Novice getting started in sailing in UK

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mattie_uk

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Hi all

I've limited experience in sailing yachts and I'd be interested in how others managed their first steps into this field, particularly in the UK

I've sailed dinghies open water and it's quite easy to join a club, pick up tips and use club equipment whilst getting established, but the world of Yacht sailing is markedly different. I'm up in Edinburgh and have checked a few local clubs, but it's not clear how novices can get started.

Having only undertaken a day skipper and still awaiting our first charter (we're due to go to Greece for a week's sail with friends next year) I'm finding the next few steps quite daunting - sailing the med in good weather is not the same as navigating the Forth in fog and swell. I'd appreciate advice on how others managed their first forays - whether that was by buying a small, cheap and cheerful boat to build up experience in local waters, go shares with others to get a better boat and some advice and support (I would be going with strangers which would be of some concern), time-sharing, chartering for a few seasons (with or without local skipper) or any other means of kicking it off.

I appreciate this sounds quite noddy, not having many friends who sail means I've no-one to ask these noddy questions!

All advice gratefully received.

(Apols also if this is in the wrong forum, most threads are about specific details of sailing, but I' not sure where else it would be better placed. Apols also if this has been answered elsewhere, I've had a check but drew a blank, pointers to useful threads also appreciated)
 
Posting on a local sailing club board, maybe a local club keeps a list. First step is to comntact them and ask, most will bite your hand off. Alternatively there are crewseeker websites and such like.
The expensive option is a tutored course on the water.
 
It very much depends on where you are sailing. I don't know your area enough to be specific I'm afraid. Joining a club is what I usually recommend but is not by any means necessary. Quite a lot of sailors are not 'club types' and sail happily without. For myself, I was confident in my boat handling, having many years of dinghy sailing and engineless Broads sailing behind me, so I just bought a boat and set off after a lot of winter reading. We stayed in local waters for a few years, with our two children, but had joined a club and started not very serious cruiser racing before going abroad to France with a small petrol engine, no radio or anything else much, and still survived. Much depends on your level of confidence and common sense since there are no, or few, rules.
 
Hi Mattie,
Welcome. Sounds like you want to know how different people have got in to sailing. Well it seams there is the moneys no problem bunch. Those that were born and bred with sailing in their blood. And then there were the have a go mercenaries.

For what its worth im one of the have a go mercenaries. Never ever sailed before, had no idea at all. Thought id just take the plunge. Well its been 6 years now. 3 boats later. still enjoy it as much if not more so. Took a long time to find the right boat,( I mean I bought the wrong type initially) when I did find the right boat, its taken a lot of work. My only regret is I never get enough time on the water, but you cant have everything..

If I had a pot of gold I might have done things differently, Good Luck.

Steveeasy
 
I tend towards hands-on learning so I pretty much dived straight in just over two years ago. Bought a boat in Plymouth and sailed it back home to Sussex singlehanded. Lots of cockups on the way but a great learning experience and a fantastic adventure, wouldn't have missed it for anything. Everybody's different though and I wouldn't necessarily recommend doing it that way, depends what sort of person you are.

I had built up a decent amount of theoretical knowledge over the years. I've wanted to own a sailing boat ever since reading Arthur Ransome as a child and I devoured everything I could get my hands from boat building to navigation. It was always a pipe dream though and it was only in my 60s that the collapse of the second hand boat market meant I could just about afford to buy and run an old 1970s Westerly. It took about 9 months to find a good enough boat and during that time I did a vast amount of internet research. This forum was a particularly valuable source of information, and still is.

It's a lot of fun and I'm pushing it a bit further each year. This year I spent a couple of months visiting the Scillies and the Channel Islands. Next year it's the Irish Sea, and maybe Southern Scotland depending on how far I get before I want to turn round.

Looking back I realise that I was lucky with the weather for my initial trip back from Plymouth, it might have been a different story if conditions had been bad. Having your Day Skipper means you're well ahead of where I started from though.
 
I just started off crewing for people I knew. Which grew into mainly racing, with a few charters a year to play at being skipper.

Basic tip is that most people need crew. So it's just a matter of making contact with them. Clubs is one route. Or contacts at work or whereever. Once you start racing people are often looking for crew when they bring a boat to a regatta. Once you've a few contacts it gets easier.
 
I read loads of stuff on here then I bought a small old cheap sailing boat, ( called a bradwell 18) £1200 with trailer and recent outboard. Took her on a couple of trips across the solway firth to Scotland to get the basics of sailing and navigation that autumn and winter , asked loads of dumb questions on here. Then in the spring sailed for Isle of Man, and carried on sailing her a week or two at a time in between work for a year, over to Ireland then up to top of Scotland and back. It was a fast learning curve, 1200 miles worth.
I highly reccomend it if you have some common sense and a bit of experience in taking calculated risks in other activities.
 
