Outdrives - major work

[Greg2]

Interesting that you decide whether or not to change the oil based upon what the annual oil analysis shows Jerry. Obviously annual samples are the best way to do oil analysis, as opposed to a one off, but having gone to the trouble of doing them I would have thought that an annual oil change would be prudent?

 

[BruceK]

The cost of an oil analysis is probably more than the cost for me to change oil. I only need 25 litres.

 

[Bigplumbs]

The cost of an oil analysis is probably more than the cost for me to change oil. I only need 25 litres.

How much is 25 ltrs of the oil you use

 

[BruceK]

~£150

 

[petem]

How much is 25 ltrs of the oil you use

The quote that I have for my outdrive service (for two outdrives) is £220 for the labour (which includes the vacuum test) and £110 for oil. That's from an authorised VP dealer in Spain.

 

[BruceK]

to be clear my engines take 25 litres of oil. My outdrives take ~2 litres each of which 4 litres cost just under £100

 

[Bigplumbs]

~£150

So £75 a year if you were to do it every other year and save the hastle. Would it be any risk at all.......... I can see you say for £75 I aint taking the risk.... But if there is none ............. !

 

[petem]

So to sum up I think there are two choices (assuming I've understood Bigplumbs correctly):

1) Rely on a visual inspection and simple check of the current state of the oil via dipstick. Cost £0.00
2) Drain oil, pressure / vacuum check*, replace oil with new. Cost approx £330

* I assume this has to be done when the engine is dry?

 

[Boat2016]

You use the word Properly looked after what do you mean by that. Also why change oil every year, a year is just an arbitrary time period, why not every 15.5 months for example I suspect the life of oil is not determined by the orbit of the earth around the sun.

The cost of an oil change is indeed far less than the cost of a replacement engine but are you suggesting that an oil change every 2 years will mean you will need a new engine.

Peace of mind is an interesting concept. In my view the manuals that are written are designed to upset our peace of mind and in so doing upset our wallets and put money from ours into theirs.

It is not a question of knowing better it is a question of looking and learning and gaining experience of what is actually required

Properly looked after to me is serviced as shown in manufacturers service schedule and not doing what someone suggests on a boating forum who believes in nothing more than saving a bit of money and thinks they know better than those who make the engines, if I couldn’t afford to look after a boat I wouldn’t buy one.

 

[BruceK]

So £75 a year if you were to do it every other year and save the hastle. Would it be any risk at all.......... I can see you say for £75 I aint taking the risk.... But if there is none ............. !

It's like this. If the engines pop my best investment thereafter is a chainsaw and some serious elbow grease. I'm work shy. I'll stump the £75 quid and more even if it's only peace of mind. How about that?

 

[petem]

I think it's also worth re-iterating the point that failing to follow the manufacturer's guidelines could have an adverse affect on the value of the boat when the time comes to move it on. And also, ignoring the manufacturer's guidelines MAY also invalidate your insurance (worth checking carefully).

Incidentally, does anyone sample outdrive oil? I'll be sampling my engine oil when it's changed and will compare this to last years results. More info for the file!

 

[BruceK]

Incidentally, does anyone sample outdrive oil?

I'm guessing here if you have any fine swarf on the magnetised drain screw then you have gear shim and backlash issues. If you have fragments you're in deep trouble. If it's black you have clutch issues. If it's milky you have seal issues. I'm not sure there is much more to it to warrant an analysis.

 

[simonfraser]

I'm guessing here if you have any fine swarf on the magnetised drain screw then you have gear shim and backlash issues. If you have fragments you're in deep trouble. If it's black you have clutch issues. If it's milky you have seal issues. I'm not sure there is much more to it to warrant an analysis.

+1

unless you are buying a boat at arms length.


long term if you did everything recommended there is still no guarantee it would all work forever.
most of us 'cut corners' and take some risks. at least that way you should have some money in the piggy bank.

 

[ari]

Similarly with outdrives, and they were much much quieter in use. I'm shocked at the serious faults reported on here with ODs and the cost to fix.

To some degree you have to take these things in context (not just outdrive issues but all sorts of regularly reported problems). It's easy to find 10 people who have had issues with a certain type of engine for example, and conclude that it's a troublesome model, but be oblivious to the other 10,000 people who are running the same engine problem free because, quite naturally, they're all not coming onto message boards to say 'my engine ran perfectly all weekend, what should I do about it?'

You'll also always get 'experts' who don't even have the type of drive or engine or whatever it is under discussion, but do have a very negative opinion based on zero experience that they are very happy to loudly share.

That's not to suggest for a moment that people's issues are not genuine, be they with engines, drives, bow thrusters or whatever. Just that they should perhaps be judged in proportion to how many are out there in service.

 

[ari]

Properly looked after to me is serviced as shown in manufacturers service schedule and not doing what someone suggests on a boating forum who believes in nothing more than saving a bit of money and thinks they know better than those who make the engines, if I couldn’t afford to look after a boat I wouldn’t buy one.

Totally agree with this philosophy. The point at which I find myself wondering whether I can save £75 by risking skipping an oil change is the point that I decide I can't afford it anymore.

Plus, while proper maintenance obviously cannot guarantee trouble free running, I'd rather put to sea with my family knowing that I've done everything I can to ensure that my boat and my engines are properly maintained and are as likely to keep running as I can make them.

 

[BruceK]

To some degree you have to take these things in context (not just outdrive issues but all sorts of regularly reported problems). It's easy to find 10 people who have had issues with a certain type of engine for example, and conclude that it's a troublesome model, ...

That's not to suggest for a moment that people's issues are not genuine, be they with engines, drives, bow thrusters or whatever. Just that they should perhaps be judged in proportion to how many are out there in service.

to add to this one also needs to add age. People are astounded I paid so much on an outdrive repair. Further context is it's a 27 year old (1992 DP290) outdrive and to my knowledge the first major overhaul. 27 years of sitting in the sea and I'd say that's not too shabby a record all things considered. Hell I only dunked my Land Rover a few times in the sea with a trailer boat and that cost a helluva lot more to repair!!

 

[ari]

Good point, and, to bring it full circle, maintenance too.

Someone complaining about problems with an engine, drive or whatever might not be reflecting the lack of maintenance or care its previously had (possibly before they even owned it of course).

 

[stelican]

Quite agree with you,The boat that sells easy is the one with the correct manufacturers service history.
The words preventative maintenance should be combined with the word service.

 

[alt]

I could probably be considered to be a bit OTT with general servicing. But that said, in the 10+ years i've had Volvo engines & out-drives, the only non-maintenance item i've had to work on is a prop-shaft seal.

I have a boat worth, let's say for arguments sake, £100k. A 2 x engine / out-drive service costs me, maybe, £250 (all work done by myself).... I'd spend that on a night out.... it's not worth thinking about.

Trust me, I am far from loose with money (started with 'big' boats in my early 20's so didn't have it to throw about), but I don't care if it's coincidence that my regular servicing has meant trouble-free boating, but it's certainly not doing any damage.

 

[Bigplumbs]

Quite agree with you,The boat that sells easy is the one with the correct manufacturers service history.
The words preventative maintenance should be combined with the word service.

Those are just words and mean very little. The word service has ripped people off for many years and will for many years to come. The words Changed oil and spark plugs are the words that should be used not just service far too generic

Dennis