MiToS re-built/fit- versilcraft Mystery43

[BartW]

good to see that the new constructions are starting

is this the best plywood you can get there ?
last winter I have learned that a good quality marine plywood is solid and heavy; don't know whats available in Greece though.

have a nice and well deserved holliday (?) break (?)
good that you're used to some heat,
the only thing I remember from Crete (from my teenager years) is that it can be extremely hot over there

 

[vas]

good to see that the new constructions are starting

is this the best plywood you can get there ?
last winter I have learned that a good quality marine plywood is solid and heavy; don't know whats available in Greece though.

yes Bart, that's the best I can get and the one used by all boatyards and repair places around. It's bloody heavy stuff takes two of us a great trouble to bring a sheet up to the aft deck via the ladder

have a nice and well deserved holliday (?) break (?)
good that you're used to some heat,
the only thing I remember from Crete (from my teenager years) is that it can be extremely hot over there

thanks it's almost like a holiday,
"parked" the kids at their grandparents and cousins in Hersonissos/Hrakleion since the begining of August and came to see the relatives, relax a bit and bring them back home to Volos next week (no they're not happy that they'll be back and school starts but that's expected )

Sure are used to the heat, but fortunately meltemi winds started (late this year I must admit) so it's hot sunny but cooler with a steady F5+ N/NW down here. Going camping on the south of Crete tonight at the Libyan sea back on civilisation tomorrow

@Rafiki: trying my best with raki (noone should really drink ouzo in Crete it's like a blasphemy..., I think we went through that in another thread last month) over the last few days. You'll be pleased to hear that I'm almost through half a litre of the stuff already (OK a pint in two evenings in your speak)!

cheers

V.

 

[rafiki_]

yes Bart, that's the best I can get and the one used by all boatyards and repair places around. It's bloody heavy stuff takes two of us a great trouble to bring a sheet up to the aft deck via the ladder



thanks it's almost like a holiday,
"parked" the kids at their grandparents and cousins in Hersonissos/Hrakleion since the begining of August and came to see the relatives, relax a bit and bring them back home to Volos next week (no they're not happy that they'll be back and school starts but that's expected )

Sure are used to the heat, but fortunately meltemi winds started (late this year I must admit) so it's hot sunny but cooler with a steady F5+ N/NW down here. Going camping on the south of Crete tonight at the Libyan sea back on civilisation tomorrow

@Rafiki: trying my best with raki (noone should really drink ouzo in Crete it's like a blasphemy..., I thing we went through that in another thread last month) over the last few days. You'll be pleased to hear that I'm almost through half a litre of the stuff already (OK a pint in two evenings in your speak)!

cheers

V.

Apologies for the blasphemy, but Ouzo was just the perfect drink when we were in Crete. Really refreshing, a bit like a GT in India

Camping sounds a challenge. What about the mossies?

 

[Swordfish]

Crete

Hello V,

I note you are enjoying your time in Crete, we have been there many times, it's a wondful Island, but I never quite liked the raki. Would it be good for cleaning you paint brushes when you get back to the boat !!

 

[vas]

Camping sounds a challenge. What about the mossies?

not many around, actually after 4days here, your question got me thinking of their existance. Being dry and windy means that there're none around at this time. Should be ok, will report on Fri when I'm back.

Hello V,

I note you are enjoying your time in Crete, we have been there many times, it's a wondful Island, but I never quite liked the raki. Would it be good for cleaning you paint brushes when you get back to the boat !!

if the relatives and specially father in law hears that he wont be at all happy

nah, I enjoy the stuff, much more than ouzo! No hangover the day after (ok, assuming reasonable quantites been consumed!)

There are alternative uses for raki, one being embrocation (not sure that came from a xlator and I've never heard this word before, hope it's right...) agent, also cooking ingredient and others, let's not turn it into a recipe thread...

I'll stick to white spirit for my brushes if you don't mind

cheers

V.

 

[vas]

whohoo! changed my username at last!

at last my username was changed from virtuvas to the usual (for me...) vas!
thanks admins

V.

 

[rafiki_]

at last my username was changed from virtuvas to the usual (for me...) vas!
thanks admins

V.

Can we stick with V? Some of us here are simple folk.

