Red Diesel Petition

[Boating_Buoys]

So I see in this months MBM 1000 people have signed the online petition... big deal!

Is it me or is that totally pathetic ?

The sales of the magazine is apparrently circa 15,000; which should mean about 30,000 readers/browsers.

Yet out of that lot only 1000 can be bothered to sign the petition... I for one am flabergasted beyond belief... or maybe it's a printing error and it's 10,000 ??? !

So who hasn't signed and why not ? There is no chance of government taking much notice of a 1000 signatories, you get more than that for petitions about yellow lines in the High Street.

Come on people, do your bit !

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[Talbot]

your spleen might have been a bit more focused by providing a link to the on-line petition.
For those who have not yet signed <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.ybw.com/mbm/redalert/petition.html> here it is</A>

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[Gludy]

I am really not sure that the petition will have any effect even with 30,000 signatures on it.

The best focus against the hike is to concentrate on its impractable nature, problems of control and the drop in tax revenue that would follow such a hike.

A vested interest group petition is what one would expect and would be ignored.

I know a lot of boaters who think such a hike will never happen - maninly based on the grounds that no governement would devastate an industry in such a way. Hence there is not a lot of interest as yet with many boaters.

<hr width=100% size=1>Paul

 

[Scaramoosh]

IMHO its going to happen because thats what the law says is going to happen. The effort of putting an ammendment though the European Parliment even if they wanted to support it would mean it wouldn't get onto the debating list. If you think otherwise I hope your right but I don't think so.

Now a petition that said that we should have the same price as they have over the channel in order to support the UK boating industry, I could support. Any argument that French prices will have an effect wont wash; Sunseeker, Fairline et al sell lots of boats in the Med today.

<hr width=100% size=1>To err is human, to really screw up you need a boat

 

[nwclegg]

I still think there are two points that don't seem to get emphasised enough.

1. The current tax on vehicle petrol is a "Road" tax and road users get some benefit from it - raods. What will we get from this tax?

2. The level of taxation on road fuels is designed to restrict road vehicle use to avoid congestion etc. how is this relevant to boats?

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[Althorne]

I too have to agree and think that 1000 is pretty dismal. Maybe MBM don't sell as much as they kid they do that's why us regulars still don't get any goodies each year and they only give things away to those spending £7 a quarter, then a quick cancel/re-join and get more goodies. Bit like regulars paying extra red diesel tax really ennit.
Cheers

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[Gludy]

"Any argument that French prices will have an effect wont wash"

A doubling in the price and the problems of implementing another class of fuel will have a major effect - to say it will not wash is absurd.



<hr width=100% size=1>Paul

 

[DepSol]

one poxy thousand, maybe they would have done betterto get people to sign the petition against red diesel at the SIBS whilst they were touting for new subscriptions. That way they would have got 10 times the amount they already have in one week.

I have signed it although it doesnt effect me, only means if it comes into play I will prob see more of you lot over here filling up.

I still cant believe its only 1000, Hugo was this worth shouting about really I could walk down the Guernsey high street for a week and probably get 1000 people to sign that petition.

<hr width=100% size=1>Dom

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.soltron.co.uk>the website</A>

 

[SlowlyButSurely]

I think this petition will do more harm than good by drawing attention to the issue.

A petition to save red diesel for leisure boat owners would need hundreds of thousands of names on it to have any credibilty IMO.

Now if MBM were to petition for the continuation of red diesel for sailing boats on the basis that sailing is a sport (at which we have some success) and sport should not be taxed I think they might be onto something.

I have signed it BTW.



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[Gludy]

Whilst I agree with some of your points - it would be impracticable to have one fuel for sailing boats and one for power boats - that would quickly see another £50k worth of pumps just for sailing boats who use next to nothing anyway.

I would quickly erect a hanky sail on my flybridge and claim sailing boat status!!!

Nope ... the best route to resist is based on it raising less tax, damaging employment, being impracticable to administer etc.

I agree, a petition is not going to help although I applaud the spirit of it.

<hr width=100% size=1>Paul

 

[Andrew_Fanner]

Voting out the cronies would probably help as well... That chance should come up before the end of the derogation

<hr width=100% size=1>Two beers please, my friend is paying.

 

[Its_Only_Money]

I think he might have meant "sailing" in its widest sense....

<hr width=100% size=1>Rgds

Simon
Its Only Money
Fairline Sprint
Solent-based

 

[Gludy]

Me thinks you may be right ......

<hr width=100% size=1>Paul

 

[SlowlyButSurely]

Yes, gloss over the fact that mobos use red diesel as well.

It's all about presentation. Don't forget that safety boats and committee boats are needed to run a sailing regatta and they are usually motor boats. Ok they are usually ribs with petrol engines but we don't need to spoil a good case with a few facts.


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[Gludy]

You are trying to apply logic where none prevails.

There is no chance of getting raggies as a whole to support us - there is a rump of them welcoming the price hike.

The only way is to point out the effects on the industry, employment, practical problems of administering it all for what will be a lower tax yield.

The whole issue should be such a mess that its not worth the candle to government who just give in.

Anyone facing a 200% to 300% price hike is going to object - they know that, so petitions are the norm. They will not effect the outcome and could even do damage.

I would rather not let government know how few we are - even a petition of 30,000 would show how few - let them imagine we represent more votes than we cactually do!

<hr width=100% size=1>Paul

 

[gjgm]

sorry, but you are many sea miles off course. If you actually look at the proposed EU bill you neednt bother about the current UK tax approach on fuels. What on earth is this question of a direct benefit from a specific tax? Cigarette duty goes to NHS,. Nat insurance goes to fund someones pension, fuel tax goes to building roads? not even the GVMT believes that baloney.
The EU proposes to harmonise taxation of fuels. It just so happens that bya historical quirk, leisure boaters in the UK would find they had to pay a harmonised level of tax for diesel, same level as the other 350+million people in the EU, (though maybe not all of them have a boat!). I ve read all the extremely weak arguments here and in mags. Industry wiped out. Coastline full of exploding petrol boats. Empty marinas. No, the only honest argument is that its going to cost more.
Not sure thats really going to win too many of the Brussels boys over.

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[theguvnor]

Can`t we pretend we hunt foxes as well

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[[448]]

Your post certainly made me add my 20 gallonsworth p.a. to the petition.
Cheers, Dave

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[cliff]

"2. The level of taxation on road fuels is designed to restrict road vehicle use to avoid congestion etc. how is this relevant to boats? "

It will get rid of some of the congestion by pricing the fuel guzzling mobos off the water. Ther eis a big difference between £1.20 / gallon and the £5.00 / gallon price talked about especially if your toy drinks 10 or 20 or even 30 gals/hour.

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[cliff]

"Whilst I agree with some of your points - it would be impracticable to have one fuel for sailing boats and one for power boats - that would quickly see another £50k worth of pumps just for sailing boats who use next to nothing anyway.

I would quickly erect a hanky sail on my flybridge and claim sailing boat status!!!

Nope ... the best route to resist is based on it raising less tax, damaging employment, being impracticable to administer etc.

I agree, a petition is not going to help although I applaud the spirit of it. "

The "red pumpos" are already in place it is the pumps for the MOBOs that will cost. As for erecting a hanky on your flybridge - won't wash - all tied in with SSR - -oh not registered - no red diesel for you my lad cough up full whack.

Did I hear a rumour that red would still be available for yachts (sailing variety) on production of SSR papers showing entitlement?

Good idea I think - tax all the stinkies and mobos off the water - raggie power rule!

Now diving for cover.....

PS I HAVE SIGNED THE PETITION (3 times)......

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