Moody 376 vs bavaria 37

[Just_sayin']

Seems obvious to me. A new Moody costs more than a new Bavaria, and for them, would have been the more desirable boat. But they couldn't afford one, and rather than take the risk of an older boat (albeit a Moody), they bought a Bavaria. Wouldn't have stopped them dreaming of a Moody, and being happy to say so.

Of course if you don't agree with the premise that the Moody is a better boat, you wouldn't understand.

And for what it's worth, I personally have never wanted a Moody.

Excellent.

Well another Bavaria has just backed in behind us. After breakfast we'll pop over to see how he is. Probably a bit depressed. What's the Spanish for 'why did you buy a Bavaria instead of a Moody?'

 

[Tranona]

Seems obvious to me. A new Moody costs more than a new Bavaria, and for them, would have been the more desirable boat. But they couldn't afford one, and rather than take the risk of an older boat (albeit a Moody), they bought a Bavaria. Wouldn't have stopped them dreaming of a Moody, and being happy to say so.

Of course if you don't agree with the premise that the Moody is a better boat, you wouldn't understand.

And for what it's worth, I personally have never wanted a Moody.

It is not quite as simple as that if you look at post #28. by the time Ben/Bav/Jen became popular in the late 1990's, Moodys and Westerlys etc had just become poor value. Prices had increased by much more than inflation - the 376 was £57k in 1987. If it had gone up in line with inflation the equivalent in 2001 would have been £84k - but it was not - nearer £110k for the equivalent when a Bavaria was £70k.

I have concentrated on 2001 because that was the watershed period when Moody saw what Bavaria were doing and decided to get out of the smaller (sub 45') market. The perceived additional quality and features just did not justify the 40% price premium.

Whatever the merits of the Moody when it was new does not translate into high values now. There are more 37/376 on the market now than in the past at widely varying asking prices reflecting the fact that they are getting on for 30 years old and have often led a hard life.

Leaving aside the different characteristics of the boats the choice if you want to spend £50-60k on a 37' cruiser is between a 30 year old boat that will inevitably need significant expenditure or one half its age with more modern equipment and life left in it.

 

[silver-fox]

Funny.

A guy posts "Here in Leixeos, in common with most marinas there are just 2 Moodies and maybe 12 Bavs. Strange that many Bav liveaboards we've met say "I wish we had a Moody" but, I've never heard anyone say the opposite' and you accuse me of starting a poll.

Very simple.

Three of us are delivering our boats down to the SOF. Same old, same old. We're bored. Amongst other things we read forums. We smell BS. We don't see passion. Just made up 'facts'

We wonder why.

From now on it's just a diversion to sniff out :nonchalance: the BS.

OK with you?

If so, please give us another made up fact and we'll look into that too.

Oh right, so you are bored - and on a mission as self appointed BS police. Well that all of us bored now. So I'll leave you to your official policing duties. Ciao.

 

[Just_sayin']

Kinda struck a nerve here we think.

Did you know that of the 82 boats in our current marina 83 of the owners wished they had arrived by car and 84 of them plan to ....

No?

Well it has to be true because we're passionate about our boats which makes it true.

Or we could just be making it up.

 

[Pete7]

Hmm, anyway back to the original question. I suppose the answer is a drive up to Scotland to see what the Moody is like. Either it will be too much work or a good option. The 7 yr old Bav on the other hand should be pretty much standard. Even if the Moody needed new sails and standing rigging that should be about £5000 - £6000. The Bavaria will need new sails in what 3 years perhaps if they are original which we have been made to a price, not quality, then standing rigging a few years later.

Worth having a look at the Owners Association web site too: http://www.moodyowners.net/moa_home.shtml

Pete

 

[gasdave]

So does anyone have any thoughts about a boat that has been out of commission for 3 or 4 years? What would you be looking for specifically? Obviously you would need to ensure a good mechanical assessment/survey and power system, check for signs of dampness/mold. Anything else apart from the points raised in previous posts?

