Serious question. Can anyone recommend...

[Steve101]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

Ok, ok! You're all right of course, however I want to have the kit fitted now and make sure its the right bit of kit before I do it so I don't have to put up with pertruding wires and refits later. The whole point is more for extended sailing (with auto-pilot.), which I have no intention of doing until my second season at least. (Note : Intend!)

In the mean time I've got a season of self tuition on the thing. I quite agree that you need to learn to walk before you run, but (and I know I'm going to get flamed for this navigation aint exactly rocket science is it. I understand the theory and although Angie isn't doing the course persee, she is doing the exercises and she's got the hang of it too!

Spare gps, charts, spare skipper!

Lifes hard enough as it is, why boil up some soup when you can microwave it in 45 seconds. I WANT to understand the theory of navigation and I get the impression that much like driving a car, once you know it you never forget. Just get a little rusty.

Besides just under five grand for a fish finder seems a bargain! I've never fished before either!

Thanks

Steve

 

[JeremyF]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

Well, Iver checked the back issues. PBO a few months ago said that the Raymarine colour was the best of ythe bunch at £3200. Ask Moody's about pricing, they may be better

<font color=blue>Jeremy Flynn/forums/images/icons/crazy.gif
Dawn Chorus</font color=blue>

 

[Joe_Cole]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

Steve,

A serious thought.

Why not get the boat yard to put in the wiring now, but leave the non essential equipment till later. That way you've got the best of both worlds.

I can guarantee that if you get all the electronics now you'll be wanting to change some it it very soon.

Regards

Joe

 

[Steve101]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

Jeremy, against your better judgement you are a star. Thank-you. Reading through a past thread I noticed you're doing a radar course, if you're ever down nr Torquay drop in and I'll ply you with drink whilst you show me how it should be done! Er, better make sure I've got the damn thing first though!

What is it Sailbadthesinner says?

Beer! Now there's a temporary solution!

 

[Sinbad1]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

Steve

Having followed your postings and kept my head down I am now risking your wrath by making some comments in the hope that the euphoria of buying a boat has dissipated slightly and that reality of looking after the boat and crew is taking over.

Navigation. What you are learning is navigation THEORY. This teaches you to get from A to B. In practice you will find that you are never at A, in fact much of the time you aren't too sure where you are, but from there you have to get to B. This is navigation. It is a collection of variable facts and factors which you interpret from experience. Yes you can remove many of these variables with modern electronics but it will only be a question of time before they stop operating and you need the ability to fall back on experience.

To get this experience you need a vessel that allows you to make many errors. You will damage your boat very quickly. You may even damage yourself trying not to damage to boat. You will break your electronic gear. If you combine your instruments in one unit (Chartplotter/radar/depth) then when you get a nearby lighning strike, you will have NO instruments at all. Keep them separate.

If you don't know what you are doing when you go out to sea you will frighten your crew. If you have young children you will not only frighten them but mother will never let you frighten them again. You will become a weekend bachelor sailor very quickly.

Fear makes you sick. You will also get seasick. Worse, your wife will get sick and this will frighten the children. You will be looking after a boat, a sick wife and two frightened kids. Then and only then will you run over the lobster pot buoy. If you are lucky it will only only stop the engine, but more likely (becos of the rather foolish rudder arrangement on the Moody 38) it will wrap around the rudder and you won't be able to steer.

The extras that you talk about will have absolutely no value in 2/3 years. They will be obsolete electronics and you will have wrecked them anyway. You would be better buying your boat with only the basics to allow you and your family to enjoy it and learn to sail and navigate and have fun. You won't have any fun if you are worried about the fancy instrumentation being wrong/not interfacing etc. So buy the basic boat, learn on it and you will get your money back if you decide to change boats for a bigger one/ better one/caravan/country cottage in Himalayas.

If after your learning experiences you know that she is the boat for you, then fit the latest gear as and when you are going off cruising.

 

[Steve101]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

Hear you loud and clear! Agree with seperate equipment argument and will look into gps/plotter and seperate radar for clarity aswell as eggs/basket concept. I understand family argument although it doesn't apply to me (You need to meet the family first!) I'm afraid the basic boat thing is falling on deaf ears, I want this piece of kit and I'm having it; although I do respect your opinion. C'mon 1 ot of 3 aint bad!

P.S. I did find this post quite amusing, I hope this was meant to be!

Cheers

Steve

Oh and I took the point about theory seriously aswell. Trying hard not to offend!

 

[pandroid]

I've got the Raymarine Colour Radar/Plotter with Overlay and its the D*gs Bo***cks. The overlay feature allows you separate the land from the moving bits (i.e. ships). The chart resolution isnt as good as the ARCS charts on a PC, but a lot less hassle and it fully integrates with all the other Seatalk stuff (Autopilot, Displays etc) thats on the boat. You need the latest autopilot computer or the Smart Heading Sensor to get the best out of the MARPA tho'

 

[kimhollamby]

For the record...

Raytheon and Raymarine now two separate companies since the latter took the MBO route 22 months ago. At least pressing the wrong button on your radar shouldn't unleash a Patriot missile now....

kim_hollamby@ipcmedia.com

 

[nicho]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

Jeremy, I thought I'd made that last point of yours in my other posting. He has to learn to do these things without navaids, but he just might be caught out in poor visability/fog when even in inexperienced hands they will surely help. I also found that it took a long time to learn to read radar plots, and had the unit on most of the time in early days to gain experience in that respect. I don't see what damage will occur to his learning curve by having these things from day one. One of the best things he can do is to employ a yachtmaster instructor to live aboard for the first week's sailing - such tuition on a one to one basis will be invaluable.

