LadyInBed
Well-Known Member
This looked quite nice
and this was chasing it
and this was chasing it
Which sailing rig . . .
- Thread starter Rum_Pirate
- Start date
Rum_Pirate
Well-Known Member
I am totally biased.
Then drawn on a scrap of paper (as the best plans are) :
and re-rigged to
KATE was re rigged from a single masted gaff rig to a gaffed rigged yawl and had her main changed to a triangular cut cruising main.
While these transformations made her easier to handle she is still a 78'00" LOA first rule(1907) International 12 Metre Design by Alfred Mylne.
60 foot on deck, 12 metres on the waterline and almost 24 metres from bowsprit tip to main boom end. In here original Gaff Topsail cutter rig, she was 250 square metres of sail to windward in mainsail, three headsails and a jack yard topsail.
Now fitted with a more eaily managed gaff yawl rig.
“Kate” was designed by Alfred Mylne in 1907 and built by Philip Walwyn and his small team of woodworkers in St. Kitts.
Launch date was December 2006. Copies of Mylne’s drawings and calculations were used.
Displacement is as designed, as is ballast ratio and rig. Construction, engineered by the Mylne office (with plan approval from the Twelve Metre Class) is wood epoxy, bronze fastened throughout and glass sheathed using two layers of 300gsm biaxial. Walwyn has used this method over the past 30 years to build a number of boats for himself. Epoxy, additives and glass cloth are from SP Systems in the Isle of Wight. Coatings are by Awlgrip.
Frames are laminated mahogany as is the centerline structure. Planking, screwed and glued to the frames is 35 mm Oregon pine, a 2mm veneer of Okoume covers the interior planking. Deck beams are laminated Oregon pine. Decks are two layers of 10mm Bruynzeel ply with a laid deck of Oregon pine of 4mm glued over. The spars are Sitka spruce, made hollow. Sails are cream Dacron by Gowen of West Mersea. The keel of 11.5 tonnes is lead with 18 bronze keel bolts. Rigging is by Spencer of Cowes using Sta-Lok terminals and rigging screws. Ten bronze, Meissner, self tailing winches handle halyards, runners and sheets. Bronze and steel hardware is by Classic Marine in Woodbridge.
With experience gained building half a dozen boats up to 23 metres on deck engineered in wood/epoxy, “Kate’s” interior and furniture is designed to be both functional and add strength, making for a particularly stiff structure.
There is no engine, no tanks and apart from a masthead tricolour, no electrics. Handheld GPS and VHF are on board.
The yacht is a symphony in simplicity.
Accommodation is traditional with two quarter berths aft, chart table on starboard, galley top on port, settee berths and pilot berths port and starboard in the saloon, marine head on starboard and vanity opposite on port by the mast with a double cabin forward. The anchor locker and stowage is forward of a watertight bulkhead. A small lazarette is between two watertight bulkheads aft of the tiller.
When we spent time, money and emotion building "Kate" we were not thinking about anything except bringing the job to a finish.
Since her launch an extraordinary amount of interest has been shown in the boat.
Unwittingly we have touched a nerve or perhaps struck a cord.
People seem to love classic boats and wherever we have sailed in the Caribbean every camera has been pointed our way and "Kate" has had endless positive comment.
To top it all the July issues of both Classic Boat magazine from the UK and Wooden Boat from the US show "Kate" on their covers, with extensive articles inside.
The current Yawl rig would be a simple matter to convert back to the original 1st Rule 12m Rig with a new mainsail and longer boom - ideal for competitive racing.
Inspired by Javotte:
Then drawn on a scrap of paper (as the best plans are) :
and re-rigged to
KATE was re rigged from a single masted gaff rig to a gaffed rigged yawl and had her main changed to a triangular cut cruising main.
While these transformations made her easier to handle she is still a 78'00" LOA first rule(1907) International 12 Metre Design by Alfred Mylne.
| Name | KATE |
| Design No | 162 |
| Builder | Philip Walwyn |
| Year | 2006 |
| Length Overall | 70 ft / 21.4 m |
| Length on Deck | 60 ft / 18.4 m |
| Length Waterline | 40 ft / 12.0 m |
| Beam | 11.1 ft / 3.4 m |
| Draft | 7.5 ft / 2.3 m |
| Construction | Epoxy & Oregon Pine on Mahogany, bronze floors and fastenings |
| Engine | TBA |
| Home Port | St Kitts |
Now fitted with a more eaily managed gaff yawl rig.
“Kate” was designed by Alfred Mylne in 1907 and built by Philip Walwyn and his small team of woodworkers in St. Kitts.
Launch date was December 2006. Copies of Mylne’s drawings and calculations were used.
Displacement is as designed, as is ballast ratio and rig. Construction, engineered by the Mylne office (with plan approval from the Twelve Metre Class) is wood epoxy, bronze fastened throughout and glass sheathed using two layers of 300gsm biaxial. Walwyn has used this method over the past 30 years to build a number of boats for himself. Epoxy, additives and glass cloth are from SP Systems in the Isle of Wight. Coatings are by Awlgrip.
Frames are laminated mahogany as is the centerline structure. Planking, screwed and glued to the frames is 35 mm Oregon pine, a 2mm veneer of Okoume covers the interior planking. Deck beams are laminated Oregon pine. Decks are two layers of 10mm Bruynzeel ply with a laid deck of Oregon pine of 4mm glued over. The spars are Sitka spruce, made hollow. Sails are cream Dacron by Gowen of West Mersea. The keel of 11.5 tonnes is lead with 18 bronze keel bolts. Rigging is by Spencer of Cowes using Sta-Lok terminals and rigging screws. Ten bronze, Meissner, self tailing winches handle halyards, runners and sheets. Bronze and steel hardware is by Classic Marine in Woodbridge.
With experience gained building half a dozen boats up to 23 metres on deck engineered in wood/epoxy, “Kate’s” interior and furniture is designed to be both functional and add strength, making for a particularly stiff structure.
There is no engine, no tanks and apart from a masthead tricolour, no electrics. Handheld GPS and VHF are on board.
The yacht is a symphony in simplicity.
Accommodation is traditional with two quarter berths aft, chart table on starboard, galley top on port, settee berths and pilot berths port and starboard in the saloon, marine head on starboard and vanity opposite on port by the mast with a double cabin forward. The anchor locker and stowage is forward of a watertight bulkhead. A small lazarette is between two watertight bulkheads aft of the tiller.
When we spent time, money and emotion building "Kate" we were not thinking about anything except bringing the job to a finish.
Since her launch an extraordinary amount of interest has been shown in the boat.
Unwittingly we have touched a nerve or perhaps struck a cord.
People seem to love classic boats and wherever we have sailed in the Caribbean every camera has been pointed our way and "Kate" has had endless positive comment.
To top it all the July issues of both Classic Boat magazine from the UK and Wooden Boat from the US show "Kate" on their covers, with extensive articles inside.
The current Yawl rig would be a simple matter to convert back to the original 1st Rule 12m Rig with a new mainsail and longer boom - ideal for competitive racing.
Inspired by Javotte:
Mudisox
Well-Known Member
But does size matter? Small bikinis as a rig for sailing look better than a big old one.
Rum_Pirate
Well-Known Member
Yes it does.
I hate to imagine an ittsy bitsty teeny weeny bikini on an massive old hulk whoever she is.
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Stemar
Well-Known Member
Absolutely. The right amount of cloth on the right shape and you can't go wrong The exact details of the rig are irrelevant.
All the same, I do find a bit of grace helps things along. This
is way prettier than this
I could dream of owning Ranger, even if a dream is all it'll ever be. I can't see dreaming of owning the carbon fibre rocket ship, even if it does go four or five times the speed.
dombuckley
Well-Known Member
Motor_Sailor
Well-Known Member
But those are big sails!
Frank Holden
Well-Known Member
Pretty much anything that doesn't involve sailing on her ear with the crew all hanging their legs over the windward rail to stop her falling over is attractive to me....
Having seen a photo of this girl https://photos.inautia.com/barcosOc...ue-xxxv-66467110122451515553705770664548x.jpg in the 60's I bought this one in the early 80's..
Yes ... that's me... with hair..sitting on the 'low side'....
I think this is rather nice.... working sail on the Derwent, Hobart, Tasmania , in the 1930s....usually hauling fruit to the IXL jam factory.. outward bound in this shot..
Having seen a photo of this girl https://photos.inautia.com/barcosOc...ue-xxxv-66467110122451515553705770664548x.jpg in the 60's I bought this one in the early 80's..
Yes ... that's me... with hair..sitting on the 'low side'....
I think this is rather nice.... working sail on the Derwent, Hobart, Tasmania , in the 1930s....usually hauling fruit to the IXL jam factory.. outward bound in this shot..
Poignard
Well-Known Member
God help any sampan that gets in her way!
dombuckley
Well-Known Member
Actually, this one's just a baby in tall ships terms: with a hull length of 120ft, she's shorter than a J-class. She's the Najaden, built for training cadets and boy seamen for the swedish navy. The complex rig kept the 100-strong crew busy while keeping sail size down to a manageable level: she could set 10,000 sq ft, but the largest (the main topsail) is only about 800 sq ft. No slouch either, logging over 16knots on several occasions.
