RNLI

[Poecheng]

Bet you a fiver (to the RNLI) that it isn't. Most people expect them to be saving brave sailors and cowering passengers from the wrath of the ocean, not dropping everything on a nice day to tow in somebody without the wits to check their engine oil.

Well let's say you are right about what they 'expect', at least the feckless yachty is firmly within the range of expectations.
What is not within range of expectations of the Royal National Lifeboat Institution is the purchase of burkinis in Tanzania and providing free creche facilities in Bangladesh.
As has been said, these activities may be entirely laudable - it is just that it is not the RNLI's business. It is international aid which ordinarily is conducted by international NGOs (who state their purpose clearly most of the time) and Government.
By all means set up an International Lifeboat Institution and see how that fares donation wise. Those who believe we are obliged to care for everyone in the world equally, and with no regard to proximity, will be able to donate to their heart's content. Those who expect the RNLI to be using its donations to save lives in the UK, ROI, Isle of Man and Channel Islands will not be mislead or placed in a dilemma as to whether to donate.

 

[awol]

I know three people who are going to remove the RNLI from their wills because of this, and the news is less than a day old...

Perhaps the people who knee-jerk on the basis of a newspaper headline are the same ones who believe slogans on buses, lies on immigration and promises of the easiest deal ever. Seajet, you should choose your acquaintances more carefully!

 

[Poecheng]

Perhaps the people who knee-jerk on the basis of a newspaper headline are the same ones who believe slogans on buses, lies on immigration and promises of the easiest deal ever. Seajet, you should choose your acquaintances more carefully!

Simply because you disagree with their decision, you describe it as 'knee-jerk', mix it up with Brexit insults (and assume they must be part of the majority that voted Brexit) and tell Seajet to get new friends.

You know nothing about these people at all and probably as much as I do about Seajet.

Why could it not be a thought-through, reasonable decision of a rational person who makes a choice as to how their legacy is to be spent?

You are suggesting there is only one possible decision - the sheer stupidity and arrogance of these comments beggars belief. Brexit has one very obvious downside at least - it has made formerly reasonable people unreasonable.

 

[scotty123]

True, but how much of their money do they expect to go on tows for leisure sailors who can't be bothered to do engine maintenance?

Particularly those with sails they don't know/want to use.
Getting into the nearest safe haven is one thing, getting a tow when inconvenienced & perhaps missing your train back to Town, is another & IMO charged for.

 

[scotty123]

They do that all the time for fishing boats who despite total reliance on engines are often surprisingly poorly maintained - a great many yotties, sail or power,attend engine maintenence courses, I was on a boat whose owner did this, and had his ( newish ) engine overhauled by a pro engineer over winter - the pro introduced a snag with the exhaust cooling, luckily there was enough wind to sail so we just missed our tide.

Drifting with tide onto rocks in a calm deserves a lifeboat, IMO - I don't know about the new clueless Coastguard but in the good old days if someone broke down and not in danger but in need of a tow Solent Coastguard would point them to Seastart or yards with tow boats.

"Drifting with tide onto rocks in a calm deserves" an anchor, not an RAC service.

 

[Seajet]

Let's see you anchor to avoid rocks around the Channel Islands then, with those tides and depths.

I was with a novice chum once when the engine failed - it was light winds and we had to make a certain tidal entrance.

He was all for calling a local marina for a towboat - NB NOT a Mayday to the CG - but I stopped him, ' we've got sails and an anchor '.

That was in a soft mud harbour with small tides - in Alderney Race or The Swinge say, I'd think differently, not a Mayday unless actually going for rocks but worth asking for a tow.

As I mentioned earlier this is where Seastart are handy, if in the area.

 

[Ohlin Karcher]

Well let's say you are right about what they 'expect', at least the feckless yachty is firmly within the range of expectations.
What is not within range of expectations of the Royal National Lifeboat Institution is the purchase of burkinis in Tanzania and providing free creche facilities in Bangladesh.
As has been said, these activities may be entirely laudable - it is just that it is not the RNLI's business. It is international aid which ordinarily is conducted by international NGOs (who state their purpose clearly most of the time) and Government.
By all means set up an International Lifeboat Institution and see how that fares donation wise. Those who believe we are obliged to care for everyone in the world equally, and with no regard to proximity, will be able to donate to their heart's content. Those who expect the RNLI to be using its donations to save lives in the UK, ROI, Isle of Man and Channel Islands will not be mislead or placed in a dilemma as to whether to donate.

Hear hear, well said Poecheng!

 

[dunedin]

Reducing drowning deaths worldwide strikes me as laudable. Enabling women, who otherwise would not have the opportunity, to learn to swim by providing culturally acceptable swimwear also seems laudable. Unfortunately, the headlines that programme has generated in our press tend to prey on xenophobic tendencies and bring out similar responses from some forum contributors.

Spot on. The newspaper article chose to use emotive terms instead of “swimwear”, just to provoke a reaction from a certain audience.
As an RNLI member and donor I am happy that spending just 2% of income to reduce drowning deaths outside the U.K. is a good investment - and made very clear in their magazine and communications to members.

 

[dunedin]

Perhaps the people who knee-jerk on the basis of a newspaper headline are the same ones who believe slogans on buses, lies on immigration and promises of the easiest deal ever. Seajet, you should choose your acquaintances more carefully!

:encouragement:

 

[scotty123]

Let's see you anchor to avoid rocks around the Channel Islands then, with those tides and depths.