 

[vas]

@rafiki
survived Crete, no mossies down south, 0% humidity, a brilliant beach I've never been before bleeding hot, and impossible to walk barefoot from 11-6 (dark thin pebbles on a s/w facing beach...)

stick to V, no problems, it's fun having foreigners call me in my full name, and since this is only a forum, Vs fine

Apologies for the lack of image serving over the last few days, work server has its fit, works fine, leave the office few hours later is dead, hope I fixed it this time, we shall see.

One pic I didn't post of the sundeck fully sanded (except for the lower 20cm that will be replaced soon) and no exaggeration 400+ holes filled with epoxy and sanded once, refilled if not smooth to be sanded again over the w/e The idea is to get it as smooth as possible now before getting the two full coats of epoxy on later in the month.

and since I did some work yesterday the stripped stbrd side of the deck. Will finish it off tonight and start fitting new ply over the w/e. Still need to decide on the studs that will hold the top to the bottom (superstructure/sundeck vs the hull top/ending/deck). Looks like 6 or 8mm ss bolt should be fine.

Aiming to finish with the deck replacement work by the end of next week and before I leave for a week for work

cheers

V.

 

[vas]

few more pics of the process.

Note the detail on joining the ply sheets on the deck. The top layer of the original ply with the teak and sika is missing (er, was nicely stuck to the layer of grp put on top of it 20yrs ago and due to the delamination decided to stick there and not with its own folk...)

and closeup:

The following 4 pics show the way (and the state) the deck joins with the superstructure. A beam on the ending of the deck, another at the superstructure, sandwiched between them the deck ply and all held in place with 160mm long bolts (thought it was studs but nope) 8mm dia from what looks like ss. The ones in port side are all corroded through, the stbrd side had 2 still holding. Each side had 5 of them.
Plan is to drill new holes and fit 6 on each side (I'm talking about the bow cabin, obviously there's going to be more on the way aft...) and another 5 on the bow lip.

this is one of the stbrd bolts that's still functioning

and here's an artistic photo taken last night looking at the city lights from the 16-18mm gap between deck and superstructure (it took me 4 shots with my mobile phone camera to get this one!)

and this is the way the ending beam on the superstructure looks from outside. Notice the remains of black paint, makes me think that originally this iroco piece was actually the edging of the teak deck and made vertical 50mm approx ending painted black. The rest of the superstructure was overhanging by 10-15mm and painted white. Have to find a way to recreate this and possibly fit small bluish leds liting (or is it lighting?) the deck.

Last photo is the finished article:

Some stats (it was easy this time..) Took me 7h alone to strip the deck and semiprepare the beams and another 5h myself + the carpenter to finish off the job this morning: 17manhours. Doubt I'll bother counting and thinking about it overall


Got to find a way to secure the railings again before I go any further as I've removed the first 4 bollards (doubt that's the right word... how do you call them anyway?) and things are getting a bit hairy. Wouldn't like to end up diving from 4m to the rough .

cheers

V.

 

[rafiki_]

Good progress V. I think you mean stanchions for the guard rail uprights? Interesting detail on the carpentry. It amazes me that builders use anything other than stainless steel fixings on boats. I have to re-fix the boarding ladder on Rafiki. The idiots used std screws, and of course they have a limited life, maybe just about covering the warranty period. Madness!

 

[vas]

thanks rafiki, ti's stanchions!

Right then, stanchions are supported on some conical alloy fittings, very cleverly designed with three concealed 6mm in dia, 25mm long ss screws (every 120deg) with allen heads clamping the stanchions in place (and enabling small tilting in relation to the deck slope). A fourth slanted hole is to drain any water reaching the hollow section.
These conical supports are bolted with a M10 ss bolt to the deck (through also a 40mm block of wood bridging the gap between the cross members)

I've now reached a point that it's dangerous to remove more deck and matching stanchion supports as I can see an accident coming...
So today bought new 8mm concealed ss screws, opened up the holes (handy way of getting rid of solidly stuck screws with mashed/fckedup allen heads ), new threads and ready to temp fit to support the guard rail.

