practise using a contrary tide to steer a boat backwards onto to a pontoon.

 

[fireball]

perhaps you can explain to the rest of us how you stop or reverse

Can you not sail backwards?

As with most things sailing - look far enough ahead and nothing is a surprise ...