lazyjacks and singlehand sailing

[syscode]

Hiyas,

It seems lazyjacks are both a necessity for safe and easy dropping of main sail - and a curse when lifting the main since battens get stuck in the lazyjacks lines.

I noticed some people fold the lazyjacks lines for lifting the main sail. however that seems like a solution for 2 people or a single in a relatively fair weather.

Wondering how people who sail alone might solve the possible problem of battens getting caught in lazyjacks.. (other than simply dropping the sail a bit and rebooting the lift..)

Cheers!

 

[Gixer]

I guess it depends on the size of the main.

I found with mine I had to be precise when raising otherwise they would snag and that they got in the way of the shape unless I slackened them off. When launching earlier this year I forgot to put them back on and now don't think I'll bother. I find it easier to raise the sail and when I drop it, it lands all over the coach roof but by standing in the companionway I can get a sail tie around it in seconds.

Like I said I only have a 27f yacht with not a massive main.

 

[fredrussell]

How much the battens catch on them depends quite a bit on how flush batten pockets are on/with the leech. My new sail has completely flush batten ends and hoists ‘cleanly’ without catching lazy jacks.

 

[Wing Mark]

I've only put the main up a few times so far, but no real problem with the lazyjacks and stack pack.
I just watch the sail as it goes up and push the boom to keep the battens out of the lines when needed.
Like hoisting a dinghy main in shifty breeze, it maybe helps to pull fast when things are lined up right with the wind?
And wait a mo, when they're not?

 

[V1701]

I made my own that fold easily out of the way when not needed, video here. My preference though is to use autohelm to keep head to wind and go to the mast as opposed to trying to do it all from the cockpit...

 

[awol]

Lazy jacks and spinnaker socks are the work of the devil! Both solutions to problems that don't exist and instead create there own problems.

 

[bikedaft]

i put a downhaul on the head of the main, led back to cockpit via block at bottom of mast, can dip the main by a few inches when battens catch. but pulling main up (from cockpit) keep an eye on it and usually avoid the issue

(singlehanding)

 

[johnalison]

On my 10m boat I have a routine for hoisting the main. I stand astride the tiller and point the boat into the wind, with the motor driving us ahead at idling speed. I have two hands free and use them to raise the main steadily, stopping if the boat veers or the wind changes. Until I have passed the lazyjacks I have the mainsheet tight in the central position. After passing the lazyjacks I free the sheet and raise the sail as fast as I can. In this way I seldom snag the lazyjacks but it is not hard to drop the main a few inches to clear it. This may not work for all boats but it works for me.

 

[TLouth7]

I don't have any. My tricks are:

1. Raise and lower the mainsail on the mooring or pontoon where I am not in a rush or having to keep an eye out. I realise this is not an option for everybody, though in lots of places you could pick up a random mooring or stop on a hammerhead for 5 minutes to do it.

2. I often yank on the reefing lines as I drop the sail to keep it under control. The amount of sail remaining above the second reef is small enough to easily grab and stick a tie around. It takes ten seconds to pull the reefing lines back through ready for the next hoist, and as a bonus you don't have loops of reefing line dangling from the boom to snag on winches and crew.

So if your boat doesn't have any I would recommend trying it out and seeing what works for you before you fit them.

 

[bikedaft]

I move the boom (and lazyjacks!) about as well, to avoid entrapment.

 

[roaringgirl]

Have a look at the different ways that lazy-jacks can be threaded. I used to have lots of problems with snagging battens on the way up, mostly cured by copying the installation on my neighbour's lagoon 450.

20201215_125406

 

[dunedin]

Lazy jacks and spinnaker socks are the work of the devil! Both solutions to problems that don't exist and instead create there own problems.

So says the man with a relatively small mainsail. I sailed my 38 foot boat once without lazyjacks and vowed never again.

I have hoisted our fully battened mainsail single handed at least 300 times in the past couple of years. The lazy jacks are permanently set and never been adjusted in these 2 years.
Generally hoist when motoring gently to windward under autopilot - just look up and pull up when sail is blowing between the lazy jacks. Have an electric halyard winch which helps beyond second spreader, but by then battens all clear.
Have also hoisted under sail with jib fully sheeted in - requires a bit more patience.
Generally hoists first time over 95% of time - if rushing it may need to ease halyard 6 inches and do again - no hassle.
Sail hoisted and dropped entirely from the cockpit - which helps if need to adjust course slightly for fluky winds, as well as avoiding any other boats around.

On many occasions have been very grateful for permanent lazyjacks - 4-5 occasions have suddenly and unexpectedly been in 30-40 knot squalls (comes with the territory), when been able to simply choose the moment, round up to close hauled and blow the halyard. Then put the kettle on.
So personally 100% satisfied with lazy jacks and never adjust them - indeed to reduce rope tapping overnight, our lazy jacks are permanently attached to the upper spreaders, with the only adjustment being the knots attaching to the stack pack.

 

[johnalison]

So says the man with a relatively small mainsail. I sailed my 38 foot boat once without lazyjacks and vowed never again.