Hi Mattie and welcome to the club!

As a dinghy sailor now with day skipper (assume you mean the practical course, not Shorebased.......where did you do it?), you’re already ahead of many “new starters”

I morphed into Sailing from scuba diving so was familiar with waters but knew very little about the many bits of string. I coupled RYA training with small boat ownership. I started with a humble 18ft trailer-sailer and progressed until I could (was in the fortunate position) buy new. In parallel and for over winters, I also bought a dinghy. Formal courses will advance your knowledge quickly but there’s no substitute for time on the water.

If you follow the well trodden route and buy a low cost starter boat, you must be prepared to work on the boat. If you have the aptitude this will stand you in good stead as you progress to bigger and better as you’ll have gained a good understanding of boat systems.

Personally, I’m no longer a member of a Sailing club. Volunteer crewing for yacht deliveries will give you sea miles but will not improve your ability to navigate by pilotage or manoeuvre a boat at close quarters.

My Sailing preference is U.K. as it’s too bloody hot and stuffy to be on a boat in The Med for me.
 
It's been touched on here but partly depends on what type of sailing you're looking for. Club racing is great for learning how to get the boat moving effectively plus the teamwork aspect. I think you should be prepared for a bit of commitment if you find a boat/skipper mutually OK but don't be afraid to try a few first - easier when you're new.

Most clubs now you can find their programme online. Pick a time to drop in following racing or other activity when people are around for a chat and see how it feels. If you don't want to go in 'cold', maybe get hold of a club officer first for some introductions. We nominally have a 6 visit rule before you need to join, others may be more or less flexible.
 
I am often looking for crew and very happy to take inexperienced crew as long as they have enthusiasm. And my plans might involve Scotland next year... Crew Bay is worth looking at.
I tend to feel that the RYA competent crew course is a waste of money as it covers the basics that can easily be picked over a couple of weekends with a sympathetic skipper.
Day skipper and beyond do involve a fair amount of theory so the formal course may be necessary.
However I also had a newly qualified day skipper (theory) sailing with me who was surprised to find that secondary port tidal calculations and complex tidal diamond plotting has little place on a modern boat with its sophisticated electronics. Which isn't to say that knowing the theory doesn't have a value - I know how to derive a position using a sextant, but you won't find me doing so on a Channel or Biscay crossing.
My Day Skipper could (just about) plot a simple tidal vector but was clueless about reefing!
When mulling this over, I really feel that the RYA emphasis on theory over practical (and the sailing schools who are happy to take their money) are taking advantage of novices wanting to enter the sport.
 
Sounds like you have the required basic knowledge as a dingy sailor with a day skipper.
You just need the confidence to take the next step.
Which one doesn’t matter. Get a cheep old small boat and head out or. Go and charter a boat.
The school I used to instruct for. Had some older smaller boats which could be rented for a day sail or chartered for a couple of nights. Contact the school you did your day skipper with and see what they have available.
The sailing school students were a significant part of the schools charter market.

I have never done one but those flotilla holidays in Greece and the med might be a good first charter to get your feet wet.
I used to charter a boat once or twice a year. With friends.
The first time may be a bit daunting. I gets less when you realize you can do it.
 
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mattie_uk said:
Hi all

I've limited experience in sailing yachts and I'd be interested in how others managed their first steps into this field, particularly in the UK

I've sailed dinghies open water and it's quite easy to join a club, pick up tips and use club equipment whilst getting established, but the world of Yacht sailing is markedly different. I'm up in Edinburgh and have checked a few local clubs, but it's not clear how novices can get started.

Having only undertaken a day skipper and still awaiting our first charter (we're due to go to Greece for a week's sail with friends next year) I'm finding the next few steps quite daunting - sailing the med in good weather is not the same as navigating the Forth in fog and swell. I'd appreciate advice on how others managed their first forays - whether that was by buying a small, cheap and cheerful boat to build up experience in local waters, go shares with others to get a better boat and some advice and support (I would be going with strangers which would be of some concern), time-sharing, chartering for a few seasons (with or without local skipper) or any other means of kicking it off.

I appreciate this sounds quite noddy, not having many friends who sail means I've no-one to ask these noddy questions!

All advice gratefully received.

(Apols also if this is in the wrong forum, most threads are about specific details of sailing, but I' not sure where else it would be better placed. Apols also if this has been answered elsewhere, I've had a check but drew a blank, pointers to useful threads also appreciated)
Click to expand...