I was with a novice chum once when the engine failed - it was light winds and we had to make a certain tidal entrance.

He was all for calling a local marina for a towboat - NB NOT a Mayday to the CG - but I stopped him, ' we've got sails and an anchor '.

That was in a soft mud harbour with small tides - in Alderney Race or The Swinge say, I'd think differently, not a Mayday unless actually going for rocks but worth asking for a tow.

As I mentioned earlier this is where Seastart are handy, if in the area.

If anchor doesn't stop drift in a calm, resort to fenders, or that sweep you have constructed using a spinnaker pole.

 

[Ohlin Karcher]

Particularly those with sails they don't know/want to use.
Getting into the nearest safe haven is one thing, getting a tow when inconvenienced & perhaps missing your train back to Town, is another & IMO charged for.

Is it charged for even if the local lifeboat crew want to do it as a training exercise? That's happened to me, I asked specifically for a commercial tow, not being in danger, but the lifeboat jumped at the chance. I didn't even want their big lifeboat alongside, the flared bows almost smashed my rails, and it was a huge, uncalled-for, extravaganza.
One of the RNLI deckhands was a cruising instructor and he was actually apologetic..

 

[Ohlin Karcher]

If anchor doesn't stop drift in a calm, resort to fenders.

Fenders to protect you from jagged rocks in a tideway?

 

[scotty123]

Is it charged for even if the local lifeboat crew want to do it as a training exercise? That's happened to me, I asked specifically for a commercial tow, not being in danger, but the lifeboat jumped at the chance. I didn't even want their big lifeboat alongside, the flared bows almost smashed my rails, and it was a huge, uncalled-for, extravaganza.
One of the RNLI deckhands was a cruising instructor and he was actually apologetic..

You "asked for a tow", so are you going to complain about who turns up?

 

[Seajet]

Fenders to protect you from jagged rocks in a tideway?

That was my thought, I'd try them and spi pole or anything if on rocks but wouldn't fancy my chances - the dinghy would already be inflated as I'd try that with its outboard alongside as Plan B if no wind and too steep to for anchoring.

 

[Ohlin Karcher]

You "asked for a tow", so are you going to complain about who turns up?

Yes, because I didn't want a lifeboat.

 

[Poecheng]

The newspaper article chose to use emotive terms instead of “swimwear”, just to provoke a reaction from a certain audience.

Burkini is not an emotive term, it is a noun which describes a particular type of costume. Whilst it might come under the general term 'swimwear', it would be misleading in the circumstances to simply describe what is being bought as 'swimwear'.

It is not designed for swimming, it is designed to completely cover a woman when she is swimming. Its primary design feature is to cover all - which impedes swimming - but is the least that can be worn in order to swim.

You seem to have a Skandi influence - don't tell the public the raw truth so that no one can have a basis for disagreeing with the 'accepted' position.

Maybe to mislead by using 'swimwear' is what you want? That way nobody would know that it is being bought for an exclusive group: female muslims of Tanzania. Maybe then you would not have your sensitivities challenged (but you overlook it, don't you?) by the societal requirement for women to wear such garb - it is amazing that you support it rather than rail against muslim male oppression that forces women to wear this. You oppressor of females you !

As 90 per cent of Bangladesh is muslim, the RNLI's overseas aid seems to be exclusively or almost exclusively benefitting muslims. Of all the possibilities in the world to help stop people drowning, how did those two choices come to be made, and in combination?

The direct beneficiaries are women and children. No man is a seemingly a direct beneficiary of the RNLI's overseas aid.

If I was thinking about how I could best use the RNLI's overseas budget, I would research how/where most people drown and assist with some control measures; that doesn't appear to have been the starting point for this exercise.

 

[Seajet]

Indeed, and I wonder if supplying these Burkinis might annoy the oppressive male locals - if they don't want their women to show any skin - or learn to read, drive, swim etc - might they not be miffed by white non muslims facilitating a bit of freedom - and even endanger the RNLI rep's ?

Genuine question, as this strikes me as meddling way outside the RNLI's remit at every level.

 

[JumbleDuck]

It is not designed for swimming, it is designed to completely cover a woman when she is swimming. Its primary design feature is to cover all - which impedes swimming - but is the least that can be worn in order to swim.

It is designed for swimming in exactly the same way - and with almost exactly the same result - as UV-protective costumes for children are designed. The only difference is that includes head covering, and many swimmers - children and adult - wear swimming caps.

The only conceivable reason for being snooty about burkinis is anti-Muslim prejudice. I trust that those mocking others for modesty swim only in the nude, because if they wear even the tiniest speedos they are hypocrites quibbling only about matters of degree.

Doubting whether the RNLi should provide any services outside the British Isles is perfectly fine; arguing that they shouldn't provide services to Muslims is bigotry.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Indeed, and I wonder if supplying these Burkinis might annoy the oppressive male locals - if they don't want their women to show any skin - or learn to read, drive, swim etc - might they not be miffed by white non muslims facilitating a bit of freedom - and even endanger the RNLI rep's ?

Genuine question, as this strikes me as meddling way outside the RNLI's remit at every level.

Young adult (15 - 24) literacy rates in Bangladesh are 93% for women and 90% for men. The evidence does not support a claim of general hostility to women's literacy there.

 

[scotty123]

Young adult (15 - 24) literacy rates in Bangladesh are 93% for women and 90% for men. The evidence does not support a claim of general hostility to women's literacy there.

How does that compare with Bradford?