I have hoisted our fully battened mainsail single handed at least 300 times in the past couple of years. The lazy jacks are permanently set and never been adjusted in these 2 years.
Generally hoist when motoring gently to windward under autopilot - just look up and pull up when sail is blowing between the lazy jacks. Have an electric halyard winch which helps beyond second spreader, but by then battens all clear.
Have also hoisted under sail with jib fully sheeted in - requires a bit more patience.
Generally hoists first time over 95% of time - if rushing it may need to ease halyard 6 inches and do again - no hassle.
Sail hoisted and dropped entirely from the cockpit - which helps if need to adjust course slightly for fluky winds, as well as avoiding any other boats around.

On many occasions have been very grateful for permanent lazyjacks - 4-5 occasions have suddenly and unexpectedly been in 30-40 knot squalls (comes with the territory), when been able to simply choose the moment, round up to close hauled and blow the halyard. Then put the kettle on.
So personally 100% satisfied with lazy jacks and never adjust them - indeed to reduce rope tapping overnight, our lazy jacks are permanently attached to the upper spreaders, with the only adjustment being the knots attaching to the stack pack.

Your set-up is a bit different to mine, and I imagine that you have a wheel, making it hard to steer and hoist at the same time. My lazy jacks need to be stowed when the main cover is put on but deploying them only takes a few seconds and adjustment is not critical. The falls are kept away from the mast with bungee cords to quieten them when sailing. With your method you need to have the mainsheet loose to absorb wind changes, but, as is obvious, each boat is different and their owners even more so.

 

[Daydream believer]

I would suspect that your lazy jack setup could be improved. There is no need to put them away & one should be able to leave them set all season without adjustment.
I would suggest that the OP looks at the angle at which they are set. Mine come from the second spreader (31 ft boat 28M2 sail) & are rigged such that the main part of them is in the lower quadrant. In other words the falls of the lines do not go far up the mast. Only the tallest one does. Because the lower ones are rigged as they are it means that the top line is always close ( relatively) to the mast.
This means that by the time the sail is 1/3 the way up the mast much of it has cleared the lazy jacks & the rest just follows. When dropping one only needs the bottom 1/3 to catch the sail to get it into the bag so it is not an issue. So try experimenting by lengthening the upper line a bit & shortening the lower ones. The leading one of the bottom 2 should pull the setup forward as practical.
If your lazy jacks set a fairly straight line from the spreader to the boom end then that is totally wrong. You need this to form a fairly sharp angle in towards the mast at the first hinge point.
In addition my battens are inserted from the luff so they finish flush with the leech. The OP could discuss altering the batten projection with the sailmaker if he has a problem in this respect.
When hoisting I motor 15 degrees off the wind so the boom does not hit me on the head as I stand & winch from the cabin mounted winch.
95% of my sailing is SH & life would be very awkward without the lazy jacks & sailbag.

 

[Poignard]

My lazyjacks lead up to blocks above the spreaders and then down to cleats screwed to the mast level with the gooseneck.

After lowering the mainsail, and before fitting the sail cover, I slacken them and pull them forward and hook them round the cleats.

They stay there until the next time I need to lower the mainsail, when they are unhooked and tensioned.

That way they are never in a position to snag on battens or chafe the sail.

Works perfectly.

 

[johnalison]

My lazyjacks lead up to blocks above the spreaders and then down to cleats screwed to the mast level with the gooseneck.

After lowering the mainsail, and before fitting the sail cover, I slacken them and pull them forward and hook them round the cleats.

They stay there until the next time I need to lower the mainsail, when they are unhooked and tensioned.

That way they are never in a position to snag on battens or chafe the sail.

Works perfectly.

Too much trouble. I have had boats that required me to go to the mast for most of my sailing life and am very happy not to have to any more. I have seen main covers with slots allowing them to be put on with lazyjacks in place but not been tempted to have mine changed. Care when hoisting the sail serves me well enough and I’ve seen no reason to change to a stack-pack.

There was some discussion earlier about putting the lazyjack blocks well out on the spreaders to make hoisting easier but I think the consensus was that problems with varying tension as the boom moved made this less than ideal.

 

[pandos]

I fully understand the hassle of battens stuck on lazy jacks, but having done it a few times the solution is simply timing and heading into the wind, do this, with a well lubricated sail and all works out well...trying to do otherwise for any reason is the road to doom.....

there may also be a law of physics/ nature which dictates that the wind will always blow from the direction of a fleet of optimists on a day that the sail gets caught on the lazy jacks.. so that you may need to jibe/tack/ sink several optimists or run aground prior to getting things sorted

 

[[70521]]

Lazy jacks and spinnaker socks are the work of the devil! Both solutions to problems that don't exist and instead create there own problems.

Do tell more.

I quite like the ability to drop the main straight into the bag. Much easier than having it all over the deck and struggling to flake it.

 

[Tranona]

Do tell more.

I was thinking that - usually posters at least make an attempt at providing reasons, if not a well balanced discussion for why they arrive at such a conclusion.

 

[Kukri]

Am about to fit some.

John at AAC:

Attainable Adventure Cruising

whose design I am copying, is very firm about NOT hanging the upper blocks off the spreaders.