Trust me, many find it "daunting", only the foolhardy have no concerns, their still upper lip keeps it well hidden.
The only thing that might help, is to keep going to sea & gaining experience & confidence, one step at a time as Mao said.
 
eastlands said:
When mulling this over, I really feel that the RYA emphasis on theory over practical (and the sailing schools who are happy to take their money) are taking advantage of novices wanting to enter the sport.
Click to expand...

I absolutely respect your first hand experience with your Day Skipper crew mate but I can’t agree with your views about RYA and Schools.

I’ve been a Shorebased Instructor for many years but only in the last couple of years qualified as a Crusing Instructor after retiring from a “proper job”.

RYA puts a lot of effort into training its instructors to deliver a complete and comprehensive training course.

The Crusing Syllabus has a balanced mix of theory and practical, imho. To address one of your concerns, sail selection and reefing is a key aspect of the DS Practical course. There is an ever increasing role for electronic navigation on a boat and I believe that the DS Practical course has just about the right balance. Over reliance on electronics isn’t ideal, either.

This is true example of modern day electronic obsession. A school boat was preparing to leave a marina berth. The DS candidate was organising his crew to slip lines when the instructor asked “what’s the tide doing?” The DS candidate looked flustered and horrified. He started to remove his gloves to reach for his phone App to check. Another of the DS candidates, already quite an experienced sailor, chipped in “why don’t you look over the side”.

Comp Crew is an entry level Practical course of 5 days duration; if you read the syllabus (RYA website) I’m sure you’ll agree that it has a thorough and compressive content. I now know from first hand experience that it can be a stretch for someone with no prior boating experience. For others, you’re absolutely right that DS may be a better choice.
 
Last edited:
mattie_uk said:
Hi all

I've limited experience in sailing yachts and I'd be interested in how others managed their first steps into this field, particularly in the UK

I've sailed dinghies open water and it's quite easy to join a club, pick up tips and use club equipment whilst getting established, but the world of Yacht sailing is markedly different. I'm up in Edinburgh and have checked a few local clubs, but it's not clear how novices can get started.

Having only undertaken a day skipper and still awaiting our first charter (we're due to go to Greece for a week's sail with friends next year) I'm finding the next few steps quite daunting - sailing the med in good weather is not the same as navigating the Forth in fog and swell. I'd appreciate advice on how others managed their first forays - whether that was by buying a small, cheap and cheerful boat to build up experience in local waters, go shares with others to get a better boat and some advice and support (I would be going with strangers which would be of some concern), time-sharing, chartering for a few seasons (with or without local skipper) or any other means of kicking it off.

I appreciate this sounds quite noddy, not having many friends who sail means I've no-one to ask these noddy questions!

All advice gratefully received.

(Apols also if this is in the wrong forum, most threads are about specific details of sailing, but I' not sure where else it would be better placed. Apols also if this has been answered elsewhere, I've had a check but drew a blank, pointers to useful threads also appreciated)
Click to expand...

there are many ways into sailing, some folk just go buy a cheap and cheerful boat on a club mooring and off they go, others go though formal training and build their confidence that way - I can share how i got into sailing yachts if it helps?

I too sailed dinghies for many years as a teenager basically and got the love for sailing, and i then did my day skipper when i was 18 as something fun to do in the summer, i couldnt charter a boat myself without formal qualifications and a flotilla holiday felt restricted with set destinations so by doing my day skipper i could hopefully just charter in future bareboat and do as i please - After this i've been "boat mad" ever since, reading and watching anything to do with it!

i couldn't afford a boat (more the costs of ownership than the boat itself) but i could just about get a bareboat charter in every two years if i took some cheap weeks at the end of the season namely in Greece, nice weather and not having to think about tides made it very relaxed and easy - usually with friends and myself as skipper, best way to learn is go do it. (for me anyway)

But then the more i sailed i actually wanted to understand tides more and had this silly dream of owning my own boat in the UK so a more in depth knowledge of tides would be needed, The UK is different sailing than in the med so i took a coastal skipper course where i planned to keep a boat, this helped me understand weather i actually enjoyed sailing in the UK ( and turns out i did.) get to know the area, and build knowledge at the same time - this basically just re-assured me that my theory classroom learning of all things sailing was spot on

I then chartered one summer in the UK for a week and took the family as a bit of a "test the waters into boat ownership" - we all loved it so the idea was set - so like many others i took the plunge and bought a boat, i would have been happy knocking about in a small centaur or similar but if this was going to be a holiday and weekends away then we wanted some modern comforts, i had been saving for some 10 years so was quite fortunate in what we could afford and joined a club who again just happened to have a mooring available (lucky i guess) in the Solent

boat purchase was made and we've spent 2 years afloat so far loving every minute and some 4000 nautical miles in "big boats" over the years.

on the outside of the "boat" scene its hard to look in, but having been there, they're all friendly and loads of folk look for crews etc, if i had known what i know now i would have joined a club long ago by just ringing them, it was only once i joined and had my own boat i realised home many other folk were actually looking for crew on a regular basis. it would have definitely got me out on the water more over the years.

im sure there are plenty in Edinburgh just give them a ring, sailing is just about sailing to your ability, weather that's a daylight 20 mile hop between marinas in a light breeze or a 200 mile off shore passage in a headwind & stiff blow.
 
