In what circumstances should sail give way to power ?

[DAKA]

I wasnt under power either guv, I was actually cleaning my propellers by thrashing them through the water at 3700 rpm.

They were not in propulsion mode at all, they were in cleaning mode, I had a beer while I waited for the operation to complete /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[fireball]

Ah - so you were doing "tethered boating" ... or did you just fancy the pontoon that much that you wanted to take it back to your own berth! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[l'escargot]

[ QUOTE ]
...Any mobo can stick their throttles into neutral and claim they're not under power in that case.

[/ QUOTE ]
Fortunately not

(f) The term "vessel not under command" means a vessel which through some exceptional circumstance is unable to maneuver as required by these Rules and is therefore unable to keep out of the way of another vessel.

I don't think an argument that being in neutral was "exceptional circumstances" would hold up.

 

[akirk]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[Not unless the boat is being propelled by the engine, "propelled" being the operative word. A sailing boat with his sails up and engine running, but in neutral, is still a sailing boat.

[/ QUOTE ]


I think you have given all mobos the breathing space they require now:-

Based on the same principal all I need to do is knock the gear lever into neutral and hoist flag

"vessel not under command"

/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

As long as you can prove that with engine in gear it won't take you at more than 5 knots, you are prepared to have a stick put through your cabin roof and into the hull, you are prepared to travel everwhere tilted over at 23 degrees, and every time the wind blows you are happy to fold the flag in half so that it is reefed, then you can claim to be a yacht /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

The other day I was sailing through the solent and had a yacht coming the other way wanting to claim right of way over my yacht due to being on a starboard tack, now admittedly I was motor-sailing - engine on, in gear and rags flying, but I was quite surprised as he hadn't even bothered putting his rags up - not quite sure why he thought he had right of way /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[DAKA]

No that was incident 2 from thread 1.

You are mixing crash 1 from thread 1.

 

[akirk]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
...Any mobo can stick their throttles into neutral and claim they're not under power in that case.

[/ QUOTE ]
Fortunately not

(f) The term "vessel not under command" means a vessel which through some exceptional circumstance is unable to maneuver as required by these Rules and is therefore unable to keep out of the way of another vessel.

I don't think an argument that being in neutral was "exceptional circumstances" would hold up.

[/ QUOTE ]

well that is all MOBOs then (ducks and runs...)
/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[fireball]

So you were actually towing then? Thats ok - cos then the raggie should've kept clear ... unless it was his pontoon you were nicking.... which is why he crash tacked to check that it wasn't ... his pontoon that is ...

 

[Lakesailor]

Everytime there is a ColRegs thread I can wait until the 3rd or 4th page and then post, with justification, that as everyone seems to be convinced they are right, yet all have contradictory positions.

Proving once again that even in the relative peace and tranquility of the forum they are throughly miss-understood, never mind in real-time developing situations.

 

[fireball]

but we're only on the 2nd page ... well - on my screen we're only on the 2nd page ... and I'm always right..... and I'm always stand-on vessel too ...

 

[DAKA]

I think I have been trolled, again

There appears to be a conspiracy here by a group of raggies who know they dont have right of way in all circumstances and are trying to hijack this post in an attempt to conceal the truth from us considerate mobos who try to keep out of your way as it is a gentlemanly thing to do.

You know you should not stand on

when overtaking
when a mobo is moored (anchor ball/lights or not)
when a mobo is anchored ( " )
when a mobo is on your starboard side and you are under power or partial power
when you are in a narrow channel and the mobo has no safe way of keeping clear


and
you are not permitted to tack into the path of a mobo without first establishing it is safe to do so.................such as a confirmed and agreed manoeuvre by VHF or other means of recognised communication.

 

[fireball]

Ok ... we won't stand on then .... we'll sit comfortably! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[boatone]

No amount of trolling will be able to negate the provisions of the International Regulations For The Prevention Of Collisions At Sea.

Why this amazingly long thread about a topic that is not really open for discussion except by those who dont appreciate that the colregs are absolute in their certainty when they are read and understood?

 

[Lakesailor]

[ QUOTE ]
except by those who dont appreciate that the colregs are absolute in their certainty when they are read and understood?

[/ QUOTE ]See my earlier post.

 

[Major Catastrophe]

I can add some fuel to the fire. All Botnia Targas come with a option to have a sail to put on that little masty thing behind the fly bridge.

As Targas are capable of 37 knots +, if the the skippers hoists the washing and knocks it out of gear everytime he sees motoring raggie, can he claim that power must give way to sail?

 

[l'escargot]

[ QUOTE ]
...and
you are not permitted to tack into the path of a mobo without first establishing it is safe to do so.................such as a confirmed and agreed manoeuvre by VHF or other means of recognised communication.

[/ QUOTE ]
You just made that one up and tacked it on the end hoping that no one will notice! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Excellent point. IMHO, this would give you every right to go round bawling STARBOARD at every yottie you see. Ha let's see them wriggle out of this one /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[l'escargot]

[ QUOTE ]
I can add some fuel to the fire. All Botnia Targas come with a option to have a sail to put on that little masty thing behind the fly bridge.

As Targas are capable of 37 knots +, if the the skippers hoists the washing and knocks it out of gear everytime he sees motoring raggie, can he claim that power must give way to sail?

[/ QUOTE ]
No, your not having that one, when I posted this picture last year

and complained that the Mobo should have had a cone up because he was motorsailing, I was told it didn't count as it was only a staysail - you can't have it both ways!

And if you look closely in the next shot, you will see a Raggie coming the other way displaying the correct day shape, so there!

 

[Oldhand]

If a yacht under sail is overtaking a powered vessel (probably a rare scenario unless it's a super-maxi or VOR70) the yacht has to keep clear until clear ahead.

 

[Major Catastrophe]

[ QUOTE ]
If a yacht under sail is overtaking a powered vessel (probably a rare scenario unless it's a super-maxi or VOR70) the yacht has to keep clear until clear ahead.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oldhand, go and have a look at the first page of this thread and you will see that I posted details (for the second time) of a raggie recklessly overtaking me while I was observing the 5 knot speed limit.

 

[fireball]

there's a good boy ...

did you realise that (certainly in chi harbour anyway) vessels under sail do not have a speed restriction?