Anybody here know much about travel hoists?

[Deleted member 478]

Go on, Roger, think about the priorities of the locals i.e. rebuilding their homes and getting food and medicines to Carriacou, as has been mentioned in this thread. " Rich", foreign yachtie problems will register a big, fat zero on the priorities scale.

 

[geem]

Interestingly, locals have been seen helping out in the mangroves extracting the pile of yachts. There is a very good relationship between locals and cruisers in Carriacou. The yachties help lots of good initiatives in Carriacou when life was pre hurricane. In time of need when the yachties need some help, it works both ways. Paying locals to assist is a good way of ensuring they have some cash to feed themselves when currently their normal day job may have disappeared. The locals need assistance. Paying them is a win win.

 

[rogerthebodger]

Interestingly, locals have been seen helping out in the mangroves extracting the pile of yachts. There is a very good relationship between locals and cruisers in Carriacou. The yachties help lots of good initiatives in Carriacou when life was pre hurricane. In time of need when the yachties need some help, it works both ways. Paying locals to assist is a good way of ensuring they have some cash to feed themselves when currently their normal day job may have disappeared. The locals need assistance. Paying them is a win win.

Totally agree I have a similar relationship with some of the locals where I live and STINGO probably know some of them.

It's all a matter of helping each other in times of need rather than being distant and aloof

 

[Sea Change]

Go on, Roger, think about the priorities of the locals i.e. rebuilding their homes and getting food and medicines to Carriacou, as has been mentioned in this thread. " Rich", foreign yachtie problems will register a big, fat zero on the priorities scale.

I agree, which is why it's all the more frustrating to have a foreign salvage company come steaming straight in and demanding that we use their services. We're in no hurry, rebuilding the island must take priority.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

What about two jacks and gradually inch it up…..musbe lots of scrap wood available

Or levers and blocks of wood. They erected the Pyramids using that kind of technology, so we know it works at scale!

 

[Wansworth]

Or levers and blocks of wood. They erected the Pyramids using that kind of technology, so we know it works at scale!

I guess digging a trece under the keel,controlled sliding

 

[Sea Change]

Update:
New email from the salvors is a complete change in tone.
Apparently their initial pricing was just an opening gambit, to get the ball rolling, a 'starting point' as they put it.
I'm inclined to make them wait a bit longer

 

[Sea Change]

A less welcome update: just seen a picture of a boat being lifted, single point crane, no spreader bars. Significant damage to the hard dodger as a result.

But these guys are the professionals, apparently.

 

[Refueler]

A less welcome update: just seen a picture of a boat being lifted, single point crane, no spreader bars. Significant damage to the hard dodger as a result.

But these guys are the professionals, apparently.

Use of spreader bars is not as common as people think .. I know that many yards have them or a square frame which has the slings connected to ...

But just thinking of your case where a boat is on its side and needs righting as well as lift. The slings need to be able to adjust independently as the boat lifts ... if you were to introduce spreader bars - how can the slings do that ?
Surely the sheer strake or hard dodger as you quote will be in contact with slings in that initial stage .. boat is on its side ?

Way I've seen it done (been involved in a couple of such lifts) - the slings that are round the lower side of boat have had long wood planks or air bags between those two slings and boat side. As lift is made - that side's slings are lifted more to 'roll' the boat toward upright while other slings lift a little less but prevent keel being pressured on ground. The idea to spread the load on the underside lift area ..
One lift I watched - not involved - was done by two cranes ... one each side and a 'controller man' standing ahead of boat signalling the two crane drivers. Once upright - boat propped .....

 

[john_morris_uk]

Maybe this should be a new thread but what would be the ideal set up for leaving your boat when a cat 4 hurricane is coming?
1. Concrete yard with inserts set in to the concrete that can take the substantial loads that will be applied.
2. Masts off all boats
3. All boats in cradles not on stands.

In my experience, none of the yards in Grenada have these features or take masts off.
The ground is gravel. They don't have cradles. Instead they use 3 leg stands. These simply are not up to dealing with hurricanes. When you get heavy rain, the ground goes soft. These stands move and/or vibrate out of place. Lots of boats get the stands punching through the hull when they go over.

The yards work on the basis that they won't be hit and they put the businesses into administration after a hurricane.
Anybody who leaves a boat in the Caribbean is also working on the basis that they won't get hit or if they do, it will be a cat 1 hurricane. Anything above this and the risk of substantial damage are high unless all 3 on my list are met. I suspect even without everything I suggested, there is still risk of damage.

There are a few inaccuracies here.

I know of yards in the Caribbean that insist on mast off.
Some yards dig trenches for the keels of boats so the boat is not propped up on stands. (Ours is laid up like this currently.)

Your comment re Cat 1 is being over pessimistic. I was skipper of a boat in a Cat 2 hurricane once. The hurricane passed right over the top of us No significant damage to any boats where we were. I was afloat anchored and secured to mangrove but there were boats ashore nearby.

I would prefer no hurricanes though!

 

[geem]

There are a few inaccuracies here.

I know of yards in the Caribbean that insist on mast off.
Some yards dig trenches for the keels of boats so the boat is not propped up on stands. (Ours is laid up like this currently.)

Your comment re Cat 1 is being over pessimistic. I was skipper of a boat in a Cat 2 hurricane once. The hurricane passed right over the top of us No significant damage to any boats where we were. I was afloat anchored and secured to mangrove but there were boats ashore nearby.

I would prefer no hurricanes though!

The only yard I know that digs trenches is in St Kitts and Nevis. its not typical of the Caribbean. Its a tiny yard. More like a muddy field.
Ivan was Cat 3 and totally devastating. Even though boats were in the mangroves or in a yard. Beryl, a cat 4.
Hurricane Emily hit Grenada in 2005 as a cat 1. It still sank boats in Grenada.

 

[Mister E]

Why have to locals and boat owners not got together to let the homeless live in the damaged boats.
Then you could use government pressure so that the written off boats are of some use.

 

[Sea Change]

Use of spreader bars is not as common as people think .. I know that many yards have them or a square frame which has the slings connected to ...

But just thinking of your case where a boat is on its side and needs righting as well as lift. The slings need to be able to adjust independently as the boat lifts ... if you were to introduce spreader bars - how can the slings do that ?

This is a salvage company with a barge load of equipment. They should have spreader bars or frames, even if the yard doesn't.

The boat in question, which isn't mine, should have been lifted using spreader bars and placed in a clear area where it could then be righted, perhaps using the hoist, or lifting bags (which the salvors do have).

 

[Sea Change]

Why have to locals and boat owners not got together to let the homeless live in the damaged boats.
Then you could use government pressure so that the written off boats are of some use.

I'm not sure a fallen over boat with no power, water, or sanitation is actually that useful.
I know some of the locals are living in a big motorboat that landed on the beach. It looked abandoned before Beryl.

 

[john_morris_uk]

The only yard I know that digs trenches is in St Kitts and Nevis. its not typical of the Caribbean. Its a tiny yard. More like a muddy field.
Ivan was Cat 3 and totally devastating. Even though boats were in the mangroves or in a yard. Beryl, a cat 4.
Hurricane Emily hit Grenada in 2005 as a cat 1. It still sank boats in Grenada.

I’m not really into point scoring but you’re basically admitting your previous post was inaccurate.

PS. There are other yards offering trenches for keels so your sweeping generalisation about how boats are laid up in the whole of the Caribbean is wrong.

I’m just sorry for Rob & Aphrodite atm. We know them and their boat and wish there was something we could do to help.

 

[geem]

I’m not really into point scoring but you’re basically admitting your previous post was inaccurate.

PS. There are other yards offering trenches for keels so your sweeping generalisation about how boats are laid up in the whole of the Caribbean is wrong.

I’m just sorry for Rob & Aphrodite atm. We know them and their boat and wish there was something we could do to help.

There are thousands of yachts laid up in the Caribbean but only a handful in trenches. Jolly Harbour, Antigua has two trenches but hundreds of boats on stands. The two trenches are to satisfy insurance companies that demand them. They also have about 6 cradles. A tiny proportion of the boats laid up there in their 2 yards.
My sweeping generalisations covers over 95% of how boats are laid up in the Caribbean

edit. We also know Rob off Aphdrodite and wish him well with fixing his boat.

 

[Refueler]

This is a salvage company with a barge load of equipment. They should have spreader bars or frames, even if the yard doesn't.

The boat in question, which isn't mine, should have been lifted using spreader bars and placed in a clear area where it could then be righted, perhaps using the hoist, or lifting bags (which the salvors do have).

If the boat is on its side laying at an angle - how will spreader bars prevent sheer-strake area from being stressed in lift ?

 

[Sea Change]

If the boat is on its side laying at an angle - how will spreader bars prevent sheer-strake area from being stressed in lift ?

There would still be some pressure, but it would be greatly reduced. And the strop would no longer be crushing the hard dodger.

On a closer photo you can see that the strop is frayed, with broken fibres visible. That would make it condemned on any site I've used a crane on.

 

[Blue Seas]

At the risk of repeating myself, the hoist (with it's strops angled away from the hull) is the correct tool for that job

 

[Sea Change]

I've now heard that boats have been moved without permission, causing further damage.

Might be time to contact the yard and make sure they know I do not want this salvage company anywhere near my boat.


And a question: I've actually got one of those giant inflatable fenders, the ones superyachts use. No idea of the specs on it, but it connects to the SUP pump so we could get a fair amount of pressure in it.
Presumably I could use this as a lifting bag? The problem might lie in sourcing suitable materials to build temporary platforms as I inch the boat up a bit at a time.