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The easiest way to get on the water on a yacht is probably crewing on a racing boat.
These days instead of physically hanging around marinas and clubs, probably looking out the relevant facebook groups would be a good start.
People who turn up with their own kit, chocolate bisuits and an open mind can often find a place.
Being willing to put £20 into the kitty for race fees, diesel, sail budget or just getting a round in after the race never hurts either.
 
We often have shouts out for crew on our clubs facebook page for club racing. Most of the out and out racers have regular crews but for those of us that race cruisers getting crew can sometimes be a problem. The cruiser that I crew on is regulary crewed by three other boat owners who are all well experienced on both sides of the channel and quite happy to pass on advice. I'm sure that it's the same at your end of the country.
We bought our first sail boat with very little experience ( just the basics from dinghy sailing when I was at school 10 years previously) and just got on with it. It was a 21 foot Snapdragon of considerable age. Lots of advice from other club members helped. The best advice I got was "Don't frighten the family" Which meant many weekends in North Wales using it as a caravan because of the weather. However 25 years on we are still sailing together very happily.
If your going to the Med then a flotilla will probably be better than bareboating for the first time, again plenty of advice and backup should things go wrong. We have had several flotilla holidays and thoroughly enjoyed them,
 
lw395 said:
The easiest way to get on the water on a yacht is probably crewing on a racing boat.
These days instead of physically hanging around marinas and clubs, probably looking out the relevant facebook groups would be a good start.
People who turn up with their own kit, chocolate bisuits and an open mind can often find a place.
Being willing to put £20 into the kitty for race fees, diesel, sail budget or just getting a round in after the race never hurts either.
Click to expand...

On the other hand, the OP wants to cruise, not race, and racing probably won't teach him/her anything s/he doesn't already know from dinghy sailing.

I'm a great fan of just buying a cheap boat (Steve Yates is my hero) and going for it. Although I write this in Edinburgh, I don't know much about the Forth sailing scene, but perhaps Dalgety Bay SC would be a place to start?
 
I didn't start in dinghies, I learned to sail in a cruising boat. Started with 25' and a couple of books from the library. I did Day Skipper theory to find out about tides and navigation but competent crew I learned from books and chatting to folk, now the internet is a fantastic source of info too.

You could do worse than joining the SCS facebook group, loads of Scottish sailors there. Also there is more activity on the East coast now, it's been predominantly Clyde and West coast up to recently.

SCS also has a crewfinder section, so you might get a few trips on the Clyde if not the Forth.
 
I started at 11yrs with a clinker dinghy & nicked my father's silhouette at 12 years old ( see summer PBO) did not like it much, far too slow. Then had a Hornet at 16 & at 21 (1968) I had a Stella . Fortunately a Stella has great performance & I think that helps a lot. Buying an old dog will put anyone off sailing. I raced every weekend & was lucky that there was a big Stella fleet at Burnham. One learns to handle a yacht so much quicker when sailing round the cans. One is forced to do lots of tacks, sail on a run & do lots of gybes whereas when normally in cruising mode they might avoid them. One quickly finds out which bits of kit are not working correctly. By 1970 I was racing to Ostend
.
You do not need loads of training. I had none at all. Just read a few books, had a compass, an echo sounder, a chart & a Douglas protractor for navigation (Still have, them apart from the echo sounder!!!)

People worry about going out as a novice. Why? Just do it. Use a bit of common sense & the most important thing is that the boat is properly rigged & sails well ( Can you guess that I have no truck with slow old bilge keel "project boat", dogs) & you work out how it works it will look after you.

The OP knows how to sail a dinghy, so what is the issue? It is far easier because you will not capsize; but :-
For example:-If you have bodged bits, dodgy ropes & bits " that will do" then you will have bother. The OP must be able to pull the sails in properly, furl the jib, reef the main etc & change the baggy sails so the thing sails properly.
If he cannot sail to windward. Start the engine & know it will work, have ropes properly set (no frayed ends etc) kicking strap that works & cleats that are working. Winches that are serviced & pawls that are not jammed etc etc. Then he is on a loser to start with.
It is no different to a dinghy. Get the boat working right & then one can concentrate on other things like eyeball navigation (difficult stuff comes later) & be confident that one can get where one wants to go.
 
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