Motor_Sailor
Well-Known Member
Thanks for that - it's hard to gauge scale when you have a ship rig on 120ft LOA! But it is a handsome boat.
120' was the same LOA as the brigantine we built in HK in the 70s. She too had a single topsail but the course was the substantially larger sail.
crewman
Well-Known Member
With ship rig like that how many of the sails were blanketted by the one upwind - I assume they mainly sailed with the wind aft the beam?
AntarcticPilot
Well-Known Member
In the Chartroom at Kip marina, there's a photo of Creole under full sail. She's a 3 masted schooner, and looks utterly magnificent.
Bajansailor
Well-Known Member
I am guessing that the photo in the Chartroom is this iconic photo?
Top 50 Largest Sailing Yachts in the World
Some friends have a print of this on their living room wall.
Quite magnificent, thundering along - and I think it must be a Beken photo?
Greenheart
Well-Known Member
That is a dazzling photo. It was several minutes before I realised she's not a gaffer.
A replica of the legendary 200ft three-masted gaff schooner Atlantic was built around ten years ago...
...if it weren't for the intrusion of needing at least two-dozen paid crew, I'd have ordered the same, myself.
I do believe a two-masted gaff schooner, just small enough to be within the managing of a few careful and capable friends, must be the most fulfilling sailing (and ownership) experience. Every mile under sail, packed with the atmosphere of purposeful complexity, including its profound inefficiencies by modern standards...
...all the problems and inconveniences which designers strive to eliminate from the modern yachtsman's role, are there intact, requiring total self-immersion in old-world systems and science. So rather than thinking wistfully how a more advanced design might have made this or that aspect easier, the whole experience is rich with easily-grasped realities...and the slower you go, the longer people have to admire the beautiful proportions.
A replica of the legendary 200ft three-masted gaff schooner Atlantic was built around ten years ago...
...if it weren't for the intrusion of needing at least two-dozen paid crew, I'd have ordered the same, myself.
I do believe a two-masted gaff schooner, just small enough to be within the managing of a few careful and capable friends, must be the most fulfilling sailing (and ownership) experience. Every mile under sail, packed with the atmosphere of purposeful complexity, including its profound inefficiencies by modern standards...
...all the problems and inconveniences which designers strive to eliminate from the modern yachtsman's role, are there intact, requiring total self-immersion in old-world systems and science. So rather than thinking wistfully how a more advanced design might have made this or that aspect easier, the whole experience is rich with easily-grasped realities...and the slower you go, the longer people have to admire the beautiful proportions.
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Bajansailor
Well-Known Member
Dan, the Schooner Atlantic is #25 in the Boat International list -
Top 50 Largest Sailing Yachts in the World
I think that you need to set your sights on a Murray Peterson Coaster schooner - here is one for sale :
1980 Murray Peterson Coastal III Schooner Schooner for sale - YachtWorld
Or a smaller, 36' Coaster?
SOLD - 36' 1962 Murray Peterson Coasting Schooner - OffCenterHarbor.com
Or Mary Bryant?
I met her and her previous owner Anna in Bermuda and again later on up in Maine 25 years ago, and she is gorgeous.
(and yes, Anna is gorgeous as well).
50ft Gaff Schooner, wooden 41ft on deck. Built in Fowey Cornwall 1980 - MJ Lewis Boat Sales
And another -
Gaff Rigged Schooner 44' For Sale, 13.41m, 1997
Top 50 Largest Sailing Yachts in the World
I think that you need to set your sights on a Murray Peterson Coaster schooner - here is one for sale :
1980 Murray Peterson Coastal III Schooner Schooner for sale - YachtWorld
Or a smaller, 36' Coaster?
SOLD - 36' 1962 Murray Peterson Coasting Schooner - OffCenterHarbor.com
Or Mary Bryant?
I met her and her previous owner Anna in Bermuda and again later on up in Maine 25 years ago, and she is gorgeous.
(and yes, Anna is gorgeous as well).
50ft Gaff Schooner, wooden 41ft on deck. Built in Fowey Cornwall 1980 - MJ Lewis Boat Sales
And another -
Gaff Rigged Schooner 44' For Sale, 13.41m, 1997
Greenheart
Well-Known Member
Wow! Thanks Bajan...those Murray Petersons prove that schooners don't even have to be big, to be matchlessly beautiful.
Which I guess is the answer to the OP's question.
Which I guess is the answer to the OP's question.
AntarcticPilot
Well-Known Member
That's the one. Unfortunately, I don't think my wife and I could handle that rig!
Rum_Pirate
Well-Known Member
what is the name of the sail at the peak of the Main?
Poignard
Well-Known Member
A topsail
