MoodySabre
Well-Known Member
Mag reports shown in link I gave in post #4
how well does moody eclipse 33 sail?
- Thread starter contessaman
- Start date
Mag reports shown in link I gave in post #4
contessaman
Well-Known Member
Did you or your dad ever do any work for Vickers? or was it just the pointy stuff?
my office is at 43,000 ft, is over 40 years old, has 4 rolls royce conways and is still going strong!
If only they made a yacht....
I am so confused as to what I need boat wise! Hence i'm not going to rush. You are right though, nobody actually needs a boat; its a thing of luxury that costs a great deal. Theres no point in getting a boat that one doesn't really like just because it ticks boxes on paper.
For example, I can sit and look at a swan 39 for hours on end admiring its lines and thinking how nicely it would handle. I can't say that I heard angels sing when I looked at the moody.
Equally, i'm only 29 years old and the boat I have now does not have to be my final 'dream yacht'. Theres an argument for keeping my current ride and changing all the sail handling for a roller furler and lazy jacks etc. But I dont think its worth the cost and why try to make somthing into what it is not. My boat was designed to do the RORC races of the late seventies with a crew of 6 or 7. That is not the sailing I am likely to be doing in the immediate future at least.
So there! Im so perplexed by it my head hurts. Its my fathers fault, he only ever had racy fin keelers so thats all I ever sailed.
you know; aeroplanes are much simpler
Tranona
Well-Known Member
my office is at 43,000 ft, is over 40 years old, has 4 rolls royce conways and is still going strong!
If only they made a yacht....
you know; aeroplanes are much simpler
That brings back memories. Spent a lot of time (as a passenger) in VC10s when they were new(ish). Best doing long flights say from Jamaica or Joburg back to UK as they were over 10 hours so my wealthy employer paid first class. Also the Sunday night Heathrow/Kennedy flight that started in Tel Aviv in the days of regular hijacking. No problem on that flight as majority of the few passengers were Israeli and one in three had bulges under their left armpits. Happy Days!
Back to your boat problem. I prefer old wooden boats - lots of work and weather helm but great row away factor. SWMBO disliked the boat from 30 years ago when I bought it, but fell in love with drifting around the Med 2 or 3 times a year. Bought a Bavaria 10 years ago and never regretted it as we both got a lot out of it. Fortunately can afford to have both boats, but can't remember the last time she came out on "mine".
So, if you want to keep your hand in and do something with your family you need to consider their needs more than yours, so a boat like the Moody is ideal. If it all works you will be breeding a nice strong crew so that in 15 years time you can switch back to something more demanding.
Seajet
...
Funbus
Ahh, a Funbus man !
No, we were Dunsfold, Harrier & Hawk, Dad also on Hunter, Sea Fury, and in the war on Escort Carriers, Seafires & Hellcats. He fitter / Trials Harrier crew chief, me tech' photographer ( hence handle here and JF avatar ).
Back to sailing, well as problems go, you probably wouldn't get Bob Geldof's sympathy for 'can't decide on my next yacht'...
Can't help thinking something a touch more up-market may be your destiny - Not a flash Moody interior but a top quality older style perhaps. A slightly older boat may have the seakindly qualities to suit your family, and the pedigree to suit the sailor in you ?
Have fun, great job all BTW
Ahh, a Funbus man !
No, we were Dunsfold, Harrier & Hawk, Dad also on Hunter, Sea Fury, and in the war on Escort Carriers, Seafires & Hellcats. He fitter / Trials Harrier crew chief, me tech' photographer ( hence handle here and JF avatar ).
Back to sailing, well as problems go, you probably wouldn't get Bob Geldof's sympathy for 'can't decide on my next yacht'...
Can't help thinking something a touch more up-market may be your destiny - Not a flash Moody interior but a top quality older style perhaps. A slightly older boat may have the seakindly qualities to suit your family, and the pedigree to suit the sailor in you ?
Have fun, great job all BTW
Twister_Ken
Well-Known Member
I suppose a Vancouver 34 pilot house is off the menu? If not, it's so different from your old tore out that you wouldn't dream of comparing one with t'other.
contessaman
Well-Known Member
Ha Ha! Quite right, the irony is I bet Mr geldof could afford the eclipse, a swan 39 and an OOD 34!
well, i'm off to somewhere east of here for a month now in Mr vickers creation so I will have some time to ponder my requirements!
grateful for any more thoughts or ideas when I return though.
Breezey
New Member
Hi Contessaman,
Sorry for opening up an old thread and apologies if I've broken etiquette...but I was wondering what you ended up doing? I'm considering an Eclipse for Scotland/Med/Canaries. But it will be used as a fishing boat whenever I'm on location. Did you get one? If yes I'd love to hear how you got on.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Welcome
Yes, usually better to start a new thread than drag up one that is 10 years old.