In the end I think it all comes down to ones attitude to risk against background of available cash, time and confidence with DIY maintenance. My previous boat, although considerably smaller, was also 1987 and I did most of the maintenance and a fair bit of refurbishment on her myself so I'm not shy about that. But it did take a fair chunk of what would otherwise have been sailing time. The upside is that I did learn a lot. However at our present stage we want to sail more and refurbish less (maintenance is different and accepted as essential).

I know there is no right answer, but just interested to hear your more experienced opinions f

 

[Just_sayin']

Excellent.

Well another Bavaria has just backed in behind us. After breakfast we'll pop over to see how he is. Probably a bit depressed. What's the Spanish for 'why did you buy a Bavaria instead of a Moody?'

Well we met up in the Cap. Despite the Spanish flag he's Belgian. He thought that a Moody was a big, ugly, expensive German yacht until I told him that they were also an old English yacht. He couldn't understand why I thought that he should have bought one.

Hmm.

The search for Graham's Moody yearning Bavaria owners continues.

Graham COULD have been lying (sorry, confused) of course but why?

 

[sailorman]

Well we met up in the Cap. Despite the Spanish flag he's Belgian. He thought that a Moody was a big, ugly, expensive German yacht until I told him that they were also an old English yacht. He couldn't understand why I thought that he should have bought one.

Hmm.

The search for Graham's Moody yearning Bavaria owners continues.

Graham COULD have been lying (sorry, confused) of course but why?

He might be out with Seajet looking for a fight

 

[Pete7]

So does anyone have any thoughts about a boat that has been out of commission for 3 or 4 years? What would you be looking for specifically? Obviously you would need to ensure a good mechanical assessment/survey and power system, check for signs of dampness/mold. Anything else apart from the points raised in previous posts?

You can assume that the batteries are at the end of their life, but an ideal opportunity to replace the house bank and add a small engine start battery rather than have a large engine start battery.

Your nose will probably tell if the boat is damp but give the boat a chance if it has been sealed up for a bit. Were the sails folded and put away dry? worth opening them up to check and see the condition. Water tank will want a good flush with bleach. Diesel tank is under the companion way steps and can be tricky to inspect the contents. Perhaps ask over on the MOA Forum, they have a section for prospective owners.

Before you splash any cash perhaps make it known to the owner or broker you want to spend a whole day going through the boat top to bottom looking for warts and all but add that they aren't necessary a problem, you just need to know up front what needs doing now and what can wait to be done over the next few seasons. Ask for shore power to be available so the electrics can be checked. Think about how to run up the engine bucket of water to intake perhaps.

The difference in price over the Bav is were you will make the savings by choosing what to refurbish and what is okay. However, if you are cash rich but time poor perhaps the Bav would be the better option. Now if I could just sell my Moody 31 I could be taking a drive up to Rhu to look at an interesting 376 ;-)

Pete

 

[pvb]

Now if I could just sell my Moody 31 I could be taking a drive up to Rhu to look at an interesting 376 ;-)

Is your signature meant to be a link to a boat sale site? It doesn't seem to work.

 

[GrahamM376]

Well we met up in the Cap. Despite the Spanish flag he's Belgian. He thought that a Moody was a big, ugly, expensive German yacht until I told him that they were also an old English yacht. He couldn't understand why I thought that he should have bought one.

Hmm.

The search for Graham's Moody yearning Bavaria owners continues.

Graham COULD have been lying (sorry, confused) of course but why?

You must be very bored and seems you didn't notice the smiley at the end of my post? There are lots of us (me included) out there who have liked to buy a different boat but didn't have the money, but maybe you haven't noticed the difference in price over the years between a new Moody and a new mass produced boat? As Tranona says, Moody couldn't compete price wise with smaller boats so they stopped building anything IIRC under 45ft and later sold out to Premier.

 

[Pete7]

No not a link, she isn't for sale. Me just ideally dreaming on a Sunday morning. I will change the colour.

