New (England) restrictions impact on sailing?

[SimonFa]

I hope the RYA and industry groups are lobbying like mad.

They want people to keep working where possible so no reason why marinas shouldn't stay open and boatyard crews continue their work. Owners working on their boats on the hard are naturally social distanced anyway and when it comes to anti-fouling Covid is the least of our worries

One reason we weren't allowed in to marinas last time was the strict no travel policy. When they lifted that for exercise there was no reason why we couldn't go to marinas.

 

[Hallberg-Rassy]

How does it work financially?

If they stay open, do the owners pay wages; and if they shut, does the government pay?

Anyone raising the issue of not paying while services are not being provided?

Any marinas offering discounts yet?

Or are they taking full monthly charges, and have the government paying the wages? If so, I can start to understand their motivations.

 

[duncan99210]

I’ve had an email from the marina where my boat is on one of their swinging moorings. Essentially, the normal yard operations will be continuing, including lift outs and maintenance. No overnight visitors, loo block closed and an implied stay away policy “you take care of yourselves and we’ll take care of your boat”.
The other thing I’ve been watching is for guidance from government on grassroots sport. I’m secretary of a gig club and we’ve been rowing since late August under some restrictions to limit people mixing. That looks likely to stop but we still have no firm guidance from either British Rowing or the Cornish Pilot Gig Association. Irritating as I don’t want to help put a stop to things or set things up to continue only to have the rules change again.

 

[Tomahawk]

Recreation outdoors - what else is it?

I was being slated by all and sumdry for that very idea back in spring.

 

[st599]

I’ve had an email from the marina where my boat is on one of their swinging moorings. Essentially, the normal yard operations will be continuing, including lift outs and maintenance. No overnight visitors, loo block closed and an implied stay away policy “you take care of yourselves and we’ll take care of your boat”.
The other thing I’ve been watching is for guidance from government on grassroots sport. I’m secretary of a gig club and we’ve been rowing since late August under some restrictions to limit people mixing. That looks likely to stop but we still have no firm guidance from either British Rowing or the Cornish Pilot Gig Association. Irritating as I don’t want to help put a stop to things or set things up to continue only to have the rules change again.

You won't get firm guidance until after the vote on Wednesday, the amendments and last minute concessions need to be weighed up.

 

[Lucky Duck]

You won't get firm guidance until after the vote on Wednesday, the amendments and last minute concessions need to be weighed up.

I remember the confusion last time around only too well, at one point it was reported that a marina was permitting people to be onboard but at first refused to open the lock gates.

Hopefully that was down to the various authorities and commercial enterprises having furloughed their staff and being caught off guard by the relaxation of restrictions.

 

[bluerm166]

I wrote that and am sorry the context wasn't sufficiently clear to you, so that you have cut and pasted it in a misleading way.

I was writing in defence of schools remaining open. Someone else was saying schools should close because some teachers have caring responsibilities for vulnerable people. I said by that logic, we should close the entire country and lock ourselves at home. Remove all risk of Covid. I hope that's cleared it up.

Well,if you stopped flinging such wild unqualified punches ' Most teachers, like most people of working age, are near-zero risk themselves. They are not "cannon fodder" any more than doctors/nurses/supermarket workers, none of whom showed greater fatality or susceptibility through the first lockdown. ' your arguments would be better received and followed.

 

[Blue Sunray]

Well,if you stopped flinging such wild unqualified punches ' Most teachers, like most people of working age, are near-zero risk themselves. They are not "cannon fodder" any more than doctors/nurses/supermarket workers, none of whom showed greater fatality or susceptibility through the first lockdown. ' your arguments would be better received and followed.

Just put him on ignore, it's not as if he's adding value.

 

[Hallberg-Rassy]

I hope the RYA and industry groups are lobbying like mad.

They want people to keep working where possible so no reason why marinas shouldn't stay open and boatyard crews continue their work.

Unfortunately they aren't it seems. They gone from charging too much for services, to wanting to charge for doing nothing (not even pay for staff).

Personally, I won't be paying if I can't be doing maintenance, which is what I'm paying for. Don't need their loos either.

Why can I work on a construction site but not in a boat yard? What's the difference? Less people, further apart in a yard. Often I or just one or two others would have it to ourselves.

 

[RJJ]

Well,if you stopped flinging such wild unqualified punches ' Most teachers, like most people of working age, are near-zero risk themselves.

Ok, let me qualify that.



Death rate <1/1000 for all age groups up to age 69 (that's what I would call "near-zero"; what would you call "near-zero"?). From the chart, it looks as though the under 50s are around 1 in 10,000, but the bar's so small you can't really read it.
Average age of Covid death is 82.4
Under 50s who get infected lose less than one Quality-Adjusted Life DAY. [Normally in healthcare policymakers deal in Quality-Adjusted Life Years].


Coronavirus risk for older people: the updated picture | Discover | Age UK
What Is Your Risk Of Dying From Covid-19?

Is that still too wild an assertion for you? or have I now qualified it?

Just put him on ignore, it's not as if he's adding value.

Yes, with open minds like yours we're sure to find the best way through this.

I'd ask you please to drop the ad hominems.

 

[Hallberg-Rassy]

Death rate <1/1000 for all age groups up to age 69 (that's what I would call "near-zero")

Which I'm guessing is less than dying a home due to some DIY accident? (In the UK, almost 6,000 people die every year in home accidents; Covid less than 1,000. 200 if only those with no underlying conditions).

While culling off the over 75s just to create a fire break to stop covid spreading might be a step to far, wouldn't just isolating them have worked and saved the economy?

The joke is in my case, I'd have been 300% more likely to die in a road accident getting to my boat than from Covid-19, and yet the government demanded I commute daily to visit it instead, and disallowed just staying put.

For the sake of your critics, is that not irrational enough?

Healthy under-50s are more likely to die from a car accident or an injury than Covid-19, leading statistician says

Sir David Spiegelhalter said 959 out of 18million under-50s had died from Covid​

Cambridge University statistician said over 80% had underlying health problems​

He claims under-40s were more likely to die in car accident than by coronavirus​

And for under-25s, the risk was lower than falling victim to the flu or pneumonia​

 

[Stork_III]

I’ve had an email from the marina where my boat is on one of their swinging moorings. Essentially, the normal yard operations will be continuing, including lift outs and maintenance. No overnight visitors, loo block closed and an implied stay away policy “you take care of yourselves and we’ll take care of your boat”.
The other thing I’ve been watching is for guidance from government on grassroots sport. I’m secretary of a gig club and we’ve been rowing since late August under some restrictions to limit people mixing. That looks likely to stop but we still have no firm guidance from either British Rowing or the Cornish Pilot Gig Association. Irritating as I don’t want to help put a stop to things or set things up to continue only to have the rules change again.

If you can row the Gig with two people, you are good to go, if not stay at home.

 

[RJJ]

Which I'm guessing is less than dying a home due to some DIY accident? (In the UK, almost 6,000 people die every year in home accidents; Covid less than 1,000, 200 if only those with no underlying conditions).

While culling off the over 75s just to create a fire break to stop covid spreading might be a step to far, wouldn't just isolating them have worked and saved the economy?

The joke is in my case, I'd have been 300% more likely to die in a road accident getting to my boat than from Covid-19, and yet the government demanded I commute daily to visit it instead, and disallowed just staying put.

For the sake of your critics, is that not irrational enough?

Thanks. Yes exactly, "focused protection" which, per the much earlier exchange which has some of our friends so riled-up, would also imply (in my opinion) paid time-off for those with unavoidable caring responsibilities for someone actually at risk.

We could also drill down into the data for the various age groups; if you take out those with known and identifiable disabilities and pre-existing conditions (obesity, heart disease, diabetes or whatever they are), you get an even more stark result. So protect those people also; let the rest of us get back to work, life and living.

If I remember correctly, it's below the 40-year-old point where (if otherwise healthy) you're more likely to get struck by lightning twice than to die of Covid. But perhaps that's a wild unqualified observation.

 

[atol]

Thanks. Yes exactly, "focused protection" which, per the much earlier exchange which has some of our friends so riled-up, would also imply (in my opinion) paid time-off for those with unavoidable caring responsibilities for someone actually at risk.

We could also drill down into the data for the various age groups; if you take out those with known and identifiable disabilities and pre-existing conditions (obesity, heart disease, diabetes or whatever they are), you get an even more stark result. So protect those people also; let the rest of us get back to work, life and living.

If I remember correctly, it's below the 40-year-old point where (if otherwise healthy) you're more likely to get struck by lightning twice than to die of Covid. But perhaps that's a wild unqualified observation.

how does that "focused protection work" for vulnerable people who co- habit with children and/or a partner and share a closed space?

 

[pandroid]

Personally, I won't be paying if I can't be doing maintenance, which is what I'm paying for. Don't need their loos either.

Why can I work on a construction site but not in a boat yard? What's the difference? Less people, further apart in a yard. Often I or just one or two others would have it to ourselves.

Hallberg-Rassy, I'm a bit worried you might be masquerading under false pretences. No one who owns a Hallberg-Rassy actually works on their boat.
(Q: How many Hallberg-Rassy owners does it take to fix the engine? A: Two. One to mix the G&Ts and one to call the Volvo engineer).

 

[SaltIre]

Hallberg-Rassy, I'm a bit worried you might be masquerading under false pretences. No one who owns a Hallberg-Rassy actually works on their boat.
(Q: How many Hallberg-Rassy owners does it take to fix the engine? A: Two. One to mix the G&Ts and one to call the Volvo engineer).

One Hallberg-Rassy owner could tow the other Hallberg-Rassy owner's broken down boat to the Volvo engineer while both sip a G&T - and call it a convoy!

 

[Hallberg-Rassy]

how does that "focused protection work" for vulnerable people who co- habit with children and/or a partner and share a closed space?

If the vulnerable person themselves cannot be quarantined, the obvious first choice, I would say that that particular entire family would be isolated as one.

 

[atol]

If the vulnerable person themselves cannot be quarantinded, the obvious first choice, I would say that that particular entire family would be isolated as one.

so assuming none can work from home,and the enclosed space only has limited space,making individual isolation impossible who supports them if ineligble for income support due to having a slightly more than£6000 in savings?
and for how long and how much?

 

[Blue Sunray]

so assuming none can work from home,and the enclosed space only has limited space,making individual isolation impossible who supports them if ineligble for income support due to having a slightly more than£6000 in savings?
and for how long and how much?

Good lord man, its not hard. If it's that bad, they might have to offload some shares, and/or pop down to the family place in the country for the duration.

 

[atol]

Good lord man, its not hard. If it's that bad, they might have to offload some shares, and/or pop down to the family place in the country for the duration.

6k in savings not 60k and i'm sure there are many JAM families in this situation who's parents are isolating already so poping off to the country estate is not an option,plus there are travel restrictions etc