Anyway I think contessaman bought (and still has) a Halberg Rassy.
Eclipse 33 will do what you want from a sailing point of view, however not sure about the fishing bit except for the odd trolling for mackeral or jigging while at anchor.
Yes, usually better to start a new thread than drag up one that is 10 years old.
Anyway I think contessaman bought (and still has) a Halberg Rassy.
Eclipse 33 will do what you want from a sailing point of view, however not sure about the fishing bit except for the odd trolling for mackeral or jigging while at anchor.
Breezey
New Member
Thanks Tranona, I hear you on the thread point, but as it's specifically about an Eclipse, I hoped you all might give me a pass?
I just find the idea of a deck saloon for the Scottish weather quite attractive and the thread mentioned the later 38s offers an auto helm inside so sounds quite roomy.
I will fish from a sit on top yak when the weather is decent.
Thanks for replying.
Refueler
Well-Known Member
Old or recent ?? What difference does it make ... its CONTENT that matters.
Eclipse ....
Having looked over a number of them my thoughts are :
33 : Touch small for the overall design idea. But a good compromise for the 30 - 36ft brigade.
38 : To my mind is maybe where the design starts from and is a very good compromise to obtain a family motorsailer with comfort.
43: This is in my mind the ultimate Eclipse - and judging by the prices asked - market appears to think so as well. This is my choice if I had the spare dosh.
But overall - anyone going from racer / fast cruiser to such is going to be disappointed, as motor sailers are just that ... motor sailers. Regardless of whether they helm ok or make reasonable passage - they will never be greyhounds.
Fishing from one ? I do the odd bit from my motor sailer ... and its OK .. but rigging is a limitation ...
Eclipse ....
Having looked over a number of them my thoughts are :
33 : Touch small for the overall design idea. But a good compromise for the 30 - 36ft brigade.
38 : To my mind is maybe where the design starts from and is a very good compromise to obtain a family motorsailer with comfort.
43: This is in my mind the ultimate Eclipse - and judging by the prices asked - market appears to think so as well. This is my choice if I had the spare dosh.
But overall - anyone going from racer / fast cruiser to such is going to be disappointed, as motor sailers are just that ... motor sailers. Regardless of whether they helm ok or make reasonable passage - they will never be greyhounds.
Fishing from one ? I do the odd bit from my motor sailer ... and its OK .. but rigging is a limitation ...
Laminar Flow
Well-Known Member
I can't speak for the sailing qualities of the Moody, but I can, with some authority, speak on the subject of inside steering.
I had a 50' cutter with a decksalon and inside steering and as far as decksalons go it had excellent visibility. I sailed this boat some 30.000 miles and we used the inside steering once. Eventually, we put a soft dodger on the centre cockpit and then a more substantial hardtop and removed the wheel in the salon.
I have been on numerous other decksalons with inside steering and, on occasion, have done longer passages in them and it is always the same: the idea of steering the ship, and most certainly under sail, from inside a decksalon is nonsense. The visibility from inside is simply to restrictive.
Our current bit of flotation has a full, standing headroom, spacious wheelhouse with excellent 360 degr all-round vis. This is a completely different proposition, alas one which will not include your penchant for weatherliness or performance. On the other hand, my wife still comes sailing with me, regardless of the weather and we have been through some really nasty stuff. As soon as we reach open water the pilot takes over and we just relax. Our passages tend to be between 30 and 200 miles at a time.
As Tranona quite correctly points out, the conditions in which you are likely to lose the picture windows are not conducive to family cruising. We have been out in multiple F8 and a F9 gusting 10 and never had any indication that the precious glass was in any particular risk. I have crossed oceans and weathered severe offshore storms with breaking seas in decksalon yachts and never lost a window. For normal recreational sailing I think the risk is highly exaggerated (IMHO, of course)
In cruising, superb weatherliness is not of paramount importance. Again, the conditions such as you describe are not beneficial to happy family sailing. Ironically, contemporary design acknowledges that you can't have all in one package: the last test report I saw for a Pogo said it was not that good to weather or comfortable at it for that matter, but that this was made up for by it's impressive off-wind performance.
Edit: oops, just noticed I'm contributing to a historical discourse ...
contessaman
Well-Known Member
I bought a beneteau, didn’t really like it, sold it after a few years and bought a hallberg 38 and I haven’t looked back since, although maybe wish I’d bought the Slightly tweaked 382. Anyway. No regrets.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Probably still better to start a new thread laying out what you are looking for and does anybody have comments about the suitability of the boat for these purposes rather than starting from an old thread that did not answer your question. You will get more direct responses that way.
Eclipses are indeed sought after wheelhouse cruisers. Lots of 33s, but 38s and 43s did not sell well (too expensive when new) so rare as hens teeth. In common with many wheelhouse cruisers they had only a short production run because the demand at new boat level is very limited - lots of people like the idea, but few actually get to buy them, mainly because the typical 25-40% premium over similar straight sailing boats of the same size is very difficult to justify for the type of sailing most people do.
savageseadog
Well-Known Member
Look at the boat from a new perspective, you're intending to cruise not race. Forget about windward performance, don't go to windward, wait for more favorable conditions or change your plan or get the engine on. Forget light weather performance, less than 5kn? Get the engine on.
Off the wind the sailing performance will be petty good in any case
Off the wind the sailing performance will be petty good in any case
steve yates
Well-Known Member
No I prefer old threads resurrected if the content is good and relevant, which this one is. They give you perspective, and its easy to jump to recent posts if you dont want to read the old stuff. None of what was said originally is out of sate and I am glad I read it.
Refueler
Well-Known Member
Absolutely.
Refueler
Well-Known Member
In fact the 3 Eclipse models were all at a price point higher per foot than many other boats ... but despite the premium price - look at them when they do come on market .... they still command premium prices. Even allowing for sellers inflated asking prices ...
Tranona
Well-Known Member
I know, but the larger ones were up against much more serious competition from well established Scandinavian boats, whereas the 33 was still affordable and hit the sweet spot where there was little direct competition. Even then absolute sales were slow as they quickly worked through the small pent up demand. Only around 250 were built, moat in the first 4 years and it was not replaced. Most niche boats hold their prices well, although noticed that 33s have fallen in price significantly in as the reality of the costs of keeping 30+ year old boats up to scratch becomes obvious.
Refueler
Well-Known Member
My ex Wife and I were friends of the Moody's back in the real Moody days ... there was a lot of chat about their turn to more expensive builds.
I agree that you could buy a similar sized HR for not much more than a 43 Eclipse .. but I do say that the fit out and gear used on the 43's I saw and on - was good.
If I had the spare dosh - I would grab a 43 ...
Moodysailor
Well-Known Member
I'm enjoying this resurrected thread, but I have to admit my bias - we have an even older deck saloon Moody - a 44 Carbineer.
Having never had a deck saloon before this boat I wasn't sure if I would like it, but given that the two previous boats didn't have great upwind performance (one was a gaffer, the other had terrible aftermarket in mast roller with no battens...) then I haven't missed much. I grew up messing around on the water in anything and everything though, so in my mind, if I want to go really fast when sailing I'll pick up another Hobie or get a skiff & blast around in that - or just crew down at the yacht club on someone else's boat.
TBH, for 95%+ of the sailing that we do, the boat is brilliant. She is 50yrs old this year, heavy, under-canvassed & has tons of our "junk" on board, but as soon as the breeze stiffens around 10/12kts she is a joy to sail (as long as you don't want to come too close to the wind). Off wind, she is as good as most cruisers.
The comments about steering from inside are valid, but I'll only say that I'm pretty sure the idea is that you don't sail the boat from inside, but you motor sail from there when the weather is bad. We mostly sail so are outside a lot, even in light airs, but when we were caught out during a day sail last December it was lovely to leave just a slip of main up, go inside, put the Eber on and cruise in at 7kts in our T-shirts from inside
The deck saloon is also a great place to sit and watch the world go by - we've seen so much from our cabin that we would have completely missed had we been in one of our previous boats.
I honestly don't know if I'd like to go back to a "conventional" style of yacht for cruising now, my "wish list" now definitely includes a deck saloon of some description.
Having never had a deck saloon before this boat I wasn't sure if I would like it, but given that the two previous boats didn't have great upwind performance (one was a gaffer, the other had terrible aftermarket in mast roller with no battens...) then I haven't missed much. I grew up messing around on the water in anything and everything though, so in my mind, if I want to go really fast when sailing I'll pick up another Hobie or get a skiff & blast around in that - or just crew down at the yacht club on someone else's boat.
TBH, for 95%+ of the sailing that we do, the boat is brilliant. She is 50yrs old this year, heavy, under-canvassed & has tons of our "junk" on board, but as soon as the breeze stiffens around 10/12kts she is a joy to sail (as long as you don't want to come too close to the wind). Off wind, she is as good as most cruisers.
The comments about steering from inside are valid, but I'll only say that I'm pretty sure the idea is that you don't sail the boat from inside, but you motor sail from there when the weather is bad. We mostly sail so are outside a lot, even in light airs, but when we were caught out during a day sail last December it was lovely to leave just a slip of main up, go inside, put the Eber on and cruise in at 7kts in our T-shirts from inside
The deck saloon is also a great place to sit and watch the world go by - we've seen so much from our cabin that we would have completely missed had we been in one of our previous boats.I honestly don't know if I'd like to go back to a "conventional" style of yacht for cruising now, my "wish list" now definitely includes a deck saloon of some description.
