Heavy weather sailing
- Thread starter ashtead
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Wansworth
Well-known member
Babylon
Well-known member
Don't worry your V27 would survive it even if you didn't
That's exactly what I'm worried about... the dog will need the insurance money!
adzpop
New member
I borrowed a copy of heavy weather sailing from my local library ( remember them?) I was reading it in the bath, it fell in and was water damaged meaning I had to purchase the book . The Librarian laughed in my face....
Wansworth
Well-known member
was it stormy,with big waves…
Poignard
Well-known member
Were the rubber ducks hove-to?
Daydream believer
Well-known member
I wonder how many forumites have been likewise prompted to check their copy of the book. Within seconds of reading your post I looked up on the bookshelf to my side & there it was.I've got the 1975 2nd Edition (Adlard Coles), which I read as light relief during my extended divorce proceedings a decade ago...
Now, having just pulled it down from the bookshelves to check its vintage, the photo on the front dusk-jacket scares the bejesus out of me!
Mine is fourth edition printed 1991. I am pretty sure that I have an earlier copy somewhere. This one will do.But like many on this forum, I have read it from cover to cover.
Koeketiene
Well-known member
I wonder how many forumites have been likewise prompted to check their copy of the book. Within seconds of reading your post I looked up on the bookshelf to my side & there it was.
But like many on this forum, I have read it from cover to cover.
Not read all of it, but I did read all of the Boscay stuff.
Occasionally reach back to it when I fear I might be getting overly ambitious in my old age.
neil_s
Well-known member
Yes! - and the 'Cruising' sequel.
peter gibbs
Active member
You're right, techniques have evolved so careful reading is recommended. Preparing for an oncoming blow remains valid - strain on the crew should be evaluated, how long before managing them overtakes sailing the boat. Noise is a leading cause of loss of purpose, along with violent movement. The vessel is very likely to survive a blow, such is the quality of modern layup, but reducing sail early is essential before deckwork becomes impossible.
In shore sailing into the wind when at F6 is going to be almost impossible, wave action kills forward motion in sub 40 ft boats in coastal waters; offshore, with swells rather than breaking waves, progress may be possible upto F8 but with small canvas and motor assistance to maintain heading. Above 8 the vessel risks being blown sideways and losing rudder response.
Lying a'hull in a gale risks a knockdown, and is a wearing motion for crew. A sea anchor from the bow can help steady her at an angle to oncoming seas but needs practice in advance to avoid tangles and risk of injury. Heaving to has value to conserve crew and let the weather abate, but the seas will still be running for a tide after the wind reduces. Oil on the water is for the birds.
Offshore, running before may be best, with heavy warps to keep a course and take strain off the rudder. You need big warps!
You will need no canvas under these conditions, windage is sufficient.
I find most texts downplay the use of motor but have found it a positive influence on steerage when control becomes difficult. Anything that reduces the risk of crew injury is top of my list.
Chiara’s slave
Well-known member
There’s a 5th edition on our bookshelf at home, read by both of us. Not that much that’s relevant to coastal cruising on a lightweight tri. There are other books and articles for that, but still a good read.
As for 30ft boats being unable to make progress to windward in a F6, I hadn’t noticed. We do it often, and see other more conventional yachts well able to manage it too. Maybe it’s true of the type of 30 footer that is better at ultimate storm survival than us. We’re down to about half the jib and on the edge of 1 reef or 2 in the main at 25kn upwind.
As for 30ft boats being unable to make progress to windward in a F6, I hadn’t noticed. We do it often, and see other more conventional yachts well able to manage it too. Maybe it’s true of the type of 30 footer that is better at ultimate storm survival than us. We’re down to about half the jib and on the edge of 1 reef or 2 in the main at 25kn upwind.
Daydream believer
Well-known member
My 30 ft Hanse will not heave too. So I have to keep sailing. That is the one thing that I really worry about, being a single hander. My last 2 boats did it beautifully & many years ago I hove too in F9 & actually managed to sleep for 3.5 hours, due to shear exhaustion.
Streaming warps has its problems because any reverse action on the very large spade rudder would just smash it off. If I reverse out of the marina pontoons I have to do it very carefully because if I cannot hold the tiller the rudder just goes to one side & jams against the stops. I have to go forward again as I often do not have the strength to get it straight again.
I have only been in full on F9 twice in 60 years & both times in the souther N sea. If I wanted to stream warps I would be in difficulty due to lack of sea room & approaching ships. So it is not really a viable option for the typical "channel sailor".
As suggested in an earlier post, I have found that resorting to engine is a ploy that often helps.
As for sailing to windward in F6- All my boats have sailed thus in F6 & my current Hanse will certainly go upwind in a N sea "steep chop" in F8 . I have done that a few times in the Dover Strait & en route betwixt Ostend & the Thames estuary. Albeit only for up to 15 hours, by which time I have managed landfall. Remember that F8 is not just a few gusts over 34kts it is a full blown assault with gusts of 40+.
If I have to sail in bad weather I find that my Raymarine AV100 autopilot is a death trap. This means that I resort to my Aeries & that works better, the windier it gets, so in the past it has often saved the day for me. In any event I have to keep sailing.
If I was going on long blue water passages, I would be looking for a different type of yacht. But for fast passages up to 150 miles SH- which is what I do- it is excellent.
