Sara Sutcliffe appointed CEO of the RYA

[Black Sheep]

What always amuses me is that the type of people I actually meet sailing, whether racing or rafted up in Yarmouth etc, are quite different from the sort of people that inhabit this forum.

Indeed. But the question is, which population is more representative of sailors across the UK?

The only racing I do is gentle club racing, so I don't "meet" people that way (I already know them). But yes, I can see that for a keen racer, the RYA has relevance.

I've never been rafted up in Yarmouth. Somehow that doesn't appeal to me. Does that make me atypical? Or those who choose to?

We all end up in the company of those we get on with, so we all live in our own echo chambers, to an extent.

 

[Black Sheep]

No, because the RYA are necessary in terms of certificating instructors for 10 year olds in toppers etc.

No they aren't.

 

[flaming]

No they aren't.

Currently... They are.

 

[Black Sheep]

So you're telling me I can't teach my 10 year-old to sail without a bit of paper from the RYA? Do please link to the legislation.

 

[Stemar]

When I first got a boat, I joined the RYA, but soon decided the RNLI was a better use for my money. I haven't seen anything to change my mind.

Having said that, I would say that a sports organisation needs a competent manager at its head, rather than a sports person. Both would be ideal, but management is far more important. The sporty folk are needed on the front line.

 

[Gwylan]

Regarding training and pathways I was introduced to sailing by the CCPR. It was over 50 years ago.
They ran summer schools and racing courses.

Did my YM because that's what there is. Satisfied HID that I might be competent

Agree with the RNLI being better guardians of my annual subscription.

 

[flaming]

So you're telling me I can't teach my 10 year-old to sail without a bit of paper from the RYA? Do please link to the legislation.

No, obviously I'm not saying that.
As I said, people on this board are thinking of their own situation, where they can sail with their kids, and teach them.

That isn't what the RYA is for. The RYA is for if you aren't able to teach your kids, or when you decide that your kid would be better off learning from someone else, or with other kids, and then ensuring that the people you entrust your kids to are suitably qualified in both the teaching part, and also the safety part.
In that sense, then somebody has to do the extremely important job of qualifying those instructors, and holding those training centres to the required standard.

 

[Black Sheep]

So now you're saying that the RYA play a useful role in some aspects of learning to sail. Well I'm not going to argue with that. But it's a long way from "they are necessary".

 

[Sandy]

So you're telling me I can't teach my 10 year-old to sail without a bit of paper from the RYA? Do please link to the legislation.

Do you issue certificates to your child that are recognised elsewhere? Are you as the instruction validated as a knowing your stuff? And most importantly will your child be able to do a standard OXO.

The last point is a personal gripe as the number of times I've seen a total dogs dinner of an OXO, The worst had about eight locking turns that locked the wrong way and it would take a chainsaw to undo it!

 

[Quandary]

What has the RYA ever done for me?????

It set up and controlled the Yachtmaster qualification which I took at night classes in the first years of sailing in the 1970s.
It gave me the best ten years of my life when I was seriously racing and able to compete in individual events and season long series in both Ireland and Scotland with the same boat set up the same way under the same rules.
It reinstated a result on appeal when we were disqualified from a victory in an event by a Club who made their own rules up.
It provided the framework under which both my children learned to sail in safety and with high quality instruction.
It oversaw an annual international inter club team event in which my son participated as a teenager at a level higher than anything I could have offered.
It encouraged the strict one design rules and racing which resulted in the Sigma 33OOD I owned and raced in the eighties, my son still races on one today.
It campaigned for the improvement and maintenance of the Crinan Canal where I kept our boat and many of the harbours I used.
It provided the tested documents and legal procedures I needed to use when I sold our boat last month.

Other than that, nathin, nix, a complete waste of time.

 

[fredrussell]

Have to say I agree with Flaming. Every time I sail past Woolverstone (on the Orwell), there are huge numbers of kids hooning around in dinghies, all under supervision and with a safety boat present. I’m not sure that would happen without the RYA’s involvement.

 

[Mark-1]

No, because the RYA are necessary in terms of certificating instructors for 10 year olds in toppers etc. And ensuring that those instructors can handle their ribs, have first aid qualifications etc to make sure that kids are introduced to the water in the most positive, and safest, way possible.

I don't think we should forget that learning to sail is not like learning to play football, where you can just start kicking a ball. The job of ensuring a training pathway for juniors is safe and engaging is very important.

Everyone on this board thinks in terms of families sailing their yachts - and why they would be bothered about the RYA, but forgets the huge amount of junior "learn to sail" activities that take place every year under the RYA's supervision and responsibility.

In my modification of your analogy the cruising sailors of this forum are the 10yos playing football in the park as opposed to the Premier League players who are the Olympic sailors.

 

[Bobc]

I think this discussion highlights the main problem, which is that the RYA is almost invisible to the average cruising yachtsman.

The training stuff is great, as is the Olympic scheme. However, there seems to be little for the cruising sailor these days, and the CA seems to offer a much more useful and valuable service.

I have had dealings with the RYA for over 30 years and have found them increasingly distant and out of touch with the needs of the majority of the sport's participants.

 

[Black Sheep]

Do you issue certificates to your child that are recognised elsewhere?

No. Do you issue certificates to your child when you teach them how to tie their shoelaces?

Are you as the instruction validated as a knowing your stuff?

No. Are you validated as knowing your stuff before you kick a ball about in the back garden with your kid?

And most importantly will your child be able to do a standard OXO.

Wow. That's the most important lesson in sailing?

We seem to have some priority mismatches.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of structured training. And certificates can be very useful both as a focus to learning, and as validation of it. But it's the learning that's the important thing, not the bit of paper.

 

[flaming]

So now you're saying that the RYA play a useful role in some aspects of learning to sail. Well I'm not going to argue with that. But it's a long way from "they are necessary".

They are definitely necessary to anyone who isn't in the fortunate position to be taught to sail by their parents etc.

Thinking of the people I sail with now, I think of the regular crew 3 or 4 of us were taught to sail by our parents. (Though one of them happened to run a sailing school). The rest of the regulars, about 12 people, all started with RYA courses. No RYA, and it's hard to see how those people get into sailing.

So yes, necessary.

 

[Mark-1]

3 or 4 of us were taught to sail by our parents. (Though one of them happened to run a sailing school). The rest of the regulars, about 12 people, all started with RYA courses. No RYA, and it's hard to see how those people get into sailing.

So the RYA, far from helping cruising sailors, are causing the insane overcrowding we suffer from in the South.

But nobody said the RYA aren't useful in terms of training and racing. This thread was all about casual cruising sailors of the type who inhabit this forum.

 

[Parabordi]

I think this discussion highlights the main problem, which is that the RYA is almost invisible to the average cruising yachtsman.

The training stuff is great, as is the Olympic scheme. However, there seems to be little for the cruising sailor these days, and the CA seems to offer a much more useful and valuable service.

I have had dealings with the RYA for over 30 years and have found them increasingly distant and out of touch with the needs of the majority of the sport's participants.

CA is at least trying to lobby and get some help to change the 90/180 day rule for Schengen. What is RYA doing?

 

[awol]

.

They are definitely necessary to anyone who isn't in the fortunate position to be taught to sail by their parents etc.

Thinking of the people I sail with now, I think of the regular crew 3 or 4 of us were taught to sail by our parents. (Though one of them happened to run a sailing school). The rest of the regulars, about 12 people, all started with RYA courses. No RYA, and it's hard to see how those people get into sailing.

So yes, necessary.

That makes me feel sad. My parents didn't sail but for very little money I joined a Club and learned - I use "learned" because there was little formal training though we had to convince our elders and betters that we were competent before being allowed to take out a club boat. The learning came from sailing with other cadets and on members' boats. We certainly did not hand over large wads of cash for Incontinent Crew, Dazed Kipper, etc. pieces of cardboard. I'm glad to say the same option is still available and also, for a larger club subscription, to adults. It couldn't have been too bad 'cos I managed to convince my Yachtmaster examiner of my competence without the benefit of RYA instruction.

 

[flaming]

So the RYA, far from helping cruising sailors, are causing the insane overcrowding we suffer from in the South.

"Oh how awful that the RYA promote boating to those oiks who's parents didn't sail and provide them with a route into sailing that they wouldn't otherwise have had! What are they doing, those people just have NO PLACE on a boat... We had to RAFT in Yarmouth last week, and we were tied up to someone who's father didn't sail and ONLY STARTED SAILING 2 YEARS AGO! Oh the horror! "

I mean, the utter brass balls to try and claim that introducing people to the sport is a bad thing is... well...

In this instance I am extremely happy to say I could not disagree with you more.

But nobody said the RYA aren't useful in terms of training and racing. This thread was all about casual cruising sailors of the type who inhabit this forum.

If you can't see how training is useful to the casual cruising sailor... Then I'm not sure how to help you.

However membership is not compulsory. If you disagree with what you perceive as the aims of the RYA, then don't join....

 

[Mark-1]

The last point is a personal gripe as the number of times I've seen a total dogs dinner of an OXO, The worst had about eight locking turns that locked the wrong way and it would take a chainsaw to undo it!

I don't dare show you my 4yo's 'super double knots' on a cleat - you'd probably cry. However, the boat never drifts off and it's a great bit of responsibility for him.

Admittedly he's never yet been able to undo one but that's what dads are for.

His sister favours conventional OXOs, but where's the fun in that?

?