Pete

 

[GrahamM376]

So does anyone have any thoughts about a boat that has been out of commission for 3 or 4 years? What would you be looking for specifically? Obviously you would need to ensure a good mechanical assessment/survey and power system, check for signs of dampness/mold. Anything else apart from the points raised in previous posts?:

Check out the fuel system as well as the engine. If serious bug, the fuel tank is a real pain to access as it's built in behind the joinery and the access hatch is under the galley worktop. Some had a problem with the mast support in the bilge compressing, simple enough to cut out and rebuild. At that age, underwater through hulls should be replaced if not already done, a days work.

 

[iain789]

Eight years ago I had the same dilemma. Faced with a finite budget, get a nearly new Bavaria or a much older more traditional boat. I wanted to go sailing, not spend time doing up an old boat and making sure it was seaworthy, so I went for the Bavaria, and I have not regretted it once (except I wish I had got a bigger one, but that's always the case). Very little has gone wrong with it in my time owning it, and apart from a new genoa, and routine maintenance and upgrades it has cost me remarkably little. Yes, it slams a bit in head seas, and yes it can move around a bit when in more challenging conditions, and yes it likes to be reefed early. None of these things has stopped me from a good number of extended cruises in the Western Isles, including up to Orkney this year, and I have never been worried that the boat would let me down.

A few years I was in the Lofoten Islands in Northern Norway, and was struck by the number of locally owned Bavarias that I saw there. Hardly a warm water Mediterranean cruising area!

Buying a boat is something that is done with the heart, not the head. There can be little economic justification for boat purchase, so you must go with what your heart tells you. There is little to be gained by asking the question in forums such as this, because most boat owners will simply seek to rationalise and defend they choice that they have made. They love their own boat, and want the world to know about it! Good luck with whatever you choose, but if you want to sail, get a newish boat.

 

[pvb]

Earlier in the year I sold my beloved Hallberg-Rassy. I'd owned it for 19 years, it was solid and sturdy and seaworthy. But I was spending increased amounts of my time mending things rather than enjoying the boat, so I sold it. Now, I have a new AWB on order. I know it won't feel the same at sea as the long-keel HR, but I also know I won't have to spend much time or money fixing things, for a few years at least. Boat choices reflect the owner's priorities, and change as you go through life.

 

[pvb]

Incidentally, I have just read that Hanse have overtaken Bavaria as the N°1 German leisure boat group. This is in terms of turnover, not in the number of boats.

Where did you read that? Most sources suggest Bavaria's turnover is around €250 million, and Hanse Group around €80 million.

 

[GrahamM376]

Where did you read that? Most sources suggest Bavaria's turnover is around €250 million, and Hanse Group around €80 million.

Hanse figures seem to vary. In 2008 they issued a press release quoting 135m euro turnover whereas in 2010 when Aurelius became the major shareholder turnover was quoted as 73.2m. Various sources say they are worlds 3rd largest builder as a group.

 

[pvb]

Hanse figures seem to vary. In 2008 they issued a press release quoting 135m euro turnover whereas in 2010 when Aurelius became the major shareholder turnover was quoted as 73.2m. Various sources say they are worlds 3rd largest builder as a group.

That's what I thought - they certainly aren't bigger than Bavaria!

 

[jimi]

THe other thing to take account of is how many are usually on board, the Moody's tend to have less bunks whereas the Bavarias etc tend to have a few more. The upside of less bunks is more stowage and galley space.

All depends what you want, I would'nt swing one way or the other based on make or age but would base the decision on whether the configuration suits you .. and , most of all, whether you like the boat.

 

[Tranona]

THe other thing to take account of is how many are usually on board, the Moody's tend to have less bunks whereas the Bavarias etc tend to have a few more. The upside of less bunks is more stowage and galley space.

All depends what you want, I would'nt swing one way or the other based on make or age but would base the decision on whether the configuration suits you .. and , most of all, whether you like the boat.

Not sure that is the case in the two boats under discussion here. One of the big selling features of the Moody is the number of berths. Two double cabins, double and single in saloon and single passage berth - more than the Bavaria 2 cabin. The Moody also squeezes in 2 loos! The "competitor" centre cockpit Bavaria (38 Ocean) has one less berth, bigger galley and more storage space. Most sub 40' Bavarias are offered with choice of cabin layouts.