Hoping to return to the East Coast; a question of draft

[Chae_73]

Hi all

My father and I sailed out of Orford in the late 80s and early 90s, and then other life happened for the best part of 30 years, and now my kids are the age I was when we started sailing and I'm the age he was, etc etc. And we are planning to buy a boat and go sailing again!

It's likely that we will sail out of the Deben this time, and the "research into what boat to buy" is mainly my job. Last time we had a Samphire 29. It was a comfortable boat, and drew quite a bit less than 5 (edit - actually less than 4'!)', and would sail to windward to a degree, but not a very big (ie small) degree. It was great for anchoring in Butley Creek.

Boats which are currently under consideration for our return to the water (with drafts added):

Halmatic / Barbican 30 - 4'6"
Nicholson 31 - 5'0"
Nicholson 32 - 5'6"
Rival 34 - 4'8" / 5'10"
Perhaps even some more left-field things such as a Wauquiez Centurion 32 (5'10")

My question here is (apart from just saying hello), at what draft does East Coast cruising become significantly restricted? I'm also thinking of doing trips a bit further afield, maybe up to Scotland again, France, Holland etc so sailing ability is equally valued as mud dodging ability. My rough thoughts are:
5' or less - fine;
Up to 5'6" - ok but be a bit more careful, please;
5'6 - 6' - be very careful and don't go to some places;
6'+ - don't sail on the East Coast.

Opinions welcome!

 

[Tomahawk]

Draft is not a problem...
Beam is the difficulty... especially when you sre 22 feet wide..

 

[Bru]

After two shoal draft twin keel boats, we changed up to a fin keeler with 5'7" draft because we plan to spend a lot of time further afield

The draft itself isn't a massive problem although it is a bit of a limitation when it comes to anchoring in creeks - the Yokesfleet is pretty much off our map now (only really viable now on neaps if somebody hasn't already bagged the limited spots we could anchor in) and I doubt we'd find anywhere in the Butley River unless we anchored fore and aft 'cos swinging would be interesting!

Really, the biggest worry that nags the hind brain a lot is that running aground is no longer excusable by getting the scrubbing brush out and making like we meant to do it. Now, we'd fall over!

If we were only going to sail around the Thames Esturay area @d go back to twin keels and shoal draft like a shot.

 

[Chae_73]

Draft is not a problem...
Beam is the difficulty... especially when you sre 22 feet wide..

I see...

well, we will be on a swinging mooring, and unlikely to be much more than 10' across, so hopefully should avoid the pitfalls of excessive beam.

 

[MoodySabre]

Mine is 5’6” and is not a problem. Can’t get into the Tidemill at neaps but elsewhere is fine.

 

[ninjod]

Draft is not a problem...
Beam is the difficulty... especially when you sre 22 feet wide..

Mine is just under 28ft wide. I’ve had no problems so far..

 

[Chae_73]

Interesting - do you find the improvement in sailing performance to be significant vice the ability to dry out where you please?

The Samphire we had was a long keeler, so it did fall over when the water disappeared - remember spending a pretty uncomfortable night at about 60 deg somewhere around the Blackwater after hitting a drying bank on an ebb tide.

A Golden Hind 31 would be in contention for a shoal daft boat that stays upright. Apparently they sail ok.

 

[Chae_73]

Mine is 5’6” and is not a problem. Can’t get into the Tidemill at neaps but elsewhere is fine.

good to know - thanks.

The tidemill isn't somewhere i particularly need to go as I know Woodbridge well enough, so not a problem!

 

[johnalison]

There are some advantages in having shallower draft, but it is not as critical as often made out. I have 1.5m, which gives me an extra hour or so coming and going compared to the standard 1.8m, but it is often said, with reason, that the chief virtue of shallow draft is that it allows you to have a cheaper mooring.

 

[LittleSister]

The Samphire we had was a long keeler, so it did fall over when the water disappeared - remember spending a pretty uncomfortable night at about 60 deg somewhere around the Blackwater after hitting a drying bank on an ebb tide.

A Samphire aground on flat ground would be 60 50 degrees (or more) from the horizontal, not from the vertical! Most deep keelers would be much further over.

It may have been a bit uncomfortable, but it wouldn't be a disaster.

p.s. Samphire 29 draft is 3' 9"

p.s. I was wrong. About 50 degrees from the horizontal, 40 degrees from the vertical, assuming flat ground and the keel doesn't sink in (which it will).

 

[Slowboat35]

Get a Parker 31.
You'll run rings around every other boat you come aross and when you run aground you just wind yourself some more draft. Mind you, if you get too greedy you'll finally go hard aground in about 30 inches of water...

 

[LittleSister]

Chae, what was the name of your Samphire 29?

 

[Mandarin331]

Like everything else it's a compromise and depends on your priorities, with a drop or twin keel your ability to creek crawl through many places and dry out expands rapidly, and that's what many value in Thames estuary cruising. It will also extend the window for crossing the bar. If these are important to you go for shallow draft.

If you prefer passage making and the ability to slog to windward then deeper draft, but large parts of the estuary will be closed to you (ie Havengore, Iken Faversham etc). I've cruised the area with boats from 9 inches (keel up), 3' twin keel up to to 5'6" fin and enjoyed them all, I did somewhat miss the creek crawling latterly but enjoyed the passage making more.

One other point, from experience if you're limited to weekend sailing you will find the Deben very restrictive, we got fed up with having to catch the Sunday morning tide back in or waiting for the Saturday afternoon tide out, missing a days sailing and being so tidal dependent, So we moved to the Orwell and enjoyed the tidal freedom.

 

[Tomahawk]

Mine is just under 28ft wide. I’ve had no problems so far..

photos please

 

[Chae_73]

Chae, what was the name of your Samphire 29?

Nasiim II - I understand that Nasiim means "gentle wind" in Arabic.

 

[Chae_73]

p.s. Samphire 29 draft is 3' 9"

Thanks - I had forgotten that!

 

[cueball]

Hi I draw 2.1, careful planning needed, but not overly restrictive. The sailing more than makes up for it !

 

[LittleSister]

Nasiim II - I understand that Nasiim means "gentle wind" in Arabic.

I think I saw it moored on the Deben near Felixstowe Ferry about 4 or 5 years ago, and maybe also for sale on a broker's site after that.

I used to sail a Samphire 23 (and aspired to a 29!), and took quite an interest in them.

 

[RivalRedwing]

We run a standard keel Rival 34 (4'8" draft) around the east coast without difficulty

 

[Skellum]

I’m also thinking in terms of a suitable boat for the East Coats (planning to base in Orwell). The ability to make decent passages to windward is also a key consideration so I am hoping that drawing up to 6’ would be ok with the proviso that I will need to pick my tides to get to certain places - eg Deben.