 

[Steve101]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

I was actually thinking along those lines of having a yachtsmaster on board for the first week to help with close quarter manouvering. I guess it would kill two birds with one stone. Anyone suggest a starting point or anyone brave enough to offer! ;-)

 

[jimi]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

See if you can get Moody's to supply one as part of the contract.

Jim

 

[nicho]

Re: Leave the toys off, Steve!

Stve, I have some details which I'll send by PM

 

[tcm]

Re: expert assitance

ooh, a chance to play with lots of new toys... such as Grand Theft Auto, wassisnames skateboard game, and so on. Oh alright, yes spose we'd better do some sailing...

 

[jimi]

Lots & lots of it

Really to continue the fine tradition, we all ought to take our holidays when Steve takes delivery and sail alongside shouting advice, followed by a debriefing bunfight in the pub afterwards.

Jim

 

[Steve101]

Re: expert assitance

Kids have got one of those cd wallets full of about 150 PS2 games and guess what, they didn't cost a penny (Free from various different publishers!) Downside is the kids arn't into playing games (ONLY GODDAMN KIDS ON THE PLANET THAT AINT!). Son wants to be an astronaught (Only plays with lego, mechano etc!) Daughter wants to be a bitch! (Only plays with our minds!)

Guess it leaves plenty of time to play Ferrari 355 and This is football 2002 (Both not out yet, but I've got 'em!) for us eh. Now if I bring the PS2, can you bring the naked women!

 

[Steve101]

Re: Lots & lots of it

Definately, did someone mention the pub! The spinnaker in Brixham has plenty of room to throw buns!

 

[tcm]

Steve : put all the toys back on!

Boats are the very best and most limitless exit route for all personally-acquired money, whether it has been accrued from working, inheritance, investments, house appreciation and any other wise money-making venture.

Sure, if you have a lot of money you could buy a house, but that will simply appreciate, and there's a limit to how much you can spend on a house.

Boats are not so constricted, and will easily lose their value, ridding one of large volumes of worrisome cash once and for all. Buy a large boat, preferably a new one, and you need never read the "Money" section of sunday newspapers ever again. Nor will the gyrations of the stock market worry you. You've burned the lot on a boat. Hooray!

Now, of all the arguments put over to deter steve101 fom buying this or that, the depreciation argument is the most rational, yet also the most strange: buying a largely piece of leisure equipment such as a plastic boat and then considering the wisdom of buying this contraption or saving some money there seems to plunge the process back into dullest district of reality.

The simple question is "will this make me 4 grand happier" and if the answer is yes or even "possibly"- buy it.

Surely, at a certain point, a significant element of one's life comprises 1) buying things to make you happy, and 2) selling them when you're sick of them. It would be a shame to spoil phase 1 because of phase 2, which is inevitable anyway. All you are doing is hanging on to more of the money that would (or might have, you won't know if you haven't tried it) have made you happy.

Fact is that few people buy new boat (and very few people buy more than ONE new boat) ... and since there's precious little point to any of it, then provided that money is no object (and i think we've established that it isn't, within the general scope of this project) steve101 may as well buy it.

And so of course, the question must be asked, doctor - why is he asking? Is he asking our advice? -certainly not - he's been told a load of times not to buy an end-of line new boat with a ton of gear, and he's still going to do it. Is he a spoofer? -no, cos otherwise the spoof would have progressed to ask sillier questions. So, is he secretly wallowing in the socially forbidden joy of unloading a whole massive pile of loot? Yes - I think so - and the "wise" advice is simpy making him feel more outrageous by the minute!

Spend your money and your offspring enjoy any involvemnet in your mad and fun-chasing life. But if you save your money, your family may start to look forward to the time when they can use the loot for it's intended purpose - in the pursuit of happiness.

So, back to the radar screens. Can they play dvd's therby having another telly? Would having a dvd playing in the cockpit perhaps be a great lark (yes, he's gopt kids, of course it would). Does the raymarine offer the dvd-platying option as well as the overlay too? If so, buy it. If not, buy the Furuno.

hope this helps!

















My own twopence worth is that if you are extremely gadget-prone, then why not have the ones that play dvd's onto the radar screen! yes!

 

[tcm]

Re: expert assitance

I can ceratinly bring naked women, but with the boat being in the UK they will be wearing lots of warm clothes, albeit completely starkers underneath. Naked or near-naked women are standard equipment on stinkpots, though.

 

[Steve101]

Close, but no cigar!

Thank you Dr tcm, but I really just wanted to get a starting point for finding the piece of kit I wanted and of which PKB, yourself and nicho kindly provided (amongst others.)

You're right on the fact that I'm wallowing in enjoyment buying my first boat, although I hope I don't come across as smug or anything like. I'm excited, scared witless (or something that sounds like it!), wonderous and befuddled at my first real endulgence (Unless you count a professional karaoke machine!)

I truly respect everyones opinion on here, which is ultimately more knowledgable than mine and if it seems I'm on here all the time asking "stupid questions" it's because (I've got no mates and I smell bad.) you're all the sailing family I have (Aaaah!) 'cept my mate with the Bav who has only a little more experience than I (Although it seems a world of experience to me!)

I want my little Moody to be the right boat, the right spec and last me forever. Keep the previous sentence stored and use it to beat me with in 12 months time, but for now that's my mission statement. Please help.

I don't want the dvd/tv to play on the radar screen, well unless I can get Man U on it and then I would. Can you fit a satellite dish to the mast?


Did you really mean it when you said naked women are standard on stinkpots?

 

[nicho]

Re: Close, but no cigar!

Oh no! - my wife's Irish, a Man. United nutcase and a distant pal of Roy Keene's. Not you as well Steve - me?, I support any team United are playing against, "just for badness" as 'er indoors says!