Since the guardrails and the stanchion assembly bits are all painted silvery/allu colour at some point, I had a go at restoring them to original ally colour planning to polish them all with the two paste job thing.
Shock horror, under the paint (of course painted with a brush on the spot! ) there's a nice carmin RED primer ffs!
Under the primer it's allright plain aluminium, phew!
BUT the things have been hammered a bit over the years and before the priming, hence sanding with 80grit paper unfortunately leaves a few red spots

Tempted to just give them away to professionals to polish them and be done with, unless someone has a suggestion for a method that's going to create a decent result. Mind working in my garage and there's fcking dust everywhere, so not keen on doing it in a closed space, got to move my black&decker bench to the craft and do it there. If I find a decent method I may invest in a proper polishing tool (static secured in the bench most likely...)

Photos of the thing, brush painted and sanded and slightly polished. Real mess, hardly worth my effort tbh

both:

the untreated article:

treated one, hardly any difference! Bear in mind that I've only used the rough paste on the rough cloth (need to get another drill assembly to secure the fine cloth on and do that as well):

concealed screws fitted, the hole in the middle is the drain one:

(typically the 4th slanted hole is sealed with white silicone on a few of the cones...)

Cheers

V.

 

[rafiki_]

Vas, this again looks like a mission for you. Is there a chemical process you can use for removing the old paint? I'm not sure if something like Nitromors would do the trick? Failing that a metal treatment company that cleans material before plating/finishing?

 

[vas]

Vas, this again looks like a mission for you. Is there a chemical process you can use for removing the old paint? I'm not sure if something like Nitromors would do the trick? Failing that a metal treatment company that cleans material before plating/finishing?

nice one rafiki!

I'd forgoten I'd bought a can of Nitromors back in Dec thinking of using it to strip the paint off the exterior (how silly me...) Quickly realised that it was not going to work and kept the can onboard.
Tried it on one of these supports, looks like I need a series of coats to get it going...

HOWEVER, it looks like it does work on the actual tubing of the railings and the stanchions themselves! Good!

So looks like I'll drop half a dozen stanchion supports to the guys that did the plating/polishing of my light fixtures on Monday and see how they get on with polishing them. Probably NOT plating, just polish. If it's good, I'll get them the rest and be done with

---

Another two days of work and I replaced the next 2.45m bit of stbrd side deck up to engine vent:

Not vastly different from the previous bit BUT it's getting narrower hence more difficult to work and I had to remove completely the railing and refit it temporarily for the deck fitting. This section is 650mm wide and after the engine vent is going down to around 500mm. I'll setup some scarfolding outside to have safe access to the working area.

I'm going down from 31mm to 15+7mm for the teak that I'll lay in spring. Should calculate the weight reduction at some point...

And the finished article:

Thing is that the next 3.5m or so left to the aft deck are a hell of a job:
First 1m stbrd side I have practically no access from inside as it's helm/el.panel various other bits.
Similarly port side is the galley, cupboards, fridge, etc.
Plus an elevated floor and the fuel tanks underneath to complete the mess!

Still struggling to find a way of continuing the same process which is replacing all 3 layers of old deck, clearing up the area between the two beams the deck end one and the superstructure base on top of it, sandwich and glue the new 15mm ply properly and add M8 bolts 160mm long through the lot at 200-300mm intervals.

Further aft on the salon area, same process means that I'll be up and down through the lazarette to the engine room AND I'll have to disassemble all salon furniture, cupboards on stbrd side and sofa on port Niiiice....
Will probably double the time needed for it (at least)

Well, got a week off in Prague and on my return I should devise a way of continuing.
Obviously any ideas welcomed!

cheers

V.

 

[rafiki_]

Sorry Vas, you're on your own with this. Best offer I can give is to go to Prague for you, giving you an extra week on the boat

 

[vas]

S Rory Vas, you're on your own with this. Best offer I can give is to go to Prague for you, giving you an extra week on the boat

Nah, I'll take Prague myself and over a few drinks I'm sure I'll find a way to do it. It's good to be "distanced" from a difficult problem you know

V.

 

[rafiki_]

Nah, I'll take Prague myself and over a few drinks I'm sure I'll find a way to do it. It's good to be "distanced" from a difficult problem you know

V.

Shame, never been to Prague. I hear the beer is good. Have a great time.

 

[Hardmy]

Prague

Hey Vas!

Just wanted to say that I am following your big reconstruction project with great interest! As an "office rat" and averagely gifted in manual applications, I never would have dared to start any project of this kind. If you were to do it again, would still have bought a wooden hull?