So whilst the book is an interesting read, much of it does not apply to the typical weekender/short holsmaker. In my opinion anyway. Preparation for bad weather these days really means watching the forecasts. How to deal with it when it comes is a little different in the latest AWB. Most are within landfall 12 hours away & some are in areas of heavy shipping. So avoidence strategy comes into play as well. I cannot recall if that is mentioned in the book.
Streaming warps has its problems because any reverse action on the very large spade rudder would just smash it off. If I reverse out of the marina pontoons I have to do it very carefully because if I cannot hold the tiller the rudder just goes to one side & jams against the stops. I have to go forward again as I often do not have the strength to get it straight again.
I have only been in full on F9 twice in 60 years & both times in the souther N sea. If I wanted to stream warps I would be in difficulty due to lack of sea room & approaching ships. So it is not really a viable option for the typical "channel sailor".
As suggested in an earlier post, I have found that resorting to engine is a ploy that often helps.
As for sailing to windward in F6- All my boats have sailed thus in F6 & my current Hanse will certainly go upwind in a N sea "steep chop" in F8 . I have done that a few times in the Dover Strait & en route betwixt Ostend & the Thames estuary. Albeit only for up to 15 hours, by which time I have managed landfall. Remember that F8 is not just a few gusts over 34kts it is a full blown assault with gusts of 40+.
If I have to sail in bad weather I find that my Raymarine AV100 autopilot is a death trap. This means that I resort to my Aeries & that works better, the windier it gets, so in the past it has often saved the day for me. In any event I have to keep sailing.
If I was going on long blue water passages, I would be looking for a different type of yacht. But for fast passages up to 150 miles SH- which is what I do- it is excellent.
So whilst the book is an interesting read, much of it does not apply to the typical weekender/short holsmaker. In my opinion anyway. Preparation for bad weather these days really means watching the forecasts. How to deal with it when it comes is a little different in the latest AWB. Most are within landfall 12 hours away & some are in areas of heavy shipping. So avoidence strategy comes into play as well. I cannot recall if that is mentioned in the book.
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Chiara’s slave
Well-known member
I think this is somewhere that modern designs have made progress. They may be less suitable as blue water cruisers, but that is a minority interest, and blue water boats are not as much fun when used as coastal cruisers. Modern boats sail well, some quite notably so, like DDBs Hanse. I’ve seen them go, and pretty well. My own boat really is just pushing that concept to the max. Light, powerful and fast. And surprisingly weatherly. Just not likely to be seen mid ocean.
Wansworth
Well-known member
Old daydreamers boat not being able to hove too is a bit of a bummer
dac31
Member
I think that pretty much sums the book up, make your own sea anchor and make sure you know how to use it. Strange it's also been used for centuries.
Chiara’s slave
Well-known member
Yes. Ours will, she‘s quite happy with it. Achieving it by trying to winch the jib to windward is asking a bit much, we just tack and leave the jib on the old side. It’s how we start a race. Reach down the line on port, tack onto starboard hove to, then whip the jib across with 10-15 seconds to go. Why a Hanse 30 won’t, I do not know. I’m sure DDB will have tried a few things.Old daydreamers boat not being able to hove too is a bit of a bummer
eta, we could achive it by gybing too, if it was too rough to tack.
Wansworth
Well-known member
Prolly one of these newfangled fin andskeg setups.
wonkywinch
Well-known member
This thread is another great tip for our new (to us) boat library. Abe Books have a few in stock from first editions to latest version from less than a tenner to around £35.
Abe Books UK
Don't forget to use Quidco or Topcashback if you subscribe to those.
Abe Books UK
Don't forget to use Quidco or Topcashback if you subscribe to those.
Chiara’s slave
Well-known member
Under water we are essentially fin and spade. But retractable pivot centreboard, retractable semi balanced rudder. We can reverse pretty well, though I’m very careful not to allow the rudder to get far off centre if we’ve got any speed on. I can well imagine the same issue in reverse as a Hanse, at 4 or more knots in reverse. Steering in reverse has it’s uses, if we miss stays, we can do a 3 point turn to tack. That is caused by massive helm error, or being stopped by a large wave. The sort of wave that comes with more wind than F6.Prolly one of these newfangled fin andskeg setups.
Fr J Hackett
Well-known member
It's all "interesting" stuff for winter time or lying in your bunk reading but largely if not totally irrelevant for todays sailors and coastal cruisers and boats. With todays forecasting even the odd 300 to 500 mile offshore 3 to 4 day passage will ensure that you have very little to no risk of experiencing really adverse conditions. If on the other hand you will decide to undertake longer offshore passages it is much more likely your boat will be significantly different better equipped even to the extent of being able to upload passage plans and grib files, carry and employ different equipment than the times the book was written.
As a disclaimer it must be over 20 years since I even glanced at it but when I first started sailing offshore longer ago than that, in the days when you listened to the forecast and drew your own synoptic chart or later if really up to date down loaded one from one of the meteorologic SSB broadcasts, I read it and many other tomes in preparation for that which never arrived.
As a disclaimer it must be over 20 years since I even glanced at it but when I first started sailing offshore longer ago than that, in the days when you listened to the forecast and drew your own synoptic chart or later if really up to date down loaded one from one of the meteorologic SSB broadcasts, I read it and many other tomes in preparation for that which never arrived.