BTW, I live partly in Prague and may be there this week-end. You won't only find the best beer in the world. Please shout, should you need some local advice or help!

All the best,
Hardmy

 

[vas]

@rafiki: sorry, not been there myself either and looking forward to it!

@hardmy: re your Q, mostlikely I'd get a 30-40yo boat as hard cash I'm willing to spend is low for anything younger for the 43-45ft mobo market.
Don't confuse effort spent to real money though, as if I was to evaluate my labour cost would be horrendous, but I don't mind, as a mater of fact I very much enjoy it (even at this stage) Satisfaction will be much higher once I get into the interior rebuilt in late autumn. Just to give you an idea, the alternatives were GRP hull with timber superstructure (again italian late seventies Italcrafts). Wood is a nice material, if you understand it you can use it and do v.nice things with it, plus you don't get all the itching from working with glass fiber (got allergy on the thing!) and you skip the awful smells. Further, boat smells nice even after long periods of no use...

Anyway, arriving to Prague on Tue morning to meet a hundred+ colleagues from around the world as part of a international conference on the use of computers in teaching architecture. So will be based on Prague 6, Uni.
Everything is sorted bar accomodation, will be faxing one of the designated hotels in a while and hope they still honor the v.cheap conf. price
Else it's searching for sub 80euro/night accomodation, wont be too difficult I guess, but the trick is not to stay too far away from the venue. Drinks/food is catered by the local hosts plus a boat tour/dinner on Fri eve.
Thanks for the offer!

This morning spend a couple of hours sanding all the 300+ points (holes from strips of timber secured on the deck originally, new screws, old failed filler on screwheads, various damages etc) on the sundeck touchedup with epoxy, and got a 3rd touchup session on around half of them. Hoping that after the next sanding session I'll only have a few dozen points to treat before I get my first full coat of epoxy on there

V.

 

[vas]

me again

back in Volos after a hectic 5 days in Prague...
Managed to drink beer, but didn't have much time for sightseeing, got to the city centre, walked about at night, walked along the Charles bridge a few times, so not complaining! Excellent city btw, really worth a week long visit

Now, back in track, slowly getting up to speed

Some info on alloy bits treatment and polishing (also posted on another thread, will just type it again, probably differently..)

Right, I spend a couple of hours chatting to the alledgedly best chromeplater/polisher (if thats a job description) in Greece. He recons that alloy options are few and only one's worth it:

he can chemically clean the items
he can brush them to remove kinks, bumps, et al

AFTER that I can:

1. chrome plate the items == NOT WORTH it, as the plating will eventually flake as long as 2-4years
2. laquer it (ditto)
3. anodize it == Prefered solution, ONLY CATCH is that if you do various batches of anodizing, you may end up with quite a variety of colours...

So, anodize it is (after his treatment cleaning and rubbing)

Still need to find a solution for the guard rails and upright bits of 25-30mm dia tubing though...


so, back at work, the day I came back it was belting down, checked and there are a few buckets of rainwater in the bilges. Mainly from not sealing properly the hull to the new plywood deck.
So, got a Sika 221 and did a few of these seems on the bow. Will need a couple more tubes to finish it but I'm not in a great hurry as the forecast is 30deg and full sunshine for the next 6-7days (wouldn't trust anything more tbh)

So, decided to tackle the rot patch on the stbrd side of the flybridge deck just where the cabling from the radar and antenna was coming down to the upper helm. Remember that in order to fit the arch, they added a 50X70mm block of wood bolted to the side panel and the arch bolted on that. Needless to say, water was passing under this block, rotting the deck ply.

Anyway, patch is 1200mmX180mm slightly curved, took me 3h this morning to cut (at 45degrees), clean and prepare the surfaces for the new piece.

Look at this view, would be interesting to have skylights on the saloon ceiling, wouldn't it?
JFM, I suggest that should be an option for Match 3

Should be put in place and sealed tomorrow by lunchtime.

Monday onwards, I shall be tackling the rest of the deck (but will take it easy, first do the port side bit and then move to the difficult ones

cheers

V.

 

[rafiki_]

Welcome back Vas, have missed your updates. Good to hear that our rain has made it as far south as Greece.

It has started to go cold